Dubious charities pulling at your heart strings
Feb 03 2012
Maybe it’s just me and my own innate callousness, but I find myself wary of self-proclaimed rescues who try to solicit donations by telling their own personal sob stories. Something about hearing of their personal tragedies or misfortunes makes me question what, exactly, my potential donation is going to be used for.
When all the “rescue” talks about is their inability to send Pappa Billy-Joe-Bob off to get another tooth pulled because they put all of their money directly into the rescue, it makes me think that they are beyond incompetent. First and foremost, if you can’t take care of yourself (or your human responsibilities) how do you expect to cope with the high demands of abused and neglected horses?
How is it my problem that you can’t afford to take your daughter to dance class? That’s either a sacrifice you chose to make prior to starting a rescue or you’ve taken on more horses than the rescue can financially support. Which has consequently put you in the position of having to put in more of your own money than you had intended. Both scenarios indicate poor management skills and poor judgement. In the end, people like that end up hurting horses because they take on more then they can handle and eventually won’t be able to feed them or provide necessary vet and farrier care. What happens if there’s an emergency? I’d be willing to bet good money that people like this don’t have a contingency fund for such occasions. And when horses are involved, we all know an accident will happen sooner or later.
Rough Start Rescue, I’m talking about you.
When you feel the need to post a blog post on your website defending yourself about your fencing (and erroneously stating that, as a 501c3 rescue you “are not able to make improvements to other peoples land”) and the vet and farrier care you provide, well, then something ain’t right.
They actually took that blog post off their website because it apparently turned into quite the debate and they didn’t like all that negativity. It’s ok though, I saved a copy! Here are some highlights:
- “They have also questioned our financial ability to take care of these horse and to that all i have to say is 30 plus horse who need weight is a strain on anyones pocket book”
- “if anyone would like to see my vet bills I would be more than happy to show you as we have spent close to 5000 in vet care last year”
- “As for farrier care the horses who will allow us to work with their feet they have their feet done at least every 14 weeks some more often others longer depends how fast they grow.”
- “Others have been so traumatized that they need to be sedated so there feet get done approx. three times a year as giving them IV sedation more often than that just for their feet we try to avoid. ”
- “Training consists of getting them to trust people, to allow us to put a halter on them, to be able to walk behind them without getting kicked, to eat out of our hand and be brushed and bathed and to be handled enough not to be a danger to people or other horses. ”
*FACEPALM*
Sometimes you just gotta say ‘what the fudge?’ When you have 30 horses that you’re just working to halter break, not saddle break, only have their feet done every 14 weeks and spend a [warning: impending sarcasm] whoppping $5000 on them in vet care you’re doing something incredibly wrong. Sure, $5000 is a lot for one horse in a year. But for 30, it’s potentially negligent. Feet done every 14 weeks or a minimum of 3 times per year? That is negligent. These people either have no knowledge of proper horse care or are blatantly disregarding it. Horses need their feet done typically every 6-8 weeks. It’s true some can go a little bit longer, but 14 weeks? I don’t think so. If a horse won’t stand to have its feet done then you tranq it. It’s not an ideal solution but it beats the hell out of waiting for their feet to look like they’re wearing elf slippers. How dare you call yourself a rescue when this is your attitude towards caring for horses.
Next, and here’s where my opening rant comes into play, RSR wants to use your donations to help them buy a farm. They are currently asking for $50,000 for a down payment on 20 fenced acres, complete with a 20 stall barn and indoor arena! Well fuck. I’ve been doing it wrong! I should just become a hoarder rescue and get people to donate the money to me!
Psst. According to their facebook page, their last move was done on September 21, 2011… draw your own conclusions.
They published this post on their website on January 25th stating that they had 6 days to get themselves and their 30 horses off their current property and wanted to raise the $50k in those 6 days to get into their dream home. Uhuh. And what happens when they get the $50k and are all nice and cozy in their new farm…
… and all of a sudden they realize that they’ve taken on more than they can handle and have made the difficult decision to get out of the rescue business. One day you’re helping to get a roof over these poor horses heads, the next they’re being shipped off to slaughter and these people are running a profitable boarding operation. Ok ok, I know, no one makes money at a boarding operation! Oh right, and this is a bit of an extreme scenario and probably won’t happen. But what’s to prevent it? It could very well just be me, but I don’t feel right about people asking me to donate my money to buy them a fully set up property. Hay? Vet care? Farrier work? Hells yeah. But you want me to help buy you a place to live? Nope. Pass.
Hey look! Barbed wire! Just what we all want to see at a rescue! And this guy is listed as a “stud cold” not available for adoption…
Oh and yup, another stud.
WHY were their balls not chopped off ASAP?! There’s nothing about these horses that warrants them keeping their man-berries (sorry guys, nothing personal).
Ugh. I want to believe RSR has their hearts in the right place but they seriously need to check themselves before they wreck themselves and those poor horses! Get your shit together. Downsize the herd. Concentrate on doing what you can to find those horses quality, permanent homes – and yes, that includes breaking them to ride (I find it sad that that needed to be said). And for gawdsakes get the damned farrier out more often than ever 14 weeks!
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If the farrier can only do the feet of the horses that will let them every 14 wks; then I have to think that NONE of these speshul studs will let the vet come near them to de-jewel them. I wonder if the farrier would give them a deal to trim and castrate all in one fell swoop? OR maybe band them like sheep? Possibly they are waiting for the barbed wire to do the castrating for them. Voila! Gelding for free.
By what I have read, only a rich idiot would give money to them. Tooooo many red flags for me.
I knew an Arab breeder/eccentric heiress who banded her colts. She claimed it always worked out ok, but I’m skeptical.
It doesn’t work. It may not maim the animal but if you think about it you will see that the reasons animals are gelded is so different that what works for a species whose life expectancy is around 18 months tops and whose behaviour is largely irrelevant, will not work for a species that is in it for the long haul – sometimes 30 + years- and whose behaviour is very important. Banding leaves and animal “proud cut”- I have personal experience of a stallion gelded this way by a farmer too mean to fork out the money to have him done by a Vet. He was off the Forest (New Forest) and had served the man well, but he needed him gone. That horse was the most untrustworthy creature I have ever known, not only could he not be turned out with mares as he, literally, raped them, but he would run geldings through fences, the whole lot. He no longer knew what he was. Any proud cut horse is a bit of a liability, but if you think about the amount of internal cord the Vet takes in a routine gelding, you will see why this would not work, even if done at birth.
It has nothing to do with the amount of spermatic cord the vet removes, it has to do with the way the animals scrotums are designed. The scrotum of animals that can be banded taper to a narrow opening of only about the size of a pinky where they attach to the abdomen. Horses scrotums cover a relatively large area of the abdomin that make it impossible to get a band around the base of the scrotum. Even if the anatomy allowed for it, you would probably have to sedate the horse to do it (they tend to suck up the boys when they are handled), so it you are going to sedate them anyhow you might as well cut them. It is a lot faster and the recuperation is usually quick and easy. Also, the whole thing about “proud cut” horses is really kind of an old wives tale, and it is more likely that these horses were cryptorchids who only had the descended testical removed.
I’m not really replying to RabbitRidge,, but it’s the only way it would let me post a comment: Anyways, here goes. “Sam” Formerly of Columbia Basin Equine Rescue,, is at it again. She has now been busted, running yet another ” Rescue”.
http://www.insidebainbridge.com/2012/02/04/wa-horse-rescue-operation-suspected-of-fraud-with-kill-buy-horses-destined-for-slaughter/
Just visited their blog. They talked a lot about Contraversy (sic). Never knew there was an A in that word. I think whoever is writing the blog dropped out of elementary school to start “rescuing” horses. There are tons of incorrect words used. It is actually difficult to read.
It looks like they are sedating the horses to have their feet done since they are not able to train them properly to behave for the trimmer. I have never had to sedate a horse to have its feet trimmed. I’ve had some really nasty and aggressive horses come in that needed a lot of training on picking up their feet; they all learned to cooperate and behave in a short amount of time. I currently own a horse (a rescue) that was sedated before I got him to have his feet done. Sure, he tried to strike at me a few times, but within a week that came to a quick end. Of course there are times when a horse is in pain or has to be sedated for an emergency farrier visit, but sedation should not be the norm. The money would be better spent on TRAINING.
I’d say the bare minimum for yearly vet care would be teeth floating, vaccines and deworming. Even if you do some of your own work and get a good price on everything, that has got to be at least $250 for one horse. If you had 30 horses, that would be $7500 a year not counting emergencies or other misc. care. How are they getting by on only $5000?
There is a post on their blog that they raised $225 for the down payment on a new property. Maybe they should use that to have one of the colts gelded so he can be adopted. My advice – get rid of some horses. Nearly anyone else could take better care of these critters living behind barbed wire fences. Don’t bite off more than you can chew and then expect others to pay for your inability to self-regulate.
I know of several farriers who will require your horse to be sedated by a vet at your expense if it acts up during a routine visit. It’s a PITA, but a lot of people put up with it because most of these guys do really excellent work. I’ve got no problem with the person underneath the horse wanting to protect him/herself, but sometimes I think it gets a little ridiculous.
I also have no problem with sedating a horse for the farrier. Of course, these people seem to be using it as an easy excuse to just not provide farrier care.
You did the math that I worked through…$5,000/year is less than $200/horse, and given they are sedating several horses a couple times a year, that means the remainder of the herd is getting even less care. Which doesn’t seem like a responsible or sustainable rescue to me.
Another OMG….
Setting up a rescue when you do not have the financial means to have your own land is crazy and wrong. I don’t mean own the land outright, most of us are paying a mortgage. However, if your financial abilities are such that a bank doesn’t find you able to borrow $ to buy a place –AHEM if you can’t make enough money at your job for your own darn down payment — then your financials are not good enough to take care of 30! horses. Renting pasture is okay — as long as if the owner decides he needs it yourself you can bring the horses back to your place and care for them at least temporarily until you find another place to pasture your horses.
And quit using other people’s contribution to the world (in this case our war vets) to try to fund your rescue. If all you can do is halter train (and you have a lot of adoptable animals that are not halter trained or easy to handle!), you don’t have the skills to run a place as a rehab facility for our soldiers. What, you want to use them as free labor?
If you don’t own your own place and want to rescue — fine. Better than fine. Do it one horse at a time. Rehab it (and that means saddle training). If the horse you chose to rescue will never be suitable as a saddle horse (lame/temperament), then make the decision to euthanize and try another horse (still Much Much better than slaughter) or keep the horse and take care of it the rest of its life (also okay). We’ll still applaud you, if that’s what you need, trust me! We know what that kind of commitment means. And then you won’t get featured on Fugly.
I have been watching this mess thru CRAIGS LIST ADs. My first thought. “Oh, man this is a disaster in the making”. I believe their DREAM property is located north of Elk Washington.(IF IT IS THE PROPERTY I THINK IT IS) Let me tell you I have first hand knowledge that place is a mess. They will be BEGGING for more money to fix the problems with that barn.
I cut a WIDE path around ANY rescue in the Spokane area. Mostly they are clueless.(sorry truth hurts) They get defensive if you start asking questions. It’s MY personal belief that if you are a RESCUE you SHOULD NOT BE BREEDING THE RESCUES YOU GET IN!!! GELD, GELD, GELD. One of the many things that annoy me. They want YOU to provide a lifetime home for a crippled horse. When the rescue get “good” horses in, the ones that just need some groceries and TLC. I have found that those horses aren’t available to the public they” belong” to the rescue. (usually the owner or the kids.) I don’t need a crippled horse. I need a usable one. I am trying to do the right thing and upgrade a horse that is going to suit my needs.
There really needs to be a standard put into place. How do we get that done with out adding to the governmental BS?
pardon the typo’s.
Agreed, asking people to buy you a facility is over the top. Maybe fundraising to repair fencing or a new roof….that I could see!
I browsed the “Meet the Horses” section, seems there are more studs than mares and geldings. I will never understand rescues that don’t geld or train the horses. In some cases if a knowledgable adopter wants to taje a greenie I think that’s OK, personally I’d do tha,. but to not even try to see what the horses training level is (if at all) makes me think they are just being warehoused. If they lose their place the horses will have no better chance at an auction as they did when they got them
Agreed, asking people to buy you a facility is over the top. Maybe fundraising to repair fencing or a new roof….that I could see!
I browsed the “Meet the Horses” section, seems there are more studs than mares and geldings. I will never understand rescues that don’t geld or train the horses. In some cases if a knowledgable adopter wants to taje a greenie I think that’s OK, personally I’d do tha,. but to not even try to see what the horses training level is (if at all) makes me think they are just being warehoused. If they lose their place the horses will have no better chance at an auction as they did when they got them
Sorry about the typos…damn laptop
Rough Horse Rescue/Hoarder Central … y u no learn to spell and write in complete sentences?! And rescuing poorly is worse than not rescuing at all, so maybe just stop. Stop pretending you are a martyr, stop pretending you’re doing this for the horses as opposed to your ego, stop whining about how hard your life is (newsflash — I don’t care, because if it is so hard that you just can’t provide for the horses on your own, you shouldn’t have them).
In fact, stop being a parasite on your horses, because at this point you clearly expect them to provide for you rather than the other way around.
And wtf does “start helping or nations Hero’s” mean — are they also planning on warehousing veterans? This whole clusterfuck is like a Frankenstein creation of random catchphrases to tug at heartstrings and make me grind my molars.
Egads.
I am not a rescue, but I do rescue horses. One at a time. And put the time and care into them so they get a good home going forward. I have “saved” 7 horses thus far. Who knew that I was doing it so wrong?
What I really should be doing is scooping up every fugly in a 5 miles radius that is free on CL. And then I guess I need to start begging for funds on my blog so my current projects and I can have a sweet set-up too. There is one just down the street that would be perfect
And it’s only $1.4M too…
Life’s A Beach
http://www.36andsingle.blogspot.com/
Wish they would cap those t-posts!! Also wish somebody would buy me an indoor arena.. Though I can see how this indoor is an imperative part of their operations – with all the well-broke horses to school in it…
ok,. one more time, I went to the RSR site. The property IS the one I thought it was. The left hand side of the barn FLOODS during the spring! We are talking a FOOT of water standing in the stalls. The fencing is a joke. The house and barn SMELL LIKE CAT AND DOG URINE, it is so bad you have to cover your nose. All the animals that were brought into the barn/farm were shipped in from out of state with NO HEALTH OR COGGINS. I can only guess at what is living in the dirt there.
http://www.trulia.com/property/3071429561-315942-Highway-2-Elk-WA-99009
This is the place.
Ooooh, the house has a “jetted tub!” MY house hasn’t got one, I’ll move right in! Oh, wait, I forgot… I’m not running a horse rescue. I don’t even have ONE horse. Drat. Now I’ll actually have to buy a place like that myself.
Young studs? Barbed wire? Uncapped t-posts? Unbroke, unhandled horses? Check, check, check, check. How many times do we have to see ‘rescues’ run by indigents? Nobody with an ounce of responsibility takes on 30 horses and then begs for money 6 DAYS before they have to move! I literally laughed out loud when I read their plea for donations with the ever present note of urgency.
And shit, sign me up for 501c3 status and I’ll get right there in line for the pity party all the way to my own 20 acres and indoor arena. I’d LOVE to have me one of them! It’s hysterical how they boast that they need the arena to be able to train the horses that are currently untrained. Please! If you really want to train your horses, get off your lazy ass and forget about your website pleas, and grab a halter and lead rope. Then place it on 10 horses a day for 30 minutes each and work on leading, lunging, hoof handling and eventually riding. That’s only 5 hours! I’m willing to bet that you wouldn’t be interfering with your regular job….I highly doubt you have one. Rescues who really want to help the horses always find a way to get it all done. Shiloh’s a great example.
Me thinks me hears this story echoing out hoarder, hoarder, hoarder….
They can’t grab a halter and lead rope – they give those away with horses when they adopt them out.
I have no words….
They only need a lead rope as those halters are probably still in place from when they rescued them and they leave them on, in the t post barbwire turnout, so that they can handle those young stallions.You know you are a good person when you have to leave the halter on so that when you try to catch him you can snap that leadline on quick before he can bite you, because he has been miss handled in the past. Cry me a river please people do not own horses unless you can rehab and TRAIN and afford them. Why do all hoarders believe that they are helping when they have no funds or horse knowledge to really help resuce anything. When the next generation of foals appear they will be happy as if it is god’s will. No one should be allowed to own this many animals without having to have livestock permits and a business license and PLAN.
Well, Shiloh’s owner/director/founder is independently well-off financially. Jill doesn’t need the rescue to make a living. And she has staff and volunteers out the wazoo to take care of the basics.
There’s your difference.
I don’t know Jill or Shiloh but it’s obvious that it’s a well run rescue, money or no money. I get the impression that the most important things are the rehab and rehoming of the horses. I surely don’t see young stud colts on their site that are ‘not adoptable’. Common sense still goes farther than money alone. She runs a tight ship and I’d be willing to bet that she’s taught many youngsters all about horsemanship that they will carry with them for life. The volunteers have a lot to be proud of. There is a rescue near me that will take anything; feline, canine, equine and it’s not pretty. People should never take in more than they can properly house – and surely not be scurrying around at the 11th hour trying to find shelter for 30+ horses!! Eeeegats!
I volunteer at Shiloh. Not as much as I’d like because it’s a good clip away from where I live, but anyway…
It is very well run. It’s nothing fancy, but the facilities are safe and the horses are well-cared for. Jill and Sally are wonderful with the horses and volunteers. A lot of the horses are old-timers who were dumped for one reason or another. Those just break my heart, especially when I think of my 30-year old pasture pet. But Shiloh gives the old-timers dignified final days.
I highly recommend to anyone in the Las Vegas area to take a trip out there to help out. They are more than accommodating. Or, if you go to Vegas to party, rent a car and set a day aside to volunteer!!
You can donate $20 for lead ropes and halters because when they are adopted the horses leave with them…..just a thought – tell the adopter to bring a halter and lead rope with them! Not rocket science! Even I had enough sense to do that when I went to buy my horse at the track.
I know from personal experience of 32 horses (not mine, this was a job) that you need the farrier one day every week- there is always enough work for him /her, with big, sometimes stroppy, horses. Our farrier had a permanent forge at our place, so we could have hot shoeing done if appropriate and he could make any alterations needed to shoes properly. He was rarely idle.
At one time the dentist was also giving us a day a week, but once everything had been done to his satisfaction we were able to cut back on that.
Those horses are, without exception, far, far too skinny. And when I see hay all over the floor, about to be trashed and wasted, it sets alarm bells banging fit to give me a migraine as it is obvious that the hay has just been tossed out there, moments before the picture was taken.
I should buy them a bloody house? I should coco!
Huh, you can buy me a house if you like, I have 22 horses and am living on a pension- there are weeks when I exist on beans and baked potatoes, that is my choice, my horses are all well fed and happy, also my dogs and barn kitties.
I was taught “your horses eat and drink before you do”, this was meant to apply to when you had been riding but it applies equally to finances.
I would love to see if any of the people I am supposed to be buying a house for have ever missed a meal?
Absolutly agree – and so many of those failings are flat out bad management – which is not curable with an infusion of money.
Why 30 horses? Taking on more than you can afford is your first step to cruelty and negect – If you don’t understand that basic piece of economics you need to give up rescuing horses and try pet rats (they’re cheaper to feed)
If you can only afford a farrier every 14 weeks, learn to do your own trimming and alternate with the farrier. I don’t generally believe amateurs have any business doing this very speciallized job but this way the angles would be kept correct and any other problems seen to.
Tranking? It shouldn’t be IV (intrvenous) anyway but it needn’t be IM (intramuscular) either. Ace can easily be given orally. If you can give a paste wormer (one hopes that is happening!) you can give Ace. A very small amount (1/2 to 3/4 of an ml in a tiny syringe such as diabetics use (WITHOUT the needle) is slipped into the corner of the horse’s mouth – it dosen’t even matter if he clenches his jaw because it only needs to be on his gums or under his tongue.
$5000 in vet bills for 30 horses? Is that what you BUDGET for? Once yearly per horse for vaccines teeth and general health check is about $500 around here anyway (that would be $15,000 for 30 although I suspect it would be somewhat cheaper if it could be done in groups with savings on the actual farm call)- and one dearly hopes there are not any other vet calls but with rescue animals there are bound to be.
Altogether, this kind of outfit, with its barbed wire, ungelded colts, handfeedig(?), no attempt at training etc etc makes me sad and angry. Its one more step to the slaughter truck for those poor animals and I know that giving money will not help the horses. I try to give mine to places far more responsible and wish these people, well-intentioned as they may be would reallize they are not helpng at all – they should be giving their disposable income to rescues who DO know what they are doing, not adding to the problem.
I also checked out the link. An entry in December noted: “We have six children that range from 2-12, three of which are special needs, all of which have school funtions, scouts, dance, music, soccer and any other number of appointments that children have and where we feel the rescue is important I will not take away from our childrens well being for it.”
Okay, then.
what? Who has time for 6 kids and 30 horses?
A paying job + Six kids + 30 horses + barn and house to clean/maintain = impossible. No humanly possible, even for crazy woman Martha Stewart who claims to survive nicely on four hours of sleep a day and egg whites for breakfast, thank you very much. Unless they’ve got nannies, barn workers and a maid, something, very likely many things, are falling through the cracks.
“to be able to walk behind them without getting kicked”
Oh good. I feel better about the whole situation now.
On the flip side, I would LOVE to rescue, and I have the knowledge and ability to do so, but I don’t have the facilities. I should ask people to donate money to my rescue so I can buy 40 acres (why settle for 20?), a 30 horse stall barn, full fencing, and a nice indoor and outdoor arena. It never occurred to me to do that, but you know what? I think it’s a brilliant idea. I mean, if I really want to know whether I could afford to run a rescue, the ‘property test’ is probably a great way to find out. If no one is willing to help my rescue purchase a farm, then that’s probably a big red flag that most people aren’t going to help buy hay, grain, meds, and tack for the horses I would take care of.
I’m honestly not joking: wouldn’t it make all the sense in the world to fund raise FIRST? I mean seriously, who wants to hear, “I have rescued 30 horses, and I’m being kicked off my lease farm, so I need to buy somewhere to keep all these rescues!” Well yes, and did you have even a GLIMMER of a premonition that taking in 30 horses when you don’t own a barn might be risky? Or even, I dunno… STUPIDLY thoughtless?!
Last thought, directly connected to their statements regarding foot care. I suck at math, but 52 divided by 14 equals 3.71. Less than four. So their ‘easy to trim’ horses get done about three times per year, and their hard to trim horses get done …. 3 times per year. Lolz.
Whenever I see the phrase “stud colt” I mentally check out and the rest of the text might as well be in comic sans. And they couldn’t seem to even get that right!
Getting horses to behave on the ground and be handled isn’t that difficult. Hell, I can do it, and I’m typically one energy drink away from a four hour nap. It just takes time and consistency. Of course, I’m not dealing with 30.
WittyHorseoftheDay
I would hazzard a guess that 90% of all horses shipped to slaughter trust people, are at least halter broke, can be touched, groomed, and probably ate a cookie from someone’s hand not too long before being dumped at auction. So, these folks are taking that other unhandled 10% and bring them up to snuff with the handled 90%. Great. Now the 10% are better able to lead onto the slaughter truck. Even fuglies need homes, care, and love but it sure would make things easier on so many of these horses if they had just not been bred in the first place. It’s hard ( and expensive ) to fix the broken – in body and spirit. It takes the backing of a support group with the funds to handle it, and just having a big heart and the desire to “rescue” horses from auctions, is often not enough to really be doing a service to those being recued. I used to filp a rescue horse now and then and find him a better home, but with the current economy, my money has to go to taking proper care of my own horses. It would be very easy to let my heart over rule my check book – then everyone would suffer.
I love how after they talked about all the horses they have to sedate just to get their feet trimmed — one of the basics of horse care — they claim that their “training consists of getting them to trust people.”
Obviously they are failing at even that, if they can’t get their horses to stand for a 15-minute trim.
It’s not rocket science….who can’t teach a horse to have their feet handled in a week??
Studs, scared of people mares, barbed wire, unhanded and unbroke horses???? WTF. With all the low cost gelding clinics there is no excuse. None. Period. End of story. I could go on and on about the barbed wire etc. , but my head hurts after reading RSR’s webpage.
Reminds me too much of Sleepy Hollow (moved like every other year), except they kept their horses in small cattle pen areas when they got busted and forcefully shut down. Great another cracker of a rescue. At least this time it’s on the other side of the mountains. Have too many crazies on the other side. Anyone wanna bet they’ll be on the news soon? Stop playing the violen. Not falling for it. Shall I name RESPONSIBLE rescues? Joe at TB friends. SAFE in woodinville. Midwest horse welfare foundation. The various racehorse/standardbred rescue. What can these people do? Oh yeah. BALANCE a CHECKBOOK. Another thing they do? GELD the unworthies. So you think their so shecual they deserve to keep stallions? *holds hand out* Reg. papers? Show record? No? GELD. Do you want more mouths to feed? Oh wait than you can play the violen even more…….
Rescues need to pass that global welfare test association thing (anyone even know what I’m talking about). Can’t pass it, can’t run a rescue. Oi vey. Not looking forward to watching KIRO 7 when they get busted. WHY?!?!?!?!?! We need to buy a island and stick those idiots on it…….
Uhm did anyone else notice that only two of the horses are listed as geldings?
Also Why are the only horses broke to ride unadoptable?
A bunch of them seem to be mustang crosses….WHY? I have a feeling its because there was a stud out with the mares, because from the pictures it looks like they have them mixed. Its been a while since I have paid for a gelding but I cant imagine it is more expensive than a pregnant mare and feeding/care for the resulting foal. I am also thinking you could save the vets travel fee if you made an appointment for all them little manberries to get chopped on the same day! Crap buy the vet a great lunch while he’s there and pray he doesnt call the local AC office on you.
Please check out the poor foal here: http://roughstart.weebly.com/donate.html under “dewormer.” Click on the picture to enlarge.
Why, why, why is that poor wee bairn in the midst of a thousand horses all much larger than her, trying to get a crumb of food? That little one needs to be inside on a carefully monitored re-feeding program (maybe a milk replacer?) with perhaps a bit of hand-walking once she’s doing better.
Poor dear lass. Hope she made it.
You have a point. The least they could do is put her up in the bed of that truck they are driving through the herd, so she can eat undisturbed……
~shudders~
According to their facebook pictures she was adopted out and didn’t make it. But it’s ok because “This wonderful woman returned and immediately adopted another colt who might not otherwise have made it through winter.” This place just makes me sick to my stomach
Ugh. I volunteer for a rescue and while we don’t have a lot of money we don’t go around begging people and posting sob stories. We only take in as many animals as we can afford to give the care that they deserve, we take in a few boarders to help with bills, and work our asses of on fundraisers. We do two yearly open houses to raise money and to show off the horses, we sell food, drinks, raffle tickets, do face painting, and the rescues and boarders give pony rides. We team up with a small theater to sell tickets and do food before the show and during intermission. We do a pub crawl. We do a yard sale. We work for the money, we don’t expect it to just be handed to us. All our horses get regular trims and vet visits. We work to correct behavioral issues and when the weather is nice we ride the horses that are sound and safe, we even take some of them on trail rides to make them more adoptable. Everyone is well fed, we always have enough grain and hay for everyone. How can someone call themselves a rescue when the horses in their care are neglected?
O.o what rescue is that? I would love to check them out!
Lucky’s Legacy in Epping, NH. We’re on Facebook and our website is http://www.luckyslegacy.org
I think everyone has covered the “flustercluck” warning signs that I spotted, but I’ll throw in my observations anyway.
- The very first horse shown supposedly has Cushings. I don’t know, I’m not buying it – looks more like a simple lack of groceries to me!
- Then we have the parade of young “stud colts.” Yep, that description makes me want run away screaming right away… sounds mighty BYB. And why they hell DO they still have their nuts??? Removing them should be a TOP priority at any “rescue!”
- One of these darling colts in photo #4 has a suspiciously bulging horse standing behind him. Preggo or really bad worms? I’m sure if it’s a she and she is indeed expecting, that they “got her that way” and it’s not due to all the uncastrated males about the place.
- Love the two where she admits she doesn’t “know their training.” Wow, there’s a good way to advertise a horse AND convince people you are actually trying to place these horses!
- Whomever said this kind of place always seem to keep the nice ones – yup, that’s the case. Only they call them “therapy horses” to disguise the fact that they’re simply their own personal riding horses (I’m sure for the six kids who are “sacrificing” for the rescue in the first place).
No, I wouldn’t send these people a plug nickel (and good luck to them raising $50,000, they’ve got a great start with .0045% in the bank so far). However, I also can’t totally throw them totally under the bus: they claim to have placed 32 horses last year, which is pretty darn good, if true. The horses are not skeletons (you know we’ve seen plenty of “rescues” with FAR worse-looking animals). They’re not rain-rotted, I actually don’t see dreadful feet and the halters aren’t growing into their faces. Compared to the TBs in Louisiana, this bunch looks like the picture of health! I know – saying “things could be worse” doesn’t excuse their irresponsibility. I do hope something is done to convince them to downsize BEFORE things go that far downhill.
How about the horse that needs to be on a low or NO protein diet??? Is it possible to eat without ingesting protein? Even crappy grass hay has 10%….
It just never stops does it. Here in Riverside county, CA, we had rescues going under almost every other month when the financial collapse happened. Seems to have tapered off a bit now…
I KNEW they would be on Fugly. Our property is for sale, we have 30 acres with 2 houses for $139,990 with pastures without barbed wire and hay barn. They came to look at our property and made an offer. We declined the offer but counter offered. The person who runs this rescue came to talk to us with what they could do. I will just say they wanted us to carry a second. I told my friend that I have been reading Fugly long enough that if I agreed to this, I would get WTF were you thinking? What rescue with 30 horses is a money making venture? I know how much it costs to feed my 5 horses, I just could not wrap my mind around feeding 30 horses.
FYI that place with the big barn is listed for $350,000, which is what my agent told me.
While I am at it I will put a shameless post about my property that I am trying to sell in Cheney in case anyone is looking for a good deal on horse property for sale.
http://www.tourfactory.com/820141
I am listed with Keller Williams Reality and Annette Lewis is my agent at 509-413-2565
It’s too bad your place is on the wrong side of the state or I would be heading over to check it out…
Wow they did a really nice job showcasing your place in that add!
Whoops, I missed a good one on the Donations page: “Items the horses are in need of ….. Hay, Grain, Salt blocks, tack, two horse trailer, flat bed trailer, 30 PLUS ACRES OF GOOD HORSE PROPERTY, building materials, round pen, panels, troughs, feeders, riding helmets, hoses, tractor, hay elevator, hot walker, apples, carrots, and other horse treats.” (Emphasis mine) I love how she slipped the request for land right there in the middle! Not to mention the tractor. Uh, gee – asking for carrots and apples is one thing, honey, but what is probably $100,000 worth of property is quite another! Somehow I don’t think she’s going to have people lined up waiting to hand over a deed. :-/
No, no, no. You START with the land, the food, the gear and the financial backing. THEN you get the rescue horses.
(Although, hell, we’ve seen people screw it up even when they DO start out right… either because of mismanagement or they’re scammers. That place down in LA – I think – where those people have the sweet deal with the county sheriff and AC folks where they’re sitting fat and happy while the horses starve comes to mind. ARGH!)
“Rough Start Rescue?” O.O Clearly they’re incompetent in the marketing department too.
So, I’ve been reading the blog for a little over a month now, went back and reread all of the posts on here, but this is the first time I’m commenting (because I finally made an account). I have a few unmentioned issues with this place. First, everything they write is reminiscent of a fourth grader who failed every grammar and spelling test they’re ever had. Second, the woman is a freaking rabbit. 6 children, aged 2-12, three of whom are special needs. I’m sorry, but when you have one child with special needs, you stop trying to have children. Nothing wrong with special needs, but they take up a lot of time, and usually, the issue is genetic. Clearly something in the genes ain’t mixing properly. Einstein’s definition of insanity: “Doing the same thing over and over again, and hoping for a different outcome.” I don’t think anyone who is insane needs to be running a rescue. Or passing that insanity onto their children.
Last, in their most recent blog post (the one asking for money) they also say that the barn shown has 20 stalls. They have 30+ horses, and presumably more on the way given the state of their colts. Which ones get the stalls? I mean, only some get vet care, right? Do the others get to live indoors? Or is it the favored healthy few who get inside. And if you haven’t halter trained your horses, how much good is an indoor arena? I don’t know, maybe there is some reason, but regardless, 50,000 for the barn, and how much to pay off the mortgage payments? And to get the loans to build the extra 10+ stalls? Or maybe that’s what the indoor arena and round pen are for. Mass stalls for all the other horses.
The children thing would be like breeding two horses, ending up with a seriously genetic default in the foal (HYPP, HERDA, LWS, etc) and continuing to breed the same two horses another 5 times anyway. No different in humans than in horses, really.
You’re one of the few posters here who sees the corrolation between genetic defects in animals and humans. How long do you think it will take Mrs Duggar to be pregnant again? I watched part of a show about a family with multiple severely autistic children and all I could think is ‘why would you keep breeding’? At some point, all the care and costs of those adult children will be born by society. Isn’t it supposed to be innate nature to breed only for the strongest to ensure survival of the species? Ok, done venting!
That kind of thing drives me nuts too!!!
Also, I think that while people with challenges certainly live good, happy, fulfilling lives, it’s just kind of cruel & self serving to keep on popping out kids with severe issues, when it’s fairly certain that your children WILL have difficulties.
I doubt -very- much that only a few posters here see that link easily.
The Duggar thing is pretty sad on a lot of levels, but I admit that the most shocking one to me is the apparent disregard of one parent for the health of the other.. I can’t imagine my husband thinking it’d be fine for me to die popping out kid #21 or whatever when obviously her health is taking a hit from all this whelping. My husband didn’t even want to risk me on a second child when I had so much trouble with our first, and that, to me, is love and respect.
This ‘rescue’ is yet another example of crazy… almost nothing gelded, all fugly and untrained, and the only two marketable horses aren’t for adoption. And these people never believe they’ve done anything wrong and want to place the blame on the economy and anywhere but their own shoulders.
Honestly, it seems that the parents are special needs, themselves.
Putting the pic of the yellow horse on the front page with the gory injured leg is simply tasteless, not to mention gruesome and overt, and really sets the tone for the rest of the website.
…and I couldn’t find any follow=-up on the palomino foal, other than it was one of the second batch they either rescued or didn’t rescue (it wasn’t clear to me.)
Part of the purpose of a website, especially for an organization like a rescue, is to tell the stories. Before and after. Photos during training. A happy adoption to close. Even if the story doesn’t have a happy ending, it is helpful for potential donors to see that there is follow-through: was the palomino foal euthanized? Require many hours of intensive nursing? Now a happy, healthy two year old?
The same goes for the adoptable horses. So little information…and what is the procedure? If I’m a kill-buyer, can I just promise I’m taking them to my nice farm up north? Is there an application? Cost? Follow-up visit(s)? Never mind why anyone (other than someone interested in ACTUAL rescue rather than just collecting animals) would be interested in adopting a horse that is unbroken, barely leadable, has trust issues/scared of people, and serious health issues? Isn’t that what an actual rescue is supposed to be addressing?
As someone else said, the horses are not in bad weight or rain-rotted; I don’t think it’s a scam so much as the owners are in ‘way over their heads and haven’t the education to do the math to come up with just how much money 30 horses cost. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, and unfortunately Rough Start seems to be going down that road as quickly as it can.
Just quickly started reading their Facebook page. Top of the page:
Rough Start Horse Rescue
Im still looking for help for the move and have offerd up lunch for those who will be willing to help with horses and hay it is this saturday and sunday I need to know by tomarrow so i know how much food to order this is a great chance to help out a good cause we are a 501c3 and could use a lil help
Like · · Share · September 21, 2011 at 2:08pm ·
Alexandra McMillan *I’m, *offered, *hay. It , *tomorrow, *little. Spelling and grammar (even using periods and apostrophes where they belong) go a long way towards people actually wanting to help out.
about an hour ago · Like
That will probably get deleted but gave me a little giggle
I have wonderful friend who always wanted to have an animal rescue. As long as I have known her she has had a mengerie of “throw-aways”, but never more than she could care for on her meager income and while living on a rented property. A few years ago she married and she and her husband bought a piece of property that they are rehabbing. Now she finally has her rescue. And even though she is set up as a nonprofit, she only keeps the number of animals that she could take care of without donations. Donations just make it “easier”.
I’m still trying to scrape my jaw off the floor over the idea that they think a 14 week minimum between trims is acceptable hoof care. Jesus Christ on a crutch.
I have one who gets a scrape and a rasp every trimming, but doesn’t need it and could probably go for months on a dry lot because she wears them down well. Another one needs a trim every four weeks because of the way her frogs grow and flatten out, trapping dirt manure. The other two are well-maintained every eight weeks — all are barefoot. So my limited data shows one in four could go for fourteen weeks. If that holds true in general, then twenty-three of their thirty horses are in a world of hurt.
Most of the horses are unbroke or questionably broke so how in the HELL are they going to participate in youth programs and the Horses for Heros Programs? I call bullshit and it really pisses me off!
I came across an add a while back that I really, really should have sent here.
It was an add selling broodmares and foals, a complete herd dispersal (grade fuglies of course) all for an “amasing low price,” because they were “getting out of breeding and getting into rescue.” They were selling their own horses for barely a scrap above meat prices, so I guess they figured they’d be making better money selling “rescues.”
My thoughts at the time were: Who’s going to rescue these colts and old broodies that you’re dumping to start your “rescue” and wow… These people are stupid/evil…. I bet RSR is the same thing, just more jerks trying to cash in on the inflated prices of the rescue market. Unlike the true rescues who rescue, rehab and responsibly place their horses…
also… what’s with that poor baby on the header with the wide open, dirty wounds on its legs! and you know all those poor potbellied mares are prego… some rescue!
Years ago, that was a pretty nice place if it is the place I think it is..
While I agree with almost everything you said about this place, I’d like to point out that a horse that’s barefoot, starting with balanced feet, and lives in a good balance between exercise and wear for its personal circumstances could well need the farrier only three or four times a year, particularly if the owner is handy with a rasp.
Horses that are shod need resetting every 5-6 weeks in my experience (at 6-7 weeks my horse became uncomfortable with the length of his back feet; it happened a few times due to lack of farrier availability until I worked out what was happening and booked him on a strict 5 week cycle). Horses that are stalled or kept in small paddocks, horses kept on soft ground that don’t move around much – they all might need additional trimming (the stalled horse inevitably will IME) – but if your barefoot horse has good feet and good conformation (so his feet wear evenly), you’re not negligent to call out the farrier once in a blue moon as long as you keep an eye on his feet and, as I said, run a rasp over them now and again if necessary.
I don’t think that’s what these people meant – they don’t appear to be able to train a horse to lift their feet, which isn’t rocket science for most horses, even abused ones. What alarms me is not the frequency of farrier visits, but the one-size-fits-all ness of it: I expect any owner of more than two horses to grumble that their horses ideally need different schedules, and how hard it is to coordinate. With thirty head, I’d expect the farrier to come out every 2-3 weeks and to do _somehing_: they’re big enough to set up a regular slot with their regular farrier and have horses ready for him, even if it’s only for a quick check. And if they’re a rescue, I expect them to have a number of horses from bad situations that might need to be taken down gradually, so that the farrier comes out every week and you trot up Dobbin and he advises you whether to do further work or give it a rest.
I cannot imagine running a rescue without close collaboration with a vet and a good remedial farrier. Maybe that’s one of the questions you can ask to weed out the wannabes from the ones that know what they’re doing.
(And in case it needs to be said again: loose barbed wire: ack-spit. That’s a create-your-own-emergency kit.)
Ah, I see. People like this are why the term ‘breeder’ is often used as a term of abuse. They don’t know when to stop breeding themselves – why would they know when to stop breeding animals? I truly loathe people like this. All they do is add to the sum of misery and neglect in the world while patting themselves on the back for being such great people for ‘caring’ for their messed-up animals and shitting out endless children who probably don’t really get the care and attention they need either. Certainly if you’re begging for funds, someone’s getting neglected and I know that in familial settings, animal neglect correlates with child neglect in nearly all cases. This is what happens when the uneduated and yet curiously still smug (I suspec a hefty dose of religion has something to do with this – the badly-parsed self-righteousness, the beggery and the breeding smell of uneducated Jesus wheezers to me) glom onto fancy new ideas like ‘rescue’. They’re too dumb and lack to will or ability to learn to do it properly but they have enough low cunning to extract dollars from enough bleeding hearts to make it a worthwhile lifestyle for them, as usually they don’t have the ability to hold down a job, let alone one that would pay enough to support them and their passel of darling childre, whom they care for so much they keep adding new ones to the pile.
*slow clap*
Yep… Definitely classic Ugly Americans who demand their rights (loudly, and often) while eschewing responsibility.
Where did we go wrong?
Including the Paint stud colt you pictured, I counted 4 stud colts,, two year olds.
The only rescue I trust in Wa is SAFE.
Second Chance Ranch has been foreclosed on and is begging for a place. What a nightmare moving job that will be she cant even load a horse without communicating to it and they will all tell her they are scared to leave *snort*
Then we have the idiot at Emerald City Thoroughbred Project in Cle Elum who can afford to go visit Heart of Tucson to see the poor crippled horse they are tormenting because ” he isnt ready to go yet” and a week later ECTP cant afford fence tape so they beg on FB WTF?
So I give to SAFE where I know they are taken care of receive training not just hoarded.
Funny… I worked for an ACTUAL 501c3 non-profit (and there were days when I had my complaints about limited budget and horse overload) and we NEVER ran into issues like these people claim to. I took one look at the fence and the condition of the horses and had to x out of their site. Makes my stomach turn. Poor horses.
How about when your “donations” go to help a breeder (of mostly crap) in Texas get hefty asking prices for his starved out and “oops didn’t file the papers on any of my foals the last three years” horses? Just check out http://www.wix.com/fortheloveofahorse20/save-tx-horses . They are collecting donations (that are sent to this gal’s personal paypal account, yup, PERSONALl paypal account) to help buy these horses at $1,000-$2,500 a pop and to buy him hay. Now, Mr. Hammond owns 1,000 paid for acres, a nice setup and drives a shiny new truck (all facts available to anyone willing to do the research), but has posted horses for sale all over the internet that look like hell, so obviously he sees nothing wrong with it. Even his studs are ribby in every pic. Me thinks that he doesn’t care, so why is there a website set up to take donations to save his horses at ridiculous prices? When he is just going to make a whole bunch more? Sounds fishy to me…
Thirty horses on 17 acres? Are they nuts? Yes, probably. Figure some of that acreage is under the house, the barn, and the front lawn and driveway, so are we talking probably about 10-12 acres of useable “pasture?” Sheesh…and they want a hand-out? Nope, not from me.
See what I mean?? They want YOU to GET the CRIPPLED ones, they will keep the broke nice ones! Sheesh, you don’t know the first rule of running a rescue? ……….THOU SHALL KEEP THE GOOD ONES AND PAWN OFF THE ALMOST DEAD CRIPPLED ONES….
Lol, I crack myself up..
The kids may all be hers by birth but my initial reaction was that she may be fostering them. Some families foster kids as their major source of income. She just strikes me as someone who expects others to fund her kids, animals, etc.
I wonder if all the pic. on their page are “theirs”, some of them just seem familiar. Since they have to move foaling mares inside they are obviously letting some of these charmers breed. As if they don’t have enough work to do and money to shell out? I will say their horses (as listed as their horses) look well fed and healthy. Why do they have to move? And even with $50,000 downpayment that still leaves a hefty mortgage every month. Why don’t they find some land with a tiny little house out in the middle of nowhere and get that for what they can afford? Oh, that’s only for the rest of us who have to pay the bills ourselves.
3 of their own kids, 3 fosters or adopted special needs kids and 30 horses that are pretty much useless/unadoptable as is. Oh yeah and apparently soon no home! These people need to focus on one thing at a time!!
Speaking of bad rescue, or just plain fake scammers in general, Sam and her faux feedlot rescue is being exploited again.
http://www.insidebainbridge.com/2012/02/04/wa-horse-rescue-operation-suspected-of-fraud-with-kill-buy-horses-destined-for-slaughter/
How I wish she’d just go away. She lies, kills horses AND steals people’s money. Can you get any lower than that?
$am once again gets under someone’s skin with her scams. This one should be archived on fhotd as this site opened the public’s eye to the real $am. I find it discouraging that she’s still in operation. She must scam a lot of dough out of people’s pockets to pay off an attorney and keep her sorry excuse of a life out of jail.
The Rough Start Horse Rescue site now says that she bore only 3 of the children. If you read the comments, someone who says she is a volunteer says that 20 of the horses came from a state seizure. The D.A. asked them to take the horses and the state veterinarian is providing some veterinary care, hence the low veterinary expenditure.
I’m not saying there is nothing wrong. Barbed wire and uncapped T-posts are a problem, especially with horses that are not gentle. They probably should have taken only half of the seized horses. I just think people should try to avoid getting carried away with making assumptions.
I could make assumptions about the email Snarky Rider sent about featuring RS on their blog, but I will wait for them to explain.
O.T. : Will there be TWO Budweiser Clydesdale commercials during the Super Bowl? Adweek (http://www.adweek.com/news/advertising-branding/ads-super-bowl-xlvi-adweeks-preview-137813) says in describing the Anheuser-Busch InBev ads, “Two sweeping, historical, connected :60s for Budweiser by Anomaly, with the Clydesdales”. Does that mean that the Clydes will be in both ads? That would be quite a change from threatening to leave them out altogether two year ago.
Why can that woman not be stopped? Surely no-one is still taken in by her?
Rough Start horse rescue is just getting started folks. Several rescuers in the area including us are helping them find and get financing for a permanent home.
Those photos were a temporary home option only. There will be no barbed wire in the new farm.
Fault them for their “bad” marketing but please do not slam a charity that is in its infancy. They have their 501(c)(3) tax exempt status going and are doing it right with a ton opf volunteers who feel we need them doing what they are doing, helping homeless horses instead of shipping them all off to the auctions.
They take excellent care of the horses. They are fed, worked and well loved. The whole family works the horses.
A farrier only needs to come every 14 weeks because Jay is also trimming hooves and doing a darn good job of it. None of the horses in their care are in danger. Quite the opposite.
Yes, some of the things posted on the web site made them look bad so others like us asked to have some stuff removed. That is just folks who do not realize how things can be taken out of context especially online.
Jay is ex military so web site development for him and his wife is not their strong suite. He is working the horses and trying to get the web site to look and be more professional by asking for volunteers so it can truly reflects their care in horses. There are only so many hours in the day though and working horses and horse care comes first. So the web site is not a work of donating art yet. Frankly I would love it it were removed soi they could garner some more donations.
But it is their rescue and they are wonderful folks who saw too many starved horses out there and are helping, not hurting.
But I do hope they take this blog with a grain of salt once I send him a link. Why? Being insulted or put down or criticized by people who do not know them nor have they seen the horses in their care means little. The criticicizms can only help them learn from their mistakes. I know them well and I applaud their efforts and still dislike their web site. But we are moving them forward and getting them off the ground so we can save more horses in the Spokane, Washington area.
Good folks and I can not say that enough. So thank you for your honest opinions and this blog will help me make them understand that not everything needs to be shared online for others to smack them hard about it. I also know that people will always be the first to tear down instead of offering constructive criticism to help them grow stronger and be a rescue we so desperately need in this market.
So here is one person who adores these folks for what they are doing and with your help we can get their web site up to speed! Thanks for that.
Pleas revisit them in a couple more years. We will have recruited folks with different and better skills such as a more professional web site development so they can look as good online as they do in person.
And if anything happened to us then I would hope they would be some of the first people called to take care of all our horses.
Trouble is, in a couple more years, half those horses will be dead and the rest will be pregnant!
Stop enabling people like this- why, just think about it, now, why would anyone, in their right mind and in this economy, buy these freeloaders a house?
You want to do something really good?
Go help a rescue that is already established and whose results we can see.
Do not go on Facebook begging for people to help you clear up a mess of your own making.
I have 22 horses- perhaps you would like to contribute to their winter hay, or buy me a house with an indoor arena and twenty stalls?????
That would be nice.
You need to get real.
The condition those horses are in you are not , NOT rescuing them, you are enabling a disaster waiting to happen.
All those “stud” colts?? All those unusable , and unused, horses? None of the ridable horses available for “adoption”- what about this seems right to you?
There is not one single thing about this website, or the people, or the wording, or anything else, that says “reputable charity worth supporting” to me.
How they got charitable status is totally beyond me- it must be one hell of a lot easier to get it in the States than it is in Europe, is all I can say.
If you are truly a horse lover you should be helping to get this stopped not enabling them further.
mdmossburg runs her own “horse and dog rescue” type thing and currently has a Morgan stallion standing to any breed, says some of the stud fee’s are used to support her rescue animals, so in my opinion anything directed towards her about supporting RSR would be better directed towards a brick wall. Just saying
Odd if Margo truly is part of this rescue she doesn’t know that they ARE 501c3 registered but oddly are not registered in WA as a charity….. (Margo said “in the works”)
EIN 27-3220112 Rough Start Horse Rescue Corp
So are they legal to collect donations in WA state? I believe they can up to $25000 but I am sure Margo would know more about that.
To clarify – they are a 501c3. They are registered as a non-profit in WA. They are not registered with the Charities division in WA which would allow them to solicit donations. Hopefully they get this rectified soon.
My guess is that you spend little to no time at all with RSR AND their horses because if you did you would know that they spend VERY LITTLE time with the horses, they don’t work with them, if the horses are lucky they might pay them some attention once a month and thats pushing it. You would also know that nearly every horse they have needs it’s feet done not just one or two horses, vet care is extreamly limited at best because they think they know whats best and can fix it on their own. As people, ya they are nice people, but so was Charles Manson and John Wayne Gacy. Just sayin…….
Thanks GiddyUP – I haven’t seen the horses this year (2011) and am going by someone else who saw them. Perhaps they had some of those rose colored glasses on.
Please keep an eye on them and prevent them from creating another disaster in Spokane.
If the rescue is in it’s infancy, why did you take on 20 horses? It is your fences, not your website, that you need to get up to speed.
WTF?!
I rescue on a small scale (only taking in one at a time, because that’s what I know I can responsibly care for) and I found some of the points from their post were ridiculous!
Firstly, they say that the ‘training’ includes teaching a horse to eat from their hand, but apparently doesn’t involve teaching a horse to stand for the farrier? I can understand maybe ONE horse, very rarely having such profound issues with farriers that it needs to be sedated – but that should be a onetime issue, as soon as the horse comes into the rescue and then by the next time the farrier needs to come out (which is 8 weeks, not 14!) the horse should stand. I’ve taken in some horses who were real brats about their hooves. When we first got my boyfriends mare she would hop around trying to get her foot away from you and yet, we never needed to sedate her. With some time she learnt that she is required to stand still and she behaves very well with her hooves now. Then there was another mare that kicked my boyfriend in the ankle THAT many times in the first week that we lost count. She had issues with her back hooves, but what do you know? We worked through that pretty quickly. My gelding wasn’t the best with his feet when he came here, but now he’s good with them. RSR – here’s the secret. You go down a minimum of once daily if the horse DOESN’T have issues, twice if they do and you pick up their hooves and persist until they stand nicely and let you hold it up for a while. IME, that fixes the issue pretty fast. Having to sedate a horse for a farrier visit is NOT the norm!
Now, their vet care. Potentially possible – with extremely good luck. If nothing went wrong with any horse for a whole year and the vet charged a reasonable amount for teeth and vaccines (say, $30 for a vaccine and $100 for teeth) then that adds up to $3,900 per year. HOWEVER, as a vet is the only one who can sedate horses and it seems that this is a routine thing for RSR, you then have to factor that in, along with travel costs each time the vet comes out. That is getting pretty close to $5,000 I would imagine and that’s without the vet needing to come out for anything other than routine care. I find it a little hard to believe that with 30 horses everything runs smoothly and nobody ever has an accident, especially when they are fenced in with such great wire! *snort*
Speaking of the fence, why would they start a rescue at a place with barbed wire? This is not rocket science. It’s dangerous, more expensive than straight wire and can kill a horse. Geez!
As for 30 horses needing weight being a strain on anyone’s pocket book – NO! If you take in 30 horses, then you should have enough money to easily care for 30 horses. You don’t take in more than you can afford and then rely on donations. Before rescuing, you sit down, work out how much extra money you have after everything is paid off and then you figure out how many horses that will EASILY support. If you figure you budget can just, maybe, soughta look after 5 horses, then you only get 3 or 4. You absolutely do not push your resources, because if something goes wrong (like the horsies get tangled up in the barbed wire fence that you shouldn’t have) then you are going to have a big ass vet bill you can’t afford, because you have too many horses.
While I’m ranting, WHY is it that these ‘rescues’ never train horses to saddle? IMO that comes under ‘basic education’. You don’t need to teach them anything fancy, but at least train them to the point where they can be ridden around a paddock or taken on a trail for fun (unless they are unsound or too young, of course). As soon as my rescues are out of QT I start working with them on lunging, ground driving, tacking up, and then when they are ready, we ride. I’m in no way going to produce world champions, but the average rider can throw a leg over and have a decent time.
Those “stud colds” are hideous. They have no business remaining intact and they have no business rescuing so many horses, when clearly you aren’t putting in the appropriate amount of time or care or training into them.
Buying these guys a facility? Haha, I really hope nobody is stupid enough to do that!
http://www.operationhorserescue.blogspot.com
These are wonderful folks trying to get this brand new rescue off the ground even this economy. Those photos were in a temporary home and they have since moved.
Lots of folks here are helping to get this rescue off the grounbd including us because these are good folks with a bad web site. The horses are worked, fed and in great shape. If anything happened to us I would hope that Jay would be one of the first people they called to take care of our horses!
Thanks for the feedback and I hope to use all these criticizms to improve their web site to be as professioanl as the folks at Rough Start are in person.
And yes they have their tax exempt status in the works to be a legit rescue!
Margo
Dragoon Morgans and Director, Dachshund Rescue NW since 1991.
Too funny – 501c3 makes you legit! Really? You sure Margo? Remember you can keep your 501c3 even after you have no animals or you are convicted of animal neglect unless someone reports it to the IRS. AND keeps after the IRS to pull the status.
Please excuse Mrs. Mossburg for her typos and poor writing skills. They have never been her strong suit – but venom in email or webposts have been. Also posting un-truths online.
She is one of no action. I bet you she hasn’t even visited this place. Or rather places they have rented. For a supposed “professional photographer” she has some very average photos and NEVER volunteers to take pics. Nor to assist in training – she is supposidely a good horse trainer.
I know Kelly and Jay live no where near the pasture they rent (have rented). Red flag.
I know they don’t have extra money for all these horses. Red flag. Never figured out how they could afford the first 7 they bought.
They are pretty good with horses but have that “we need to save them” attitude because in Spokane/Eastern WA there is no one. Even Margo contributes to the overpopulation with her average looking stallions.
I haven’t seen Kelly ride but Jay can do the typical breaking. Not cowboy but gentle (no funky Parelli crap here). But with that many to do and work a full time job – no wonder they can’t get to them all. Saw him handle several in a field but would have loved to see him in a flat arena or seperated pasture setting.
Kelly and some of her volunteers can do halter training and do. They really should list that. Even her kids are getting to be good horse handlers but I hated seeing the younger ones handling colts – they were way too gentle. Colts were needing some reprimand and didn’t get it.
Jay does a nice job with trimming hooves so they should have put that on their site. They seem to forget that the web can be your friend or your enemy. And never piss Fugly off. Plus don’t hide. But don’t spit venom out either.
Now I am not sure why no one with land has started and kept a rescue. The only one in the past 10 years tried then booggied out of the county when people started pointing fingers that the care was sporatic (God forbid people ask AC to investigate). We have great animal control so I do worry that RS is starting to look outside the county. Big red flag when people move out of AC controlled areas. Right Margo – gets you out of having to be inspected and paying for a kennel license.
Sorry I digress.
Although there might not be many Fugly followers who live in the area, if you do, please pay them a visit and see if you can join a horse rescue that needs help to become something that this area needs.
I have donated what I can (when they started) but alas run my own rescue (not livestock) and cannot contribute anymore then I have. I cannot sacrifice mine for theirs.
Side note – on $am and her feedlot sales. Funny how they always bring up about some past rescue she was with that she was only a BOD on paper. She never controlled that place, just shipped stock there that she bought for $25 to $200 a head. Unless they were draft then they were about $300. Everyone sidesteps all the horror that was CBER. About the tens of thousands of dollars taken in. Horses switched. There is a ton of evidence but for some reason they left out those years in the articles about her. Remember the horse drug in the mud by the tractor? Remember Blind Dog rescue getting a horse of the opposite gender? It goes on and on.
Good luck Rough Start – I hope you use Fugly’s site as a guide to help you improve.
>>And yes they have their tax exempt status in the works to be a legit rescue!<<
I have to step in at this point and state that a tax exempt status does NOT make one a legit rescue. So was CBER, HMER, Cajun Country, just to name a few.
Real rescues would be gelding those little stud colts as soon as they hit the right age in order to prevent the breeding of yet more animals in need of rescue.
Their sheer lack of oversight in housing these animals in barbed wire fences alone is enough to make me decide that this rescue is not very knowledgeable about equine care. Most people with a modicum of sense would stay within their means to house animals safely and no chance of accidental oops pregnancies. A tax exempt status does not confer legitimacy, actions do. Anyone can hoard horses–the true test of a rescue comes with handling them safely, training them, and providing them with the option of a future.
I couldn’t even look at most of that website without my head exploding. I clicked on all the top links, and couldn’t find a single horse bio or success story, or even a horse up for adoption. Even if you are bad at teh internets, shouldn’t the horses of a horse rescue be the first priority? I saw pages of buttons going GIMME GIMME GIMME though.
Then my brain kinda shut down after seeing “farrier care every 14 weeks” for the well behaved ones. My arabs need theirs done every six weeks–sometimes in six weeks the eldest already seems like she is on platforms–and mind you, this was true even when I rode her 10-14 hours a day, six days a week. And she was barefoot. On paved and dirt roads, and anywhere else we could go. (I know I brag–but it’s so hard to find a horse with good hooves anymore. Even when she was young twenty years ago.)
The family appys have crappy feet, they can go longer, but still need trimming much sooner than 14 friggin’ weeks. How long have they had these horses that aren’t good to have their feet handled if they say they only get trimmed 2-3 times a year?
I’ve taught a few that were nasty about hoof handling, included a walker that had been sored and didn’t want it to happen again. It doesn’t take years if you work with them regularly.
Thirty at once is a lot for any sane person to handle though, which is why a new rescue shouldn’t start out with that many. The county dumped most of them on a brand new rescue on rental property with barbed wire? Really? They must have been desperate to unload those animals.
Someone (forgot your name–sorry!) posted that they were trying to dump broodies and breeding horses, I wonder if the pregnant ones and studs were theirs before, and are now being classified as rescues.
Did anyone find any success stories at all from these people? That can be confirmed (horse alive, well cared for, etc.)?
(Resubmitted0
Well, I do hope she appreciates the letter I sent, giving my assistance with her English and grammar. Am I evil? Tee hee…
To whit:
To the writer of the above passage:
Following please find my edit of your letter, with spelling and basic grammar corrections made. At the end, you will find a few easy suggestions to avoid these errors in future postings. Good spelling and grammar can make a world of difference in how you are perceived by those you are trying to reach. You will find your original comments, followed by my edits preceded and closed with an asterisk (* — *).
——————
We appreciate the kind words that we have recieved from the community over recent events.
*We appreciate the kind words that we have received from the community about recent events.*
We continue to take the position of no negativity or mud slinging, because this is how we have decided to deal with this we have taken down the blogs and comments that were left on them.
*We continue to pursue a policy of no negativity or mud slinging. Because this is how we have decided to deal with this, we have taken down our blogs and the comments that were left on them.*
Thanks to all who have decided to stay positive with us. We do take what has been alledged against us seriously and do to the nature we will be seeking advice on the best way to respond to the allegations, until then we have ” no comment. ”
*Thanks to all who have decided to stay positive. We do take what has been alleged about us seriously. Due to the nature of these allegations, we will seek advice on the best way to respond. Until then, we have no comment.*
Please do not take our silence as an addmission of fault as we do not agree with any of the allegations on the websites ************.com or ********.com we however are not going to give them free advertising either.
*Please do not take our silence as an admission of guilt. We do not agree with the allegations.
We appreciate all our volunteers at Rough Start and appreciate the hard work and time you put in, both in the way of physical labor and donations we are truely blessed to have such caring and loving people associated with the rescue.
*We appreciate all of our volunteers at Rough Start, both for the hard work and time you put in and for your donations. We are truly blessed to have such caring and loving people associated with the rescue.*
As this issue is concluded I will update on our position and if anyone has any comments or questions they are welcome to contact us privately as this site will not be used as a forum to “air ones dirty laundry and personal grievances”.
*Until this issue is concluded, I will provide updates. If anyone has any comments or questions, please contact us privately. This site is not to be used as a forum for discussion of these issues. Thank you.*
You can quote me on that.
*Gosh, really, I suggest not.*
———————————-
Quite seriously, and in a spirit of helpfulness, the passage as written is nothing one should want to be quoted. I sincerely suggest that, at the very least, you use spell check with grammar checker! Six of the above errors were highlighted by my spell & grammar checker. This is a great tool, and will even give suggestions to correct the errors. Those who have been too occupied by other things to learn the finer points of spelling and grammar can benefit greatly from even this small assistance.
In addition, I urge you to watch out for run-on sentences. If you’ve already got one or two commas in a sentence, consider a period. If there is a change of direction, of topic, or of emphasis, do consider a period. It makes it much easier to understand; I had to read some of these run-on sentences twice to be sure what was intended.
With hope that this was helpful,
Respectfully yours,
The Footloose Horse
———————-
Well, maybe not *evil*, but it gave me a chuckle. It’s not anywhere close to what I would write, but hey, I didn’t want to overwhelm her!
Seriously! If these people were teaching reading and writing to these horses I could understand your concern. However, they are not, and your post is only a distraction and opportunity for you to get on a soap box instead of posting something that is actually beneficial to the issue at hand.
Ok, since your comment wasn’t a reply to another comment I’m assuming you’re talking about the post itself and not the comment prior to yours. In which case I feel the need to point out that no where did I call into question their grammar or spelling. My post centered around providing adequate vet and farrier care – oh and about not grievously injuring the horses you’re trying to rescue (I can post pictures of barbed wire injuries if you want!). Assuming the issue at hand is the horse’s welfare and not someones hurt feelings, then I feel pretty good about the points I already made. However, if you did mean to hit “reply”, then kindly disregard this comment.
Anyone know anything about the “Golden Carrot” senior horse rescue in California?
They were featured in a couple of blogs (one really well known one) and it seemed all was well with this rescue until a closer reading of the rescue’s OWN account, reprinted in the well-known widely read blog, of the death of one of their rescued horses mentioned that they left the horse down in the pasture for several days with no apparent vet care–what they were writing about was how the horse’s loyal buddy stood guard over the downed horse and “wouldn’t even come in to eat” because he didn’t want to leave his friend who was dying. That got my attention. Leave an old sick horse down and dying for several DAYS? WTF is WRONG with people? And this is a rescue??? And they want money to do this??? Maybe their own online post about this was just poorly written and misleading – maybe – but it made me think twice about donating – which I was about to do based on one blogger’s “glowing” report of this rescue organization – and I definitely decided that any rescue which would leave an old, sick horse to die unattended and over the course of DAYS did not, frankly, deserve any donations. If it was just bad careless writing doesn’t that, too, indicate they might be careless about their rescues? If it was really true, then they do not have any business running a rescue or having any animals under their care or control!