Montana, Comments and Insults
Sep 16 2011
“…my impulsive behavior and well behaved horses who can cope being tied to a tree overlooking their deck for a day or two.”
-I can’t tell you how sorry I am to see this written by the new commentator of this blog. Horses require near continuous movement to maintain the physiological function of the digital cushion in each hoof and to maintain optimal gut mobility. Are you even aware that horses need to lie down every day? If their lead rope is long enough that they can lay down, you create a dangerous situation that could result in broken bones or death as they struggle in a too long lead rope.
I used to work as a professional guide in Shawnee National Forest, a huge horse camping area. I spent as much time helping horse-idiots resolve the problems caused by tying horses to trees for extended periods of time as I did guiding. Anyone who knew ANYTHING about horse physiology either brought a collapsible pen or rented a pen so their animals could avoid the stocking up, mechanical founder, colic, exhaustion, etc. that is so common with horses who are immobile for extended periods.
Do you know anything about horse physiology? Have you even heard of the digital cushion?– angry commenter
I’ve got a confession to make. Under the advisement of a blog author – who shall remain nameless- with much more blog experience than I, the comments have recently been moderated.
The theory is to keep the blog on track, without falling back into the out of control mess that almost closed FHOTD down a few years ago. So, any personal attacks, insults, or wildly off the mark comments aren’t posted.
I recently ignored a comment loaded with lots of vitriol and heavy with insults. When the writer wrote back asking me how I dare not print her insults I laughed my manaical, control freak laugh and began to hit the delete button.
BUT! She had a point. There was a valid question buried in amongst all her dire threats and assumptions about my education and intelligence. So I printed the question, minus the insulting crap.
I will try to print everything that matters, I really will. It just depends on how much shovelling I have to do to get to the heart of the matter. So lets take a look at her input and go from there.
In the mean time, here’s a video of my week in Wyoming and Montana.
133 comments to “Montana, Comments and Insults”
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Sorry if this is a really stupid question, but if you begin moderating comments or deleting them, does that make you vulnerable to legal action?
I thought that was the reason FHOTD posted everyones comments – I kind of figured that if some people’s comments weren’t posted that it was an issue with freedom of speech or something. I’m a blogin novice though, so I’m quite ignorant of the way this kind of thing works – that’s just how I thought it worked.
Btw, I think you should leave the nasty comments. It makes it kind of fun – lots of controversy lol.
Hope your holiday is going well.
http://www.operationhorserescue.blogspot.com
@LadyandSugar
I didn’t see a comment in response to yours yet, so I hope I can clear up a little confusion. Freedom of speech and freedom of expression are rights protecting you from the government, not from private citizens. Congress can’t make laws like “you can’t say anything mean about the president…or troll an internet blog.”
However, a blog owner has control over the content they publish. Imagine having someone over for dinner at your house. You can tell your guest not to talk about politics, or horses, or hairbrushes if you want to. They can play by the rules, or you can ask them to leave. It works the same way on a blog.
Thank you for clearing that up. I just figured that because fugly was a paralegal she allowed all comments for a good reason- to think I’ve been letting people growl at me for saying mean things about their animal abusing friends, lol.
http://www.operationhorserescue.blogspot.com
A person can do anything she wishes with her personal blog including censoring comments. There’s no way it can be against the law. If you don’t like it, don’t post/read said blog.
Honestly, the censorship on this blog and the whole idea of needing to approve all comments beforehand is one of the reasons I hardly every read/comment here anymore. In my opinion, it wrecks the discourse because you have to sit around waiting to participate in the discussion. By the time my comments got approved and posted (which usually took a very long time considering the sheer number of comments and how busy Fugly was on other things), I already moved on to something else.
If you want to censor the blog, why not come up with rules to automatically censor posts and get rid of the ridiculous need to approve all comments? For example, one very successful commenting enabled site I enjoy – Fark.com – has posting set up where any swear words are automatically changed to unoffensive versions (i.e. biatch, shiat, fark) and if someone posts something that is deemed offensive, members can flag posts which can later be deleted or edited by moderators. And posters who break the rules receive punishments like being unable to comment for a certain period of time.
Whats the point of having a blog open for discussion if you’re not going to allow said discussion to take place organically?
Ugh. NO. Autocensors are a horrible idea. They have no grasp of context and often block or mutate things that are completely innocent.
The word ‘bitch’ is actually the example I normally use. If I use that word, nine times out of ten…I mean a female dog. Human moderation is much better…and I’m not noticing massive delays now somebody with more time is handling the blog.
LOL in the computer science world we have one word for that: “clbuttic”.
Comes from people who wrote software to “change” swear words into something inoffensive leading to mistakes like “Classic” showing up as “clbuttic”, or “title” turning into “breastle”.
Just an FYI sugar, fugly version 1 moderated EVERY comment, I myself and several others had logical and educated comments deleted regularly. I like the new way of this blog, hope it continues. It’s a lot more honest at least.
Aww, c’mon Mugly! This is the only blog I read regularly and I enjoy learning new things from it and the occasional heated banter. I don’t want to read censored comments- this isn’t a family blog. I love reading all kinds of different communication styles including the crazy ones. Please consider publishing both the good and bad.
If you’ve been reading fugly for a while, you have been reading ONLY censored comments, duh! Don’t kid yourself. Mugly is at least allowing folks like myself and naughty tobiano to add insight and comments to discussions. Both of us were blocked although still insulted on this site. I like what you’re doing mugly, keep it up. I like your tongue in cheek honesty and I like the sense of integrity you have brought here. Good job.
Aye Aye Capiton Pip!! While I disagree wholly with the idea that parts of comments are removed, if you pay the least bit of attention to page that pops up after you hit submit it says “your comment is awaiting moderation”. I would sincerely hope that if comments are offensive enough that censoring them for language or violence or threats is necessary, that the blogger would simply just NOT post the comment. Why waste time editing something for content? If the decent comment is buried under vitriol, who the heck cares what the person had to say anyway?
I must agree with Pip at this point. I do like the direction the blog has turned. Though, after reading this one and then the next, I do wonder if there is more than one blogger now? There appeared to be some contradiction but I could have misread or misinterpreted it.
Good to see you Ms. Cat!
nope….just me.
As far as I know you have ALWAYS had to accept comments before them actually showing up on here. I understand limiting profane, totally rude, and of the wall comments, or things unrelated but this and always has been a place for opinions, sharing of knowledge, and (almost) always freedom of speech and freedom to defend oneself. I hope you don’t forget it and just start deleting anything that upsets you are hurts your feelings. Not in any way trying to sound condescending, I am just saying I hope you use good judgement, and don’t decide to be censoring everyone to make the blog to feel more happy and sunshiny than it is. I get a bit feisty and worked up sometimes but I have to say I like the blog in its original glory, and as of now it isn’t horrible, take away the debated, the opinions ,and the views of others and I would be gone. That is not a threat, that is just me being honest about what I love to read. I’m curious as to what type of blogging the other blogger does. This place had always been one of sharing, and most post in my opinions need commenting on.
OMG! After I watched that video I just can’t believe you call yourself a trainer! Any ‘good’ trainer knows that when loping, you always kiss not cluck and when doing your spins, don’t you ‘know’ you are supposed to ask for a new face, click to get started while gently guiding in the direction you want to go and opening the door with your leg, then kissing and rolling the spur for speed? Jeeeeeeez! And Girl, what self-respecting trainer would allow their horses to be seen in publice with bridle path growth like that? Did the motor in your clippers burn up? Sigh…..
But seriously, I hope you sensed the sarcasm in the previous paragragh as a response to your blog post. What an awesome time you must be having! Love the bra cam!
Ah jest hang on an tell ‘er GIDDYAP!
What a good time that looked like! I got a little sick on the spins, though, as a dressage rider, our canter pirouettes just don’t go that fast. So jealous of that awesome trail ride too. Gotta love that big sky country!
I’m gonna take it a crochity step further. Why do people cluck or kiss at their horses AT ALL?!?! What are you? A bunch of chickens? How about you use your AIDES to tell your horse what you want – your voice, your hands, your seat, your leg, etc … There is nothing more annoying than riding with a bunch of cluckers. And those with children are just mother cluckers … Sorry, but I couldn’t resist …
Please note the sarcasm, but seriously, why all the noise when some people ride? I’ve never gotten that. I actually had one friend tell me, and I quote here, “Why would I use all that other stuff when I can just cluck to my horse and she does what I want?” Huh? So she has different clucks for bending, for flexing, for … whatever … I know I’m in the minority so please don’t bash me too much
I think you’re doing just fine Mugs. I, too, like that banter of the blog. I know people will hate my comments about them sounding like chickens, but hey, it’s my opinion. Just as everything you post is your opinion. Keep it up. And I for one didn’t believe for a second you were stoopid enough to leave your horses tied continuously for days on end. I took it as a figure of speech and that you would obviously move them enough to keep them healthy, but that you just didn’t have a fenced area available.
How I ride…Hands control straight, left and right with leg aids and weight from my seat bones, seat controls stop and back, legs and weight control hindquarters, calves and heels create lift, cluck means give me more and smooch means lope depart…..Whoa means slide stop. Cussing, muttering, heavy breathing and laughing are all out of my control.
Notice I included “voice.” That’s where the “Cussing, muttering, heavy breathing and laughing” come into play
Nothing like getting busted when one of those “front row” (attached to the arena fence) spectators overhears your cussing and muttering at your steed during a show class and gives you a dirty look.
“Why do people cluck or kiss at their horses AT ALL?!?!”
I think it came about as a intermediate warning between using a leg aid that was ignored and getting popped with a crop on the backside. At least, that was the way I interpreted things when I was 9 and learning my diagonals on half-asleep school horses.
With my own horse, I was a horse-crazy teenager playing with her new toy. How many different things could I teach him? The answer was quite a lot. Then it became a strategy for the horse shows. For instance, if I made a (very quiet) kiss noise the split second before I applied my outside leg, my horse knew a canter cue was coming. I made hay in the flat classes like that. (and no, he didn’t listen to people on the rail or anywhere else – training in a busy boarding barn has many advantages like that
)
Down the road a bit, he’s 20 and a fantastic up-down horse for little kids and also the go-to mount for the students learning to canter. Why? Because I can stand in the middle of a 90×180 indoor, have the rider out on the rail, make a noise and the horse canters. No head-up-running-through-the-trot-into-canter for my students. Once they are comfortable with the gait, then I teach them how to get it on their own with a quiet leg aid.
Maybe long-winded, but that’s why *I* kiss and cluck to my horse. If I had to distill it down to one word, I think it would be “convenience”.
In the barn where i ride, we ride with your legs and seat, not with our voices. I like it that way. I’ve got nothing against people that make clucky sounds, if they can ride without them, but I prefer to use my body. The only sounds we use at my riding school is a clicking sound to encourage the horse to move, followed by a tug on the lead rope or a leg aid, and the whistle, to make a horse stop if it is going to fast and the rider is out of control or loosing his balance.
Of course I always end up muttering “stop being a pain in the ass!” or “quit trying to push me against the wall, it’s not gonna work”, at one point or another, but that’s out of my control
Some people live to rant online.. I don’t understand them and I think they are the same folks who complain about what is on TV.. no one, to my knowledge, is holding a gun to anyone’s head to read a blog or watch a TV show.. that said, I think what came through on this post is that while anything you write, Mugs, Fugs or anyone else, while you proclaim loudly that is YOUR opinion; by virtue of your “position” as author of a widely read blog.. you are viewed as a “reliable source” and often quoted and copied. I have enjoyed both blogs for several years and appreciated the difference in views and writing styles. But I think that Mugs has written for a group more interested in the nuts and bolts of training and by virtue overall possibly more experienced in some areas.. don’t jump down my throat, I know that many of Fuglys audience are high level trainers, but that is not necessarily *why* they come to read this blog..
Case in point.. when I read that Mugs had tied her horses to a tree for three days I *KNOW* that they were not tied to a tree for three days solid in an unsafe manner. Understandably someone who has not been following Mugs for a while would envision the worse case scenario and unfortunately someone inexperienced now says “Well Fugs/Mugs said SHE tied her horse out for three days to a tree so it must be okay”
Bottom line.. Mugs, like it or not, your audience has grown astronomically. Along with that comes the responsibility of providing only clear/clean information to avoid this type of issue.
Hoping that the trifling stops and allows you to get with the flow on this blog and still keep up Chronicles as well!
Oh My Gosh! Thanks for the ride-a-long! I’m glad I was here by myself or the laughter and amusement would cause my husband to shake his head. I had to laugh along with you while you were trotting. You were having so much fun that it just transmitted through. It took me a few strides to figure you were loping. Next thing I knew I was moving with the rhythm of the horse riding along myself. I was sad to feel you stop.
I have never been on a spinning horse, so that was wild. I was almost dizzy when you stopped. Next, I was saying out loud – “Oh,oh, we’re going the other way!” The sorting was pretty cool, too. Yet another thing I haven’t tried. It was harder to follow because we couldn’t see as well with the quick movements and hands and heads in the way, but hearing the others cheer you on when you succeeded was fun.
Thanks for the ride. Please do it again sometime! Oh, and regarding the actual post (I got wrapped up in the ride). Good call on weeding out the crap. We all do things that we wish we hadn’t or realize later that it wasn’t the best thing to do. I have learned so much from this blog – from Fugly and the readers – that it’s great you are using it as a teaching tool.
Having done endurance and some competitive trail for 10 seasons, I have seen horses camping under many different circumstances – metal corrals, PVC corrals, electric corrals, high ties, picket lines, tied to trailers, trucks, and trees, and tied to lines staked in the ground. I saw a setup where a picket line was run along the side of a trailer so the horse could move more. I’ve also seen horses tied long enough to lay down. In all cases the horses were under the watchful eyes of the owners or other campers (not a cut-throat sport) and were frequently hand walked or ridden to keep them loose. And these horses were going to be doing 50-100 miles the next morning. I would frankly be more worried about the horse eating the tree bark and killing the tree than harming the horse by having it tied to a tree.
umm, yes, there was a tree bark issue and I may owe my friends a bit of grass seed, and a few petunias.
Until very recently the Household Cavalry and Kings Troop horses were tied in a picket line when on their annual holidays- they were tied at the head and heel roped as well, as they are used to standing in stalls made of hanging railway sleepers and in the picket line they have no dividers to prevent them kicking one another. Nowadays I think they turn them out in paddocks but they still spend the greater part of each day standing tied. During normal everyday routine these horses are tied in stalls for all day and all night, only coming out for exercise, practises and free time (they have a rolling sand pit for the horses to have a bit of down time in but they are always on a lunge line for this.
Year in year out the only time these horses are ever loose is on their three week annual holiday in the country.
They seem to manage OK- they are trained, that I suppose is the difference, and they lead a long and active life in spite of constantly trotting on tarmac.
People forget that until halfway through the last century horses actually worked for a living!
littleredarabs- you voiced my exact thoughts when I read that nonsense at the beginning of the blog.
“I used to work as a professional guide in Shawnee National Forest, a huge horse camping area. I spent as much time helping horse-idiots resolve the problems caused by tying horses to trees for extended periods of time as I did guiding. Anyone who knew ANYTHING about horse physiology either brought a collapsible pen or rented a pen so their animals could avoid the stocking up, mechanical founder, colic, exhaustion, etc. that is so common with horses who are immobile for extended periods.”
Um, no, those problems- stocking up, mechanical founder, colic, exhaustion, etc- are caused by RIDING THE CRAP OUT OF A HORSE WHO IS NORMALLY A PASTURE POTATO, THEN TYING HIM STATIONARY. Around here, we call them “Yahoos.” A “Yahoo” is a wannabe horseperson who has a poorly maintained horse (think infrequent hoof trims! Overweight or too thin!) out back in an often unsafe backyard/pen/etc and who only rides a few weekends a year- they pull an unfit horse off pasture, throw an often ill-fitting saddle on him, and then ride him for hours on end in often difficult terrain… then take him back to camp, tie him stationary, and wonder why he colics or founders or otherwise gets injured or sick behind the abuse they have so blissfully dished out to the poor animal. If the first night doesn’t kill the poor thing, they often repeat the riding on the following day. And they wonder why the horse seems tired and grumpy!
I see it time and time again when I go camping/trail riding- Yahoos. They’re everywhere. Usually with a saddlebag full of beer.
Hmmmm…..wonder why your description of a “yahoo” sounds so recently familiar, especially the saddlebags full of beer part???
Why DO people think drinking beer and riding horses is a good idea?
Let me preface this by stating I almost never post comments to blogs but this one really irritated me for some reason. The audacity of some people to send you such condescending comments really amazes me.
Based on just what you posted I can only imagine what the rest of the comment contained.
Is it just horse people or do all people feel the need to broadcast their superior knowledge to the world? I will not even comment on what was posted except to ask “are you also supposed to put on the horse’s pajamas, tuck them in and give them a kiss goodnight?” Enough said on that I think you can garner my implied meaning there.
The last time I checked, this was your blog. I can choose to read it, follow it…whatever. It is not the job of the blog reader to educate you or anyone who reads YOUR blog.
Keep up the blog, I enjoy reading it. I do not feel the need to comment on everything I read that I do not agree with. I also do not feel the need to educate everyone I come in contact with on my great knowledge of horses.
In closing the comment made sure brought to mind the quote by Mark Twain “It is better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.”
I love it when a reader educates me. The joy I get from blogging comes from the fountain of information that comes through the comments. Ah jest don’ thin ah’m gettin’ much edercatin when yer so bizzy tellin’ me how stupid and ignerrant ah iz……
Cest la vie said:
“Is it just horse people or do all people feel the need to broadcast their superior knowledge to the world? ”
You should visit some of the Dog forums….if it’s possible they can be worse than horse folks
Unless you are unlike every horse person I know, you probably checked on your horses a million times, you took them for walks or rides for excersise, your tied them at correct lenghts, etc. and your horses are broke to stand tied – just like most trail ridden horses are. You didn’t tie them and go shopping at the mall for the day, I assume. Any serious trail rider has tied their horses to a picket line or to their trailer for the night. They are not immobile, they can move around and even lie down if tied correctly. When I travel with my horse, he often has to stay in the trailer overnight, where he has even less room to move around, compared to tieing to a picket line or tree. How about the countless draft horses which are kept crammed into tie stalls all their lives? They have even less room to move around. My neighbor keeps his 6 Percherons show horses in tie stalls nerly 24/7. Yes, there are those idiots out there who haven’t a clue and their horses get into trouble, but among the hundreds of trail riders I camp with, rarely is there a problem. Only the occasional problem of trying too closely to a strange horse where a kicking match might start up or one might get loose.
Mugly wrote:
“I’ve got a confession to make. Under the advisement of a blog author – who shall remain nameless- with much more blog experience than I, the comments have recently been moderated.”
May I just say YAY! I don’t mind a little cussing and sarcasm, in fact it can be entertaining, but the hatred and personal insults are just too much. In fact, to anyone who has an urge to unleash the vitriol, I recommend that you go to Mugwump Chronicles and read through the archives for a couple of days. Mugs knows a couple of things about horses.
Absolutely. A difference of opinion is a whole lot different than attacking a person’s core value. I can readily say I don’t believe in keeping a horse in a barn 24/7 – hate the thought of it. But I know plenty of horse people who house their horses as such. Doesn’t mean I wouldn’t learn something from them over a cup of coffee. Feeling differently hardly qualifies me to start calling her a f’ing b**** CU Next Tuesday. I personally have never tied a horse to a tree for any length of time but I regularly tie to the washrack after a rinse and think nothing of walking away to make lunch, rake the ring, mow the lawn, whatever.
Controversy is great, cruelty not needed.
Nice spin on the youngster Mugly! I love the way his hair is all over the place at the lope, he looks like a big blond muppet! Glad you got to get out and have some fun.
Thanks! Was great to watch. I want a bracam! Would be a hoot to watch back all the fun, weird and stupid things we see while on the trail with tourists that have never been on a horse in their lives
)
I moderated the past three years. I just moderated minimally.
There are certain people whose aim is to come here, bash on the blog writer (whoever she may be) and contribute nothing. There isn’t any point in paying for those people to have a playground. Either comment on the blog content, or go play on one of the troll blogs that exist for that purpose. It just gets silly if you allow it because 15 people jump to the blog writer’s defense and the whole thread goes off track. So killing the purely vitriolic comments makes sense.
Love your new moniker – thanks for the morning giggle:D I’m thinking of stealing it for my littlewhitemoneyvacuum LOL!
I really enjoy reading the differing opinions written in comments and have learned so much since I started reading this blog (I think almost as much from the commentators as the writer), however I do tend to “wander” away when it starts to get stupid crazy. So I agree, moderation can be a good thing (in moderation of course, lol!)
Love the new name!
Thats the craziest thing I’ve ever heard. While it might be “ideal” for horses to move constantly, in reality thats a rarity. When I was growing up, I boarded my horse at a barn with no turn-out (Not an option in NYC) and he was in a straight stall. Granted I rode every day. There were close to 100 horses in that barn (mostly hacks) and I can count on one hand the times any horse coliced or had hoof troubles, etcc.. When I read your statement, I assumed you meant for a few hours or at the longest over night. In my 40+ years around horses I have yet to hear of death by tree tying!
Horse ownership is a lot like parenting. If you read the parenting stuff online, which I admit I sometimes do for amusement, a scary number of people are chasing their kids around with hand sanitizer and having a COW if a stranger touches their kid’s hand. My personal opinion? WHY THE HECK do you think all your kids have allergies? You’re sanitizing them to death and they are developing no natural resistance to anything.
It’s a good analogy, because in both cases you have love and a desire to protect plus the internet plus crazy people on the internet plus guilt plus fear of DOING IT WRONG and the end result is everyone loses their grip on the difference between NECESSARY and IDEAL. It is IDEAL for horses to move continuously, and to graze all day. But a zillion horses stand in stalls and survive, just as a zillion humans sit in cubicles and survive. It is not ideal but I don’t for a second believe you’re going to damage your horse’s feet by restricting his movement for a couple of days. Come on.
I was wondering why there were so few comments! I’m used to seeing over a hundred per thread.
While I don’t agree with tieing the horses to a tree for long periods of time, I have tied horses to trees briefly during work breaks. I’d like to think it was done safely. The horses wore leather halters (that would break if they pulled back) and were tied with quick-release knots to trees that not very thick around. The horses themselves were trained and well-behaved, never an incidence in many years. The rope was tied at wither-height and they stayed that way for 15 to 30 minutes. We would sit outside/supervise them and make sure that passers-by did not bother them during “their break.” Often, they’d doze off and they also became very adept at releasing themselves from the knots (quick release!). Luckily they were well-trained and wouldn’t move an inch, just do it because well, they were smart/goofy guys.
I’ve heard of horses being put on rope-lines (so the horse can walk a bit) between trees while camping. Perhaps someone else who has done that/can vouch for it’s safety/purposes could brief on that? Even with that though, the horse couldn’t lie down? ::shrug::
I haven’t moderated hundreds, there hasn’t been that much hating going on. Maybe three? Four before I put the other one back up. I assumed there weren’t many comments because I was boring you again. Pity party a 6′ish. If anybody comes. Sigh.
Ill bring flan
keep your chin up. For most of fugly’s blog I was a longtime lurker. You made me come out of hiding! Truly though, just keep doing your thing. I likeI it. ^_^
Flan, yum. I’ll bring Key Lime Pie.
I have horse camped, endurance raced and horse packed a lot over the years. If you have the high line set right (with a little give to it, but not sagging) then the horse can absolutely lay down (and does).
However, having said that… I’ve seen many endurance horses tied to the trailer all day and all night (with riding and walking-in-hand breaks) that then competed at the highest level the next day. I’m not sure where this “person” got their info from, but it sucks. Period.
Life Is a Beach
http://36andsingle.blogspot.com/
I asked for some to brief me on that practice. Ive heard friends mention it for camping. Thanks
So fugly was moderating, even though she vehemently denied ever doing so?
And now you are going to moderate and edit as well?
That kind of defeats the whole purpose of this being a public, non-personal blog.
To be sure, there are commenter’s whose language could be toned down a bit. But isn’t the whole point to post the variety of opinions, so that those with idiotic opinions like is one can be duly shot down publicly?
As you can see, already a number of people have sided with you on this particular subject (unless the ones in agreement with the original commenter have been moderated?). How are people with these ridiculous opinions ever going to be educated or hear how dumb other people think they are if the other readers of this blog are not allowed to see and correct their faulty logic?
I appreciate your honesty. That is far more than fugly ever gave. But I am truly disappointed that yet again, this is most likely going to turn into an, only in agreement blog.
At least I guess we all know now that the people who claimed their comments were not published or had wording changed weren’t just crazy, Cathy-haters, now don’t we?
The reason I fessed up was so you would know I have no intention of turning this into a “agreement only” blog. Disagree away, that makes for great reading….
Expect, of course, we have no way of knowing what was moderated, and so have no way of knowing if comments were cut for simple disagreement. You can say you won’t cut for disagreement all you want, but why would I trust that? The comment in this post that you cut …it’s just disagreement. You might not like the language, but the author isn’t threatening you or your first born. She is very much on topic and responding to the post. So, yeah, you cut it for disagreeing with you and using language too harsh for your delicate burning ears.
Really, if you can’t take insults and vitriol, the internet is not a good place for you. Especially not if you’re running a blog that can be controversial.
The moderated comment was extremely inflammatory over very little real issue. The comment accuses Mugly of knowing nothing about horses, making greenhorn mistakes, and then reams her out for it. The truth is that tying horses while on camping trips or at shows is normal, accepted practice, and it can be done safely. Mugly is most certainly not a greenhorn, and there’s no grounds in what she posted to make accusations of neglect.
So why bother having a heated argument about a non-issue? It’s classic troll behavior – take something with a grain of truth, blow it way out of proportion, insult people, and sit back and watch the chaos. It’s fun, sometimes, but if we’re going to stir up bee’s nests on this blog I’d rather only open up the ones that have something worthwhile inside. People getting worked up over Western Pleasure or training techniques is fun and instructive. This wasn’t.
yes, yes and yes….
Growing up showing horses and occasionally getting to do a trail ride, we always tied our horses, sometimes for a few hours at a time. What’s wrong with that, really? Wish I could do it now but my prince charming is an escape artist who can also untie his friends, no matter what knot (the safe kind) I use, he is loose and wandering within minutes unless I sit right by him. I think tying a horse is the least of the evils you could do to them. I still remember the state fairs I went to where we only had the standing stalls and for 4-5 days our horses were in that barn. Never had a colic, an illness or even a freak out. We did still have our houdinis but that was just funny as we watched them back out of the stall and go for a stroll. The idea of this sort of tying is that ther is at least 1 person supervising most of the time. Horses are fine for a few days doing the frontier, cowboy way of keeping. We all seem to go to that “horses are delicate” way of thinking, they really aren’t. They are work animals and can handle a lot more than we give them credit for.
This is a horse blog that often focuses on unsafe practices. I would think the safe way to tie a horse for long periods IS very relevant and interesting. A better way to handle it would have been to let the comment post and explain what precautions were taken to avoid possible issues. That would have educated the readers and set the tone for a mature blog.
Instead, the comment was hidden, then posted alone still WITHOUT addressing the actual issue it was questioning. How many times are single pictures posted on this blog and all sorts of assumptions made about the owner of the horse based of them? An assumption was made based on what Mugs wrote, and she reacted by flouncing off.
If you want to moderate, at least let people know AND set standards. Throw up an FAQ that states what you’ll allow and what you won’t. Leaving it up to some vague ‘don’t be too mean to me!” standard when the blog owner has already shown her first reflex is to hide a comment for disagreement doesn’t exactly inspire open discussion.
At the end of the day, it’s her blog and she can do as she wants with it. But I think she needs to decide WHAT she wants….happy times where she gets to rag on others in the horse world and no body rags on her? Open discussion with some standards relating to personal threats? But leaving people guessing as to what they can and can’t post is just bad taste.
I guess time will tell. If we start seeing that nobody disagrees with Mugly, or has a contrasting view point, we know that Fugly 1.0 moderation techniques are in effect. Sit back, wait, watch, and see. Then judge if you must.
Parallel, you’re missing the point of this entire post – Mugly’s not going to cut comments that have to do with the post- she’s just going to cut the “…and I think you are stupid, and your butt is big, and that your ovaries should be taken out and set on fire so you never reproduce, and …” portions of the comments if they get out of hand.
And while you chew her out for “cutting” the comment… holy crap! She didn’t “cut” the comment….. she took a long comment that contained a lot of ranting and insults, edited it to contain the informative portion so we could all benefit from it. She left enough in enough to make it obvious that the commenter disagreed with her practices and why he/she disagreed with them, and wrote an entire post about it. She then even went on to freely admit that she cut out some of the nasty stuff.
For goodness’ sakes, how much more open do you want her to be? Weight? Favorite hairstyle? Underwear size, perhaps?
Yeesh.
I’ll have to draw the line at weight…
LMAO!
There’s a difference between “you’re a terrible horse owner” and “I think you should die horribly”. One is an insult and quite frankly, the same kind of assumption that this blog throws around all the time. The other is a veiled threat and well, creepy…but even then, it’s just a typical hyperbole based internet exchange.
First we had the post in which Mugs shrilly and proudly defended bad writing. I squirmed from contact embarrassment reading that, I really did. Then we have a flounce and moderation based on vague, undefined standards. Mugs really is starting to seem like someone new to the internet who isn’t ready for a larger readership. It reminds me of the xkcd cartoon…”someone is disagreeing with me online!” Cue horror and rage and general flailing about.
Yes, Mugs posted the comment, but her first instinct was to hide it. She still hasn’t addressed the points in it. We’ve heard from posters saying “Of course Mugs took precautions…she’s owned horses for a long time and is experienced!” That’s not an answer, and it doesn’t educate anyone. Considering the point of the blog, it also seems a strange case of giving someone the benefit of the doubt due to experience when most of the targets of this blog are experienced horse people. Since when is experience alone proof against mistakes or bad behavior?
I’m not even saying Mugs did anything improper with the horses. I don’t think she did. But this was handled poorly, and again, what I want is for her to set standards if she is going to moderate. And maybe to take a deep breath and think things through before acting.
Mugly, may I suggest something?
Since people are worried that the censoring will turn into simply deleting the comments you don’t like and keeping the ones you do, perhaps you can tell us when a comment in censored? For example, in for the comment above, maybe place a little disclaimer at the bottom, such as:
[Censored for excessive profanity and personal attacks]
Something of that nature will at least alert us when you choose to censor or edit a comment. Likewise, when you decide to delete a comment entirely, perhaps you can put in a similar disclaimer in its place, like many websites do already (ex: “This post has been deleted for not following our site terms and conditions.”
Personally, that might ease a lot of my worries.
Coming from an internet-generation child, I’d just like to put in my two cents. Anything on the internet which allows comments (i.e. forums or blogs) NEEDS moderation. Moderation doesn’t mean simply cutting out comments you dislike, it means reviewing all comments for quality before allowing them to be posted. It allows the quality of the site to be maintained. You have no idea how many forums die because 99% of the comments become bot-created ads for penis enlargement; it completely chokes out any chance of educational discussion.
Fasthorsesrule, you are incorrect. Cathy did moderate – and it was no secret. I do not know her, so this is not a personal defense, but I’ve followed her blog for two years. I was always well aware that she HAD to moderate – she’d let in some of the crazies, but not most of them. Do you realize how many people hated her, and that there are sites dedicated to bashing this site?
The moderating was no secret. And clearly this is not, nor ever has been, an “in agreement only” blog.
‘Do you realize how many people hated her, and that there are sites dedicated to bashing this site?’
Yeah, she knows, she’s one of the main posters on one of those sites.
On one hand, I don’t know the specific blog site you are referencing. On the other hand, I do know that I was accused of being Cathy three or more times on one of the bashing sites (once for a comment I made on this page [they suggested I was a fake identify for Cathy], once or twice for a comment I made directly on their site, and once for a comment I made on a news article about SCR [a local rescue to me]). Each time they were CERTAIN that my writing style was exactly the same as Cathy’s (I’d beg to differ, beyond the fact that both Cathy and I have a decent grasp of the English language).
Basically, what I’m getting at would be that unless you are referencing a blog where Cathy has come out and said, “I’m Cathy, etc,” you might be a little hasty in believing it every time someone says, “OMG, it’s Cathy with a fake moniker!” I tried to clear it up once on the blog where they kept accusing me of being Cathy, but either I entered things in wrong or the blog system ate my post when I tried. I lost interest after that, especially since I didn’t think I would convince anyone on that site anyways.
“I do know that I was accused of being Cathy three or more times on one of the bashing sites (once for a comment I made on this page [they suggested I was a fake identify for Cathy]”
Yeah, so was I.
“Basically, what I’m getting at would be that unless you are referencing a blog where Cathy has come out and said, “I’m Cathy, etc,” you might be a little hasty in believing it every time someone says, “OMG, it’s Cathy with a fake moniker!” I tried to clear it up once on the blog where they kept accusing me of being Cathy, but either I entered things in wrong or the blog system ate my post when I tried. I lost interest after that, especially since I didn’t think I would convince anyone on that site anyways.”
My reference was about the poster here, not Cathy. I know for certain who they are, because after they post here, they cut and paste it over there and talk about it.
Oops, I thought you were saying Cathy posts on the “I-hate-Cathy” blogs all the time. Sorry
Sometimes I get confused with the long threads of replies.
You are mistaken redcolt. I do know of one of the blogs which you are referencing, but I’m fairly certain you will not find a single cut and paste of one of my comments from here, over there, unless someone did so recently. I have no need of such childish behavior. Which is exactly what that blog turned into and I quit reading it some time ago. About the time some of the commenter’s there started having conversations with their numerous alter-egos. LOL. That was a little scary to read. :-O.
What, are you blind or stupid?
I am sorry I do not usually make such blunt comments but, honestly, when did Cathy deny moderating, and just how could you, possibly, miss the flaming great “your comment is awaiting moderation ” sign that comes up when you post?????
kirri, I’m not sure if you are being purposely obtuse or just incapable of keeping up with the conversation. The topic was, ‘Whose comments are going to get approved?’, not ‘OMG, someone has to approve the comments?’ I’m sorry, I am unable to recall the exact dates and posts to when Cathy denied she edited or blocked comments. But it’s there. That fact is also proven when numerous people cited that their comments had been previously blocked/edited and multiple regular’s denied that fugly would do such a thing.
gingershuman-I am NOT incorrect. See the above comment. I have read this blog off and on for over three years. I watched the rise and the fall of the original fugly blog and the rise and fall of this one as well, until Mugs took over writing. I find it interesting that it was the commenter’s who are blamed for causing all the problems in the comments. Does the term, inciting a riot, mean anything? Over the years, Cathy’s tone lost it’s snarky quality and turned hate filled and vile. She often spoke of killing people or doing harm to them. Is it any wonder that her commenter’s felt it perfectly acceptable to adopt the same attitude?
parallel and Bay Horse Girl have very valid points in their comments and Mugs has proven that she takes some of the ridiculous comments people make very personally. So how exactly is anyone supposed to know if they have crossed the invisible line, outside of rampant cussing and personal threats against the writer, that is? When your comments have been blocked and no one else knows?
So, you are just blind then?
You could not see the flaming great “your comment is awaiting moderation” sign at the top of your comment????
If you believe that Cathy really meant it when she talked about harming other people (that really DO deserve to be harmed, btw), then you really are stupid…
They could start by behaving in a civilized manner. It is possible to do so, even when disagreeing, as you yourself have done.
LOL, Well you would think so Snipe. But as you can see from kirri and Nierro’s responses, some people are just not capable of grasping the context nor do they seem to have much of a vocabulary outside of calling people names.
I’m pretty sure a reasonably intelligent person would have grasped that I am well aware that the comments are moderated and not tried to beleaguer that was somehow the question I was asking.
How Nierro came up with the idea I believed Cathy’s threats to kill or harm other people is beyond me. That is most definitely grasping at non-existent straws. However, the writer sets the tone and there are obviously people here who are struggling to rise to the level of Mug’s less inflammatory, non-hate filled style after wallowing in Cathy’s world for so long.
Your post is what gave me the idea that you were capable of believe that Cathy would harm other people. There are all kinds of nutters on the internet, so how would I know? If you don’t believe that Cathy actually meant it when she mentioned she wanted (and the key word is wanted) to harm another human being, then you are not in fact stupid, and have nothing to be offended about.
As for Cathy censoring comments, I once saw right here on this blog some ass calling Cathy and other posters cunts (in all capital letters), among other things, to try an make a pathetic defense over some abuser that Cathy exposed. If I saw that, I means it was not censored. So I can’t for the life of me, imagine what kind of language would take for Cathy actually censor an entire post.
Hope she/he?? never hangs out with a bunch of ropers. Ouch.
That did it! I am recovering from severe bronchitis and if I laugh it makes me cough for an inordinate length of time! Almost as bad as snorting coffee on the keyboard. I am still coughing!!
When I first started reading FHOD it was under a much differen format and there were some serious issues. There did not appear to be much moderation at the time and the system allowed for multiple sign-ins..ie different Handles for one person and the remarks were to say the least, UGLY. There are some very, very nasty people in Washington state.
After the system was changed to this format (or one right before it) the “awaiting moderation” message started coming up and of course posters are only allowed one name and you cannot even change that unless of course you have various email addy’s that you can post under. It only stands to reason that there is some moderation. Of course there is room to disagree, but how you choose to disagree can in fact be an issue. No this is NOT a family site.
FYI, There is another huge web site that was controversiale for years. I was a moderator on that site. (this site still exisits and is very heavily modetrated as a FAMILY ORIENTED site); Then one of the really ugly nasty posters decided to start his own site with a sorta-simular-nameas retaliation for a moderated comment. That newer site is to say the very least, ugly and vicious. The owner /moderator not only moderates, he changes and edits comments (which I am not sure is legal) to suit his whims and also now CHARGES for you to be able to post. I no longer even go to read that site as it is so vicous and TRULY NOT a family site. Which is MY COICE!
I understand modetartion and deleting exceptionally profane comments. I would however be extremely upset if my comments are editied of their contentand interpitation. Since I do not use profanity on the internet or ugly threats, I do not expect to to have any of my comments/postings deleted or changed. I do miss the —-blogspot.com format as you could go to other blogspsotters and read their blogs, but I can live with that too.
It is after all yours and my choice to come here, read and post. Iffn ya don’t like it heres, SEE YA!!! As mentioned there are numerous other sites you can go to. Just my personal opinion!
When I went camping with horses in Canada, yes, the horses were on picket lines for half of the trip. They were also tied to trees while we ate lunch. There were no injuries as a result.
When they were tied to trees, we were sitting within fifty yards TOPS of them eating, and the wranglers always sat facing the horses so if anything DID happen, they could go right over and fix it. The picket lines were done properly. At the last camp ground, they actually turned the horses loose. SOME of them were hobbled, but not all…they only hobbled the ones they didn’t trust to stay where the grain was, which as I recall was four horses and the mule (now that was one heck of a mule). Again, no injuries, no horses tried to leave the camp ground area…although one did keep poking his head in people’s tents. Looking for apples, no doubt.
.
I have no problem with picket lines OR standing stalls if the horses are *working*. I do have a problem with leaving horses standing still all the time for no reason, but these horses were doing anything up to 6 hours a day, so you can’t say they weren’t moving. (And I think every one of them could have done a 100 miler and passed the vet with no problems…these were lean, mean trail machines
).
That video really made me smile.
I read the “tied for a day or two” thing and didn’t like it, but then I thought about it. I wasn’t going to assume the horses were actually immobile for 48 straight hours, for one. Why bring a horse on a trip if you’re not going to do anything with it for two straight days? Tied all night, or tied but ridden or whatever, is, well, whatever.
And, while we all know now that horses need to move for their digestive system and for their feet, when horses were the only means of transportation and while they were having this country built off their backs, people were not as educated in the science of the equine. While I’m sure many horses met untimely ends because of ignorance, many lived long lives and were probably tied for hours upon hours at a time while their rider was at Point A before they went back to point B.
Overall, if I saw a rank beginner tie her horse and then walk away from it with an unknown timeline for how long he’d be there, I’d probably blow a fuse because that’s not an educated decision (like when a little girl realized she forgot her helmet and half chaps and so she dropped the reins, clipped the end of the D ring onto one cross tie, and then walked away while the horse was spinning around, at the barn I work at.)
But Mugs is clearly not a beginner, she probably knows her horses limits, and I’m doubting she just said, “ah fuck it” and left them there with no thought.
This was a training trip for my horses….not riding them every day would be a serious waste of fuel!
I have read this blog going on a year and a half now, not nearly as long as some of you die hards out there but maybe a little longer than a few. I have also gone through all of the old posts and, while I found them informative and funny and snarky in true Fugly style, I secretly enjoyed the comments the most.
What makes this blog unique, IMO, is not the content (conformation and “fugly” horse blogs are a dime a dozen) but the comments. I love to see people disagree. I love seeing different opinions. I love stupid people being pointed out for how stupid they are. I learn a lot from the comments, and I laugh a lot too. I’ve argued with people, and people have argued with me. It is what keeps this blog turning round and round, at least in my mind.
I understand not wanting to post personal attacks or comments that are so off the wall they are just inflammatory for the sake of being inflammatory, but once you start picking and choosing what to include and what to toss out you begin to walk a very fine line. Personally I don’t see anything in the post you used as an example that would merit it being edited or tossed out all together. Clearly the poster disagreed with you, and clearly we all know you would never put your horses in danger, but he/she does raise at least one or two interesting points that I believe the rest of us, as readers of this blog, should have the option of either dismissing or discussing.
Just my $.02
I don’t see a problem with moderating. It’s done everywhere on blogs, or, like someone else mentioned, the comments would be full of bot-generated ads. And no, it isn’t illegal or stripping you of your human rights by not having your dang blog response posted. This is not your blog. If you want to say something that isn’t moderated, start your own blog.
But the rest of us, who actually come to this blog for our own enjoyment (NOT to just bash other people, start problems, or release some pent up frustration on innocent internet bystanders), recognize that being Mugly/Fugly’s blog, she/they can do what they want.
And Mugly, I like what you’re doing. Don’t worry about the fact that you don’t have zillions of comments yet with every post. It’ll come with time. I’m just glad to find new topics on here – I get tired of looking through the archives!
Thanks for the mini-break to visit some beautiful country. It looked like fun! Two utter greenhorn observations. As you were doing the cow thing, I kept thinking, “Wow, her hands are really high. I don’t know why, do they just do it that way or what?” I got my explanation when you said “I’m turning the bra cam off.” I had assumed it was on your head.
And Mugs, those steers, they had horns!!! I was again assuming the cattle toys were polled. It looked fun, but I hate chasing cattle, saw too much of the wrong end of cattle as a kid, trying to drive the wild ones where they belonged- on foot.
And it’s your blog. Edit all you want. Frankly, I was turned off by some of the crazier out of control elements. I always wondered if they were just mean-spirited low life that were rabble-rousing to make themselves feel big. If they want to rant, they can get their own blog. F***ingUgly or some such.
My hand comes up to make contact because I ride with my reins low and long. While cutting i was cleaning up her stop, she wanted to float into her turn instead of stopping and turning, while we were doing our arena work I was driving her into frame with my legs then lifting my hand to create my “wall.”
So you’ll see my hand go up and down quite a bit.
At my lesson barn, quite a few boarders have senior horses (retired show horses, etc.), and several of our schoolies are older guys as well. Apparently these horses are all unaware that they should be in “near continuous movement”; they are experts at lying down however, especially if there’s a handy patch of sunlight. I now fear for their digital cushions.
This made me chuckle so loud that my office mate came in to see what I was cackling about
I also have a chronic napper. Guess no one told him that he was a danger to himself either…
Life’s A Beach
http://36andsingle.blogspot.com/
Looks like you were having a blast. There is nothing better than camping/riding with good friends and good horses. That said, I hope you never have to say goodbye to a good friend because they weren’t wearing helmets. Just sayin…
I don’t imagine that Mugly’s friends let her dress them in the morning, given that they appear to be adults. Wearing a helmet is a choice for each individual rider to make on their own, as is not wearing one.
Of course it is safer, I doubt many people here don’t realize that. But censuring Mugly for her friends not choosing to wear helmets is a bit silly.
Re: Moderation.. I don’t have an issue with off-topic flaming being removed. It detracts from the point of the blog and comments, and frankly bores me.
I’m jealous of the trip, Mugly. Looked incredibly fun.
Ah. I love a good spin. Expecially when I am getting dizzy just watching from home. Also do you barrel race at all?
not since high school….
Anybody that knows the internet at all knows that moderation is key. Every successful forum has mods, however, they only usually block the occasional Troll. The internet is not a nice place, there are going to be more than a few people that are happy to insult you. If someone has a completely pointless and OT comment, their comment does not deserve to make the cut. However, I do think that you need to gain some internet prowess, Mugly. Your blog has a huge audience, and many people do and will disagree with you. You have to realize that it is the internet. If someone calls you an idiot, or flames your favorite breed, I could totally understand why you would become offended by that. But, if their comment is on topic to the subject and has some merit to it, you should not block that. Like the comment you chose for this days topic. I did not think that that was one to be blocked. Sure, their language was harsh, but they were really only disagreeing with you. The comment was on topic, and relevant towards the blog. There could have been a nice debate where someone could have learned the correct way to tie a horse for an extended period of time. Just be careful, some things may offend you but they still have a place on this blog. If you want any guide for modding, I would suggest reading the Something Awful forum rules. It’s one of the most successful and well modded forums out there.
Which would be why I put it up and explained the whole deal. Is there some confusion here?
i god call. There is a DIFFERENCE between disagreeing with the content of the day’s blog and hurling abuse at the author. I prefer to visit blogs and forums that are moderated. Many people have pointed out the value in comments moderation. This is not a blog anybody has to pay money to read. If it doesn’t suit you don’t read it.
Anonimity brings out the worst in some folks. I’d rather avoid them.
*big pout: I can’t view the video from here at work. And my home computer is in the hospital at the moment. POOP!
Count me in for free speech. I’ve always found that a person’s own words are the best to save them or damn them, as the case may be. Generally, if someone is an asshat they will end up sounding that way.
I wonder if all the people opposed to moderation would remain so if the comments were directed at them? Direct and personal insults don’t add anything to the debate or conversation so why should they be posted? And as anyone can clearly see from reading the other comments ont his post, Mugly is still posting comments that go against what she said. Moderation is needed, Mugly doesn’t need to have people bashing her for the sake of bashing her, and honestly I wouldn’t even want to read it. I like reading different opinions but maybe we could all try to be adults about it?
“I wonder if all the people opposed to moderation would remain so if the comments were directed at them? Direct and personal insults don’t add anything to the debate or conversation so why should they be posted?”
Very true! People are all for “leave every word in, don’t change it, let it all hang out”…until some of that venom is directed at them!
So, when you’re cutting a cow, are you actively guiding the horse, or do you basically sit there and let the horse do the cutting.
Love the bra cam!
When you cut you guide until you have singled out the cow, then put your hand down and let the horse go to work. We were schooling, so our hands were in there positioning, in my case getting my horse stopped between turns, or just getting in the way, depending on the moment.
For everyone who’s worried about moderation: Let’s wait and see how this actually plays out. It looks like Mugly’s planning to do a minimal amount of editing just to keep the really useless stuff at bay. If she gets heavy-handed with the filtering, we’ll find out. Setting some basic standards of behavior – no trolling and no flaming – tends to encourage vigorous debate, not hinder it. We’ll see what happens.
BayHorseGirl:
From the article above:
“I recently ignored a comment loaded with lots of vitriol and heavy with insults. When the writer wrote back asking me how I dare not print her insults I laughed my manaical, control freak laugh and began to hit the delete button.
BUT! She had a point. There was a valid question buried in amongst all her dire threats and assumptions about my education and intelligence. So I printed the question, minus the insulting crap.”
So, yes, the comment Mugly has posted about should have been allowed in the comments section; however, what you are reading is NOT the comment that was left on the blog. I’m assuming that comment had a lot more inappropriate, personal attacks that Mugly edited out and we have not seen (incidentally, Mugs, it might be a good idea to let people actually see what she had written).
Basically, Mugly wanted to delete the comment because it was insulting, but realized it did have a point, so she edited out the insulting crap and posted the comment IN ITS OWN FREAKING POST so that everyone could see it. I really don’t see how there’s anything wrong with that kind of censorship.
I read her original post to say that someone else (not the post she showed) had written an inflammatory, bashing “question” and then got all uppity when she didn’t post it. Mugly then, in her own words, “printed the question, minus the insulting crap.” I am under the assumption there were two different posts; I did not find the post that questioned Mugly’s tying methods to be particulerly rude or obnoxious, just ignorant and, as such, I did not believe it was a good example of a post that should be moderated or censored.
Maybe I was wrong about the posts. -shrugs- My overall point remains the same.
You didn’t notice anything that should be moderated because it had already been moderated. Here’s how Mugs handled it:
“I recently ignored a comment loaded with lots of vitriol and heavy with insults. When the writer wrote back asking me how I dare not print her insults I laughed my manaical, control freak laugh and began to hit the delete button.
BUT! She had a point. There was a valid question buried in amongst all her dire threats and assumptions about my education and intelligence. So I printed the question, minus the insulting crap.”
I heard a joke once about a pair of twins, one of which was eternally optimistic while the other was a pessimist. To confirm this assessment of their personalities, their parents gave the optimist a pile of horse manure for his birthday, while the optimist received a very expensive radio controlled car. The pessimist reacted predictably, saying that he would have preferred an airplane. The parents found the optimist digging eagerly through the manure pile. When asked why he would do this, he exclaimed, “With all that manure, there’s gotta be a pony in there somewhere!”
In the case of the agitated commenter, Mugs chose to free the pony from the manure pile. There was a good comment buried in that manure, and I’m glad she did the digging so I didn’t have to deal with all that crap.
Sorry, typo. I meant they gave the optimist the manure pile, and the pessimist got the rc car.
At my house the optimist would have got the manure pile and the pessimist would have been sent to her room.
I used to ride in the “Shawnee National Forest” on the 9-Day Trail Ride (which some of you may recall), and we tied up our horses every evening, and we NEVER had any problems, and there were plenty of us! As for horses “having” to lie down…they are flight animals, and laying down is not totally in their psyche! Because it renders them helpless for a short time! I applaud Mugly’s trip, and what she’s doing and has done. I do NOT feel she was out of line.
Most horses DO spend 3 – 4 hours a day lying down, but if you tie them right and they’re well-schooled in tying, they’ll lie down. I bet your horse did while you were asleep….
I recently did a trail riding weekend in the Hoosier National Forest, and while Brown Co. State Park features hitching posts (where I camped as a teenager), the place we stayed at this time had covered open-air 8×8 stalls. Oh, and an air-conditioned cabin about 30′ away. PERFECT.
Let me add, for those who would “vilify” my answer, yes the horses were used during the day, but I would assume Mugly’s horses are being let loose or being excercised/worked on a daily basis. Again, I say “good for her!”
OT, but can these really be purebred arabs, if they have paint markings?
http://www.khartoonkhlassic.com/
According to Wickpedia – “Among the breeds that excluded such horses were the Arabian horse and American Quarter Horse registries. However, modern DNA testing has revealed that some breeds do possess genes for spotting patterns, such as a non-SB-1 sabino pattern in Arabians, and sabino, overo, and tobiano in Quarter Horses. Therefore, these registries have modified their rules, allowing horses with extra white, if parentage is verified through DNA testing, to be registered.”
Queengwennypoo:
Yes, Khartoon Khlassic is a purebred. He is DNA tested in order to be registered. There as some really in-depth research books by Mary Jane Parkinson that are heavily documented including photographs. There were the occassional pariti colored Arabians way-back-when. Certain lines which are heavy into Crabbet and Sabino coat patterns can produce a LOT of white including belly spots if bred back to each other. Khartoon Khlassic is unique in that he is a fabulous dark mahogany bay. (I think he is also Khemo bred) There was also a lot of white in the Khemosabi horses espsecially when bred to chestnut Crabbets. Our foundation stallion was a Crabbet chestnut with three white socks, large blaze and tiny belly spot. He was also interested in Cattle, Trail, Country English to the “original basic standard”, did Dressage, and Native Costume and Drove. He was also sporatic when producing white. The mare in my avitar is his daughter and she is considered a dilute sabinio. NO white socks, short narrow blaze, with the marbling pattern on her hind quarters which got her considered a half appy-Arab in some circles due to the pattern. She is DNA and Blood tested as purebred. We owned both of her purebred parents as well. Color genteics is very fascinating to study with all of the variations. Nature is such a wonderful artist.
With continued regards to the moderations, etc. There were a number of names-handles, etc in the original FHOTD-blogspot. Some of us made or kept ours for a variety of reasons. In my case… our barn just happens to be less than 100 feet behind our house………… Which accounts for my “name” dispite the fact we have not bred any mares in over five years due to the economy. Snarky tounge-in-cheek wizecracks sorta comes to mind as did the blogspot I wrote, which has not been visited in several years. Iffin ya don’t like it, don’t read it. 31 years in lawenforcement sort of makes me immune to bully-ing, snarly remarks, and stupidity from those who prefer to hide behind the internet…. however, threaten me, my horses or family with physical violence and that is an entire ‘nother matter. Back when around five plus years ago, when I started following Fugly/Cathy…. there were some really ugly trolls out there. Still are on other sites…
Khartoon Klassic is super duper famous, super duper beautiful, and simply carries the sabino gene.
He’s thrown some really strikingly colored, well-conformed babies.
Personally, I think this mania for separating breeds based on percentage of white is just a silly Victorian conceit about “purity.” I believe that the APHA and the AQHA should be rolled into one registry, since APHA is simply made up of Quarter Horses with “too much” white. Dude, the foundation stock of the AQHA is riddled with horses of unknown heritage anyway, and the whole damn registry is less than 75 years old.
It would also help the poor crop-out paint foals from simply being considered “breeding stock”.
Just wanna weigh in and say that Mugs is hands down my favorite “horse writer” on the internet. And I’m (at least a quasi) dressage person
I greatly appreciate the way she runs the ragged edge of “humane” issues, while firmly keeping a foot planted in the legit “show” world. Rather than retreating to our separate camps, we really need more of this intelligent discourse that questions what we do and why we do it.
To those who question unmoderated comments — have you *tried* to read the comments on the news/political sites? Regardless of which side you are on politically, those sites invariably devolve into ad hominem attacks, and “well you’re one too!” types of arguments, which help no one — and certainly don’t further the discussion. That’s a sad reality.
Yes, I was thinking of that exactly! I would hate to see this blog devolve to the level of most news and political discussion sites. They’re a perfect example of a lot of heat and extremely little light. I’m not sure why moderating discussions gets such a reflexive ‘OMG EVIL’ reaction. The US has made a fetish of freedom, but allowing trolls and unproductive bashing sessions to take over the discussion would be cutting off our collective nose to spite our face. (Now if only someone would take that message to Congress, we’d be in really good shape.)
So Mugwump, although you did comment on the matter of moderatign posts, I notice you carefully sidestepped the actual issue, which is that you tie your horses to trees for days at a time. The person who posted that comment was right about horses needing to move around for hoof and gut health, and needing to lie down. Less waffilng about moderation, more answers please!
I miss the real Fugly. Voting with my feet now.
Oh for goodness sakes……. Horses are tied up all over the world for 2 days at a time. Its called amateur competition…….Id didnt kill those thousands!
After the debacle of the infamous Weekend of 3500 Posts, or whatever, Fugly started moderating. She kind of HAD to, since she started receiving random death threats, wordy insults, etc. that the rest of the world finds pretty boring.
With freedom of speech comes responsibility.
Anyway, taking youngsters out into the real world is the best training of all, and it’s FUN! Of course if you’re working cows you don’t have much choice….
Maybe I’ll be able to watch the video later.
My lazy old horse gets perky and lively and HAPPY outside the ring.
Wow, wow, wow. That comment about how crazy you are to tie your horse to a tree for a day or two…just wow. It never ceases to amaze me how QUICK horse people are to jump all over, under, and on top of the most innocuous statements in order to prove how much more horse saavy they are. I am on a local area riders email forum and the same thing happens about once a week. Someone posts something with no ill intentions and next thing you know its an all out email war, each email featuring more colored fonts, bigger text size, and more capitals, until the forum hits overload and is frozen for a few days. What is the point?? I own and ride horses for my own pleasure (and pain) and have zero interest in what outside parties have to say about me and mine. That is not to say I don’t appreciate LEARNING things, intelligent and well-intended advice is always welcome. But opinions. Take em, roll em up tight, and shove em.
I’m an endurance rider who goes to competition rides once a month and always ties my horse to the trailer. So shoot me. Do I tie the horses head high and tight and leave him there for two days except when I’m galloping him 30+ miles? UM no. Tie the horse safely, take him for frequent walks, etc etc. MANY competing and successful long distance endurance riders do this. I have a sneaky feeling that’s what Mugly did too. But the good ole professional guide just had to give you what for coz she knows better. Thanks for nothing, jacka$$.
As time goes on and we get to know each other I’m guessing I’ll develop thicker skin and people will learn I always answer questions when asked. “Asked” being the key word here. Ahem.
Mugs says:
“…The theory is to keep the blog on track, without falling back into the out of control mess that almost closed FHOTD down a few years ago. So, any personal attacks, insults, or wildly off the mark comments aren’t posted.
I recently ignored a comment loaded with lots of vitriol and heavy with insults. When the writer wrote back asking me how I dare not print her insults I laughed my manaical, control freak laugh and began to hit the delete button…”
Mugs, I agree with you and support you wholeheartedly on this. Nothing is more tiring than email venom–and it is very hard to just let it roll off the back and ignore it. I own a business with an online presence and see my own fair share of out-of-left-field email attacks. It is amazing what people feel they can post or email if they know they can be anonymous. But trying to counter this sort of thing usually wastes time and energy. Delete! Delete!
Right on, Blazentango. So, Izzypie and the original poster probably think living in a 12×12 stall counts as “movement”? LOL about the health of the gut and the digital cushion. I agree with FreedomTreeless, people who take their unfit pasture potatoes out and yahoo them are the ones your animus should be directed towards. There’s your mechanical founder. There’s your myositis.
JMO on methods of housing away from home-as someone who originally opted for a portable galvanized corral panel system, it took me years to decide that tying to the trailer was perfectly acceptable for endurance horses, as long as they have attentive owners who take them for frequent walks particularly after the event including the middle of the night–and I’ve done that myself. The advent of Hi-Tie devices which mimic the effect of high lines allowed more movement, yet of course horses can get into trouble with those too. A trainer friend uses a nautical shackle to roll back and forth between an anchored line on her gooseneck horse trailer as a way to teach tying, cheap and effective, an anxious horse can move from side to side or swivel their butts, but can’t move forwards or backwards. Anyway, Mugs’ horses are trained to be on a line for hours at a time. With more CA cases of EHV-1, I wouldn’t put one of my horses in a pen at a fairgrounds now nor share a water source there for anything. Mine will be healthier at their own trailer.
Bottom line: I’m to lazy and/or cheap to take over the Fugly Blog. Mugs wasn’t- she can do as she wants. If you don’t like it- stop reading, get off your butt and do your own blog. If it is interesting I may go read it too.
That said- I enjoy seeing the occasional crazy post simply to remind me that there really are people that wacked out writing in. It also lets me know the kind of trash someone doing the work of running a blog like this goes through. But I also don’t want to waste all my time with the crazies….or ()#$ enlargement LOL.
As for the crazy comment posted: I believe there is a saying about pornography that is something like “I can’t describe it, but I know it when I see it.” Same goes for horses and horse training- sometime you have to use good old common sense and think- “Does this make me uncomfortable to watch, do I feel like I am watching an animal in pain..” and a reasonable person can make that judgement. There will ALWAYS be some folks that insist the Coke advertisement ice cubes have sex images in them? It is a reflection of their own issues…no necessarily reality. And there will always be folks that don’t believe we should actually USE animals.
The video made me a little dizzy but you were having so much fun you made me want to try it! And I love that fuzzy mane and those cute little ears!
Regarding the angry commenter’s post, I have a case I would like to discuss with you. At the barn where I ride, there are usually a couple of horses that have to stay at the cross-ties for an extended period of time, either because of medical reasons (they are being submitted to a treatment that requires they cannot move too much or lie down) or because the barn gets overcrowded at one time or another. Now these cross-ties are provided with water and feed troughs, bedding, the horses can move to an extent and bend their necks, but they can’t lie down of course. Yet I’ve never seen any of the horses end up with any physical problems or added stress from not being able to lie down. But I’m no equine expert, so I would like to hear your thoughts on this.
Horses need to lie down. Standing without relief will get to them, mentally and health-wise. Short periods of standing tied only teaches them good things, too long and you’re asking for problems.
I forgot to mention, these horses do get turn out time. They are not kept in stalls 24/7.
I can’t read all the comments but I have to say, I enjoyed your posts. All my horses tie and stay put whereever I park them. I’ve been sort of amused at people who have a thrombo over their horse having to tie and moving around. Helicopter owners drive horses nuts and so, I think, precipitate a lot of “bad” behavior.
Anyway, I’ll keep reading and don’t let numbnuts get you down.
Perhaps some “Fugly” fans are voting with their feet, but just want to say that as a result of your stewardship of this blog, I’ve become a huge fan of your other blog, and your “Mort” and “Big K” stories were just what the doctor ordered for me after a lousy week. So thank you.
The spinning made me dizzy, but man, what a fun ride. Thanks for the vicarious thrill!
Ok video riding makes me queasy ! But if I ever get to the USA, can I come riding at your place – please ?
I know that I don’t want to have to sort through all the comments to separate the crap from the posts worth reading, especially after the disasters before Cathy began moderating. As another poster pointed out, moderating doesn’t automatically meaning deleting… it means surveying the post for quality and relevance to the blog/issue at hand. Feeding the trolls only encourages juvenile behavior and comments that detract from the topic and end up causing a lot of bickering, as many of the long-time FHOTD readers have witnessed first hand. People have a tendency to overreact and get much nastier on the internet from behind the anonymous safety of their computer screens than they would in a real life confrontation. Really, when is bickering over pride any way to spend our time when we could be focusing on a more relevant issue?
I also appreciate that Mugly even bothered to “pull the pony from the manure pile” and present the valid point that was buried in the unnecessary and snotty insults. It’s her blog now, so she could easily just have deleted all of it and not taken the time to let us see it, sans the crap, and then watched all of us react and blow up in our own silly ways. As another poster also said, let’s see how it goes before we immediately start judging how “bad” the moderating will be before it’s barely happened.
As for tying, I always appreciate a horse that’s solidly trained on ground tying. A good friend of mine has an incredible and adorable Arab gelding that’s she owned since his young years, and that horse will not move if she tells him not to, even if an excited herd of other horses go tearing past in the paddock nearby or if a dog runs under him. This gelding’s attitude is “Mom wants me to be a park bench now, I’ll be a park bench!” And he parks it; if she were to leave him alone for an extended period of time, he would still be there on her return, just watching the world go by and enjoying being a pretty sight. He just hangs and doesn’t flinch because he has complete confidence in his mom. That is a training quality to be admired.
I think the legal issue about moderating is less about denying people their free speech, and more about if the blog is moderated, that makes the blog owner “responsible” for the comments that are posted. So if the blog owner is editing comments but leaves in a comment that advises horse owners to treat colic by injecting motor oil into the jugular (or some other similar nonsense) and somebody’s horse dies because the owner followed such idiotic advice, then the blog owner could be sued.
I’m no legal expert, but if this is true, maybe just putting some sort of disclaimer on the home page would make Mugs safe to continue judicious moderation? Because I also enjoy a good debate when people disagree, but if I want crazy I’ll go to “People of WalMart.