Can I make a Facebook Group for Stupid Americans Supporting Mexican Slaughterhouses?
Feb 04 2010
More $50 stud fees…because America doesn’t have enough Crappaloosas!
(For the newbies, I don’t hate Appaloosas but that’s what we call the low-end ones around here!)
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http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/ghostwind+forest+tlc His parents both been color coat tested by university of california-davis,he is homozydous for black-his coat color is EEaa which is: EE = NO RED FACTOR DETECTED CAN NOT HAVE RED FOALS.REGARDLESS of the color of the mate.Basic color is Black/bay or brown in the absence of other modifying genes.aa =only recessive allele detected black pigment distributed uniformly basic color is black in the absence of other modifing genes .My other stallion .http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/eagle+rockledge+tlc His parents both been color coat tested by university of california-davis,he is homozydous for black-his coat color is EEaa which is: EE = NO RED FACTOR DETECTED CAN NOT HAVE RED FOALS.REGARDLESS of the color of the mate.Basic color is Black/bay or brown in the absence of other modifying genes.aa =only recessive allele detected black pigment distributed uniformly basic color is black in the absence of other modifing genes.The father to both these stallions is BBR My Real King . His color producing, and in particular his leopard producing abilities are a lot higher than the normal formula of statistics for color production. King has at least SEVEN strong leopard bloodlines including Bandido, Money Creeks Rockledge, Prince Plaudit, Bambi E, KK’s Snowcat, Sundance, Dude Dandy Jnr; and many other lines including Mansfield Comanche, Joker B, Shavano (Patchy-Knobby), Starbuck Leopard x 3, Ha-Dar-Shado (Wapiti), Abdull, Chief Navajo (Painter), Snow Cloud-Iron Cloud (Nez Perce Reservation) and many more….I was lucky enough to buy these 2 stallion from http://theleopardcentre.webs.com/foundationmares.htm Here u can see the mares and stallion The parents of my 2 stallions.I have had both these guys since they were 5 months old.I will breed only to registered mares.I am only charging 50 dollars for stud fee this year 2010. Contact growembig41@msn.com
I headed over to the impressive-sounding Leopard Centre to see what they had over there. This paragraph caught my eye right off:
“King” does not stand to outside mares for the simple reason that I dont have facilities that I consider good enough to look after mares and foals that dont belong to me. No, I dont live in a junkyard and no i dont have barbed wire, but I would feel badly about having an outside mare or foal hurt or injured while here so I just dont do it.”
Oooookay lady, so you are more concerned about the safety of other people’s mares and foals than your own? I can’t decide if that is admirable or disturbing. I think it might be both.Â
Not everything she says about breeding and conformation is wrong but it’s peppered with splashes of total ignorance like: “I definately dont want ‘Impressive’ quarter horse bloodlines, or ‘poco bueno’ – both carry defective genes.” Actually, plenty of them do not carry what you’re talking about. They have this amazing thing called testing which I know you know about since you color-test like mad and the same labs do both kind of tests. But again, overall, she’s not all bad and I like some of her horses and she does ride them. The big problem here is that she sold two ungelded colts to Mr. GrowEmBig who is now going to stud them out at $50 a pop to people like the unemployed pregnant girl I put on here a few weeks ago who wants to breed her mare when she can’t afford to pay for the mare’s needs to begin with. That is a recipe for disaster — and a great way to fill the slaughter trucks. Heck, google his e-mail address – he is selling horses for $200 or trying to trade them for a truck or hay! Yeah, buddy. You’re EXACTLY what we need more of in the horse business. More broke asshats trying to put beer money in their pockets pimping out their done-nothing, no-name stallions. Ugh. Folks, geld your non-stallion-quality colts BEFORE they leave your property. You won’t regret it!
225 comments to “Can I make a Facebook Group for Stupid Americans Supporting Mexican Slaughterhouses?”
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Cathy, Santa Rosa County Horse Assistance Council, is filing the paperwork for a $3,000 grant from ASPCA to geld stallions in our county. If you know anyone there, we would appreciate the support. It will cost the owner $50 or free depending on their needs. We hope to be able to geld 20 or 30 of them with this grant if we get it. We have a waiting list at the present time. We plan to castrate 5 at a time. Our vet held a silent auction at his Christmas Party and raised $1,700 for castration clinics. We have already done two (a pony and a mini), scheduling the actual clinics for mid-February. We are doing our part. Also, we have an organization here called bukubuks.com, they give $500 to 501c3 charities in the two counties (Escambia and Santa Rosa). If any readers would like to go vote for us, you can vote every day. We hope to get the $500 to castrate some more of these back yard stallions. We have been castrating without regard to financial need as we feel that every one gelded is great, whether someone could afford to do it and chose not to spend the money or whether there is a financial hardship.
I don’t have any special connections, but that’s great – everybody, go vote! Gelding is always a beautiful thing!
Last year I had my yearling gelded at a gelding clinic. The vet discounted his price and offered the service for $110. If you wanted all shots and wolf teeth extracted also, it cost $160. He and a vet friend of his gelded 25 horses that day – some that were as old as 5 or 6. They probably did not make any money, but they sure provided a much needed service. I don’t know if they are doing it again this year, but I have another colt who will turn 1 this year and he is headed to the vet soon for the same procedure. I called the same vet (even though it is a 1 1/2 hour drive) to take my boy in (even though he is a PAINT – think of all the money I could make!) and found out his normal price is only $160 for the procedure! Holy crap, I wish I had more colts I could geld!
Anyhow, I hate this time of year, because this is when you really see the horse freaks out in full force, pimping out whatever crap they have in their back yard, trying to make a buck off of them. And not to mention the stupid mare owners who want a fugly so bad they will pay a $50 stud fee for a 2 year old who isn’t even done growing yet, and yet are too __________ (fill in the blank) to just go to the auction and pick one up <$50 and you have immediate gratification.
Fugs: On People’s Court today, there was a case involving a rescue in Oregon run by a girl named Kristin. Kristin was being sued for breach of contract involving a breeding. After watching the episode and doing a little Googling, I’m pretty sure the defendant is the same person you outed in your July 23, 2009 blog (Kristin Early). You might want to check it out–the judge gave this woman a tongue lashing!
I know, I know! Someone is going to send me the video. I hear it was reality gold…idiot was bawling and whining about how she was the victim. Uh, NO. The horses you STARVED are the victims. You are just a whiny cow who is upset she got caught.
I posted the video of Kristina Early (AKA-The whining cow) on Youtube. I can email it to you, but it is a big file so i would have to use gigasize to send it to you. And the whiny cow comment was right on! Actually, I think she looked like she had a couple buffalos fighting under her shirt when she was waddling through the court. I mean damn…I’m a big girl too but at least I feed my damn horses. If I had to choose between my cheeseburger and hay for the kids i would feed them first. Looks like she kept choosing the cheeseburgers while the horses starved. I have no pity for people that can obviously overfeed themselves but let their animals suffer and starve. They are worse than the people who truly can’t afford it.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=forfuglyreaders&search_type=&aq=f
Santa Rosa Horse Council!
Hi again, do you have a link to the site for voting?
Our (backinthesaddleproject.com)first gelding clinic is this month. 5 vets volunteered their time the cost is $50 per horse and the vets WANT to make it a monthly thing . I love our vets!
I think I shall serve the vets Spaghetti with no balls for dinner.
I still can’t get that bukubuks.com link to work for voting on the contest that Etesianecho (Santa Rosa Horse Council) mentioned or find anything about it . If anyone was able to get it to work could you please give me a hint how. Florida definatly needs as much help with horses that they can get and I’d like to at least help SRHC this way.
LOL! Spaghetti with no balls! That’s priceless.
HAHAHA!!!!!!!
I just snorted and laughed hot chocolate all over my desk! Thanks
That is great that your vets are willing to do that and on such a regular basis. In the summer you could serve hot dogs
Amen Fugly!!!
And for the record, this Appaloosa Breeder is NOT offended by the blog today. We need these types to go bye-bye!
Thanks!
Carrie Giannandrea
Dances with Horses
Formula One Farms
Carrie… I’ve been to your website – you breed FABULOUS horses!!
IMO, coat color testing is f%$#@&* pointless. Unless someone wants to blow $$ to satisfy their curiosity (which is their privilege). Coat color is the least important contributor to a horse’s potential, and all the drama and focus on it (and other trivial crap) distracts from important considerations in horse selection and breeding decisions, like soundness, overall balance/correct conformation, trainable attitude, I could list more but you get the drift. This approach has contributed to where we are now in the horse industry and from what I see a whole ‘nuther generation of potential owners/breeders are being raised to continue this nonsense. I have given up being optimistic.
Amen. I’ll never color test, just on principle.
Coat color testing provides money and training to the schools that do it, which can be put into the more useful, less shiny testing. Do you think scientists do things like glow in the dark bunnies just for fun? Nope, it gets eyes on their work and grant money in their pockets, which pay for the more complicated things these are proof of concept for. Plus some coat color genes are possibly/definitely linked to hereditary defects, like frame overo/OLWS and silver/that eye defect.
Actually the world of science is big, fast-paced, and I am certain that scientists keep things like testing for coat color variations (the basis of which in some cases is conserved across species even to mouse and man) versus really novel science-science that really advances understanding of disease mechanisms and treatments in a very clear perspective. In fact that is sort of the way one would hope horse owners/breeders keep in perspective things that are important for health, soundness, service or function versus things that are incidental, like colors.
It is important to test for mutations that cause or are linked to disorders (OLWS is one such example). If you cannot tell based on phenotype whether your horse is heterozygous for frame, and it is a concern, then you really SHOULD test (I think of this test as being for aganglionosis rather than being for coat color per-se). Obviously, if you have a classic frame then testing is fairly moot. However, I have seen many owners run endless color tests, while simply refusing to test for HERDA, PSSM, GBED. These are real problems and they are perpetuated by this ridiculous approach.
Wouldn’t it be nice if the places who test for color only do it as part of a COMPREHENSIVE genetics markers test?
That way, OK, you can see if your mare is homozygous for Color DuJour, but only because it’ll be bundled with a HERDA, HYPP, ETC. package. Regardless of breed, I think, just to make a workable standard.
Color testing I guess is useful for a 200-level Genetics course, or even in high school, as street-level science.
OLWS is a pattern not a colour, whole different thing.
ASD is not proven to be associated with Silver.
It is thought it might be, but it is way, way from proven.
I would like to have a glow in the dark bunny. I am afraid of the dark and feel that I could fix my fear and the lack of rabbit problem all at once. Please direct me towards the school that creates these wonderful decorative, tasty egg delivering creatures.
Thanks.
Personally I feel that it is totally irresponsible for color to NOT be a consideration. Especially in Paints. Breeding stock paints (especially colts) have considerably less value and are at a much greater risk for becoming grade when a seller doesn’t see value in the papers and doesn’t pass them along with the horse.
But even with Quarters, it is just a fact that some colors are more marketable than others. So I do think that should be a CONSIDERATION. By no means should color trump other functional qualities, it needs to be kept in the proper place. But as I breeder, I do like to be able to consider the options.
I guess at times I am on the opposite side of popular opinion. BUT I see nothing wrong with color testing AS LONG as you breed for quality. I know that a lot of the time people only breed for color and quality goes out the window, but can you blame them when they see what type of horse is winning in the show ring? A lot of times it is the “flashy” colored horses. You see the palominos, buckskins, cremellos, roans, grullas, etc…. that catch the judges eye and a lot of the time its the flashy ones that place above all else. In the paint world the more white the better.
When you are watching 30 horses go around the ring, which one catches your eye? The chestnut one? Or the golden palomino? And sadly a lot of the time the flashy ones are HORRIBLY put together.
When I think color testing is appropriate is when you have a QUALITY stallion that has points, conformation and function and hey as an added bonus he is homozygous for color AND black (or cream, or what-have-you)
But I DO agree that its ridiculous to test for color and NOTHING else. But I will say at least she is doing something to prevent more HYPP or HERDA horses from entering the world. (even though she isnt helping horse population).
I agree that it is indeed to breed for color and quality in all other traits. The problem is that far too many color breeders forget about all the other traits and focus only on color, as does the person who is the subject of today’s blog. One just has to be impressed with that person’s command of English language also. It is so classy—not. This is absolutely the sort of person who should not even own horses, let alone be breeding them.
I definitely agree that she shouldn’t be breeding horses. She is one of those that is about color and NO quality (frankly shes more about consistent color and QUANTITY). I just wish more breeders, that IF they decide to breed for color, would first overlook the color to the conformation and quality of a horse. As it has been said a good horse can be a bad color, but a bad horse can be a good color. Its just sad that flashy color is what is winning in show classes (refer to the previous blog entry) and not good, FUNCTIONAL, conformation (you know a horse with legs that dont look like posts, good feet, good shoulder, a back that doesn’t look like you could go sledding from the rump to the withers, etc….)
I agree 100% about the flashy color vs. boring debacle, but there is also a flip side to this story. A great many really talented cutters, reiners or working cow horses right now are pretty colors due to the fact that Shining Spark is palomino, Peptoboonsmal is roan, and Hollywood Dun It was buckskin. Sometimes the color follows the talent.
Likewise I think the arguement can be made that many talented pleasure horses are “boring” colors like sorrel or bay due to the fact that a lot of the really outstanding sires are boring colors like sorrel or bay. Then again I have always seen the buckskin/palomino registries as cop outs for horses that are fugly enough to not compete in breed circuits.
I agree here. I boarded at a barn that bred paints for a while and I know they color tested. BUT they bred for quality above all else. They just wanted to have that info available to customers if they asked. Their stud was a solid chestnut with just a little extra white on the face and legs….I was actually going to breed my mare to him because he was beauitfully put together and double registered in AQHA and APHA and, YES, had a PERFORMANCE record as well as a halter record. PLUS he was an ABSOLUTE GENTLEMAN. My mare is also very well put together, but I chose not to breed because she’s a little bit of a spaz and if you don’t handle her properly she is dangerous, and I didn’t want a foal that was the same way. She’s a nice mare, but is a sensitive mare that has been handled harshly in the past and has special handling needs and I did want to breed to sell. If the foal had turned out the same because of the way mom was, I wouldn’t be able to sell. She also has an extreme fear of vets, as that’s who I believe did a lot of the rough handling on her as a youngster, and if she needed help during delivery, I could see her killing that baby trying to get away from the vet. I decided it was just all around a situation I would rather avoid. She is a cute little performance mare, and in this economy, there are plenty of nice horses out there selling for cheap. I could get a nice 2 year old prospect today for about $5000 that would normally be around $20,000, so why take the chance??
I agree, it is irresponsible to only be concerned with color. However, all you need to do is to also look at any “color” horse you are considering breeding to/from and see what is show record is. If he/she’s got halter and performance points out the wazoo, as well as a proven record of siring/producing likewise offspring, I am all for it. However, if you look at a web site that looks like the only good thing they can say about their stallion/mares is their pretty color, well, then there is the the difference. One is in it for the long haul, has done their homework, has put in the time and money to show their stallion, and offspring and the other one only has a handful of paperwork from a lab in which they paid $25 for. Huge difference in the type of breeders they are. And, one charges $1000 stud fees and the other $50 and the mare owner gets what they pay for. And, unfortunatly, the more expensive foal is not always the winner in life. The “better” can not be up the the BNTs expectations and the foal is dumped at a sale, and the “poorer” foal could end up with a 4-Her who thinks the sun rises and sets on it. The odds are in the better foal’s favor, but not always. I’ve seen plenty of weanlings go thru the sale barn that shouldn’t be there, but are.That’s what’s scary about breeding horses, unless you breed to keep for yourself. A friend was given a foal at 1 day old. It was produced by a BNB who left it on the local vet school’s door step at one day old because one front foot turned out. Left it saying the school could use it for “research”. The foal was lucky as someone “saved” it and gave it to my friend who raised it on goat’s milk. Horse turned out to be fine. People do weird things, esp. when it comes to horses.
I’ve just developed two simple rules:
1) If you can’t spell it (“homozydous”) you shouldn’t be breeding
2) If you show absolutely *no* understanding of Appaloosa genetics, you shouldn’t be breeding (see Equus magazine this month – they do a great job of explaining it. Therefore, there is no such thing as having a higher incidence of color because you have 7 lines with a lot of color. It’s all in the genes baby, not the pedigree!)
Agrred! Nothing makes you look more like an huge moron when you breed apaloosa’s & you can’t even spell it.
Seriously? $50??? It is so worthless to stand a stallion for that amount. *Shakes head*
I am so sick of seeing stallions that having nothing to offer other than they are a a purty color or that they have good bloodlines. Along that line, I’m so tired of seeing people who breed horses with no common sense whatsoever.
Also, both of these colts are just barely two. And they’ve got some *fugly* ancestors!
Plus one of them is Black, and may, or may not spot out.
Cos, of course, I am going to book my mare into a stallion whose picture is that of a FOAL!!!!
Basically every single one of his ancestors since the world began could be covered in spots, if he has none, he will throw none.
Not strictly true.
He could have the Lp gene, which allows spots to happen, but none of the PATN genes which create the actual spots. Appaloosa markings are highly complicated genetically.
If a horse does not have spots but *does* have striped hooves and mottled skin, and is from Appaloosa lines, it has Lp and can produce spots. Of course, breeding a solid horse with Lp to a solid horse without Lp is a major gamble. (Breeding a solid horse with Lp to a sabino gives a rather higher chance, as Sa1, the dominant sabino gene, is also a PATN gene).
Not saying this horse should be bred, just wanted to note it’s more complicated than that.
There is not one shred of proof for what you are saying.
There should be.
But there isn’t.
All this Lp this and PATN that drives me nuts.
It is educated guesswork, nothing more.]
Find a test and then we will all know for sure!
Writen like a true inbred trailer-dwelling cousin-humping redneck. She uses big words and tries real hard to make it sound good, but her rambling ad peppered with idiotic statements and the use of text message spelling (like “U” for “you”) shows her true “colors”- pun intended. And all that name-dropping makes her sound like the horse-world equvilant of some LA pool boy dropping names in a hot dance club to try to get laid by a hot chick (I hung out at Diddy’s boy’s crib the other day…translation- I cleaned his cousin’s assistant’s nephew’s pool). I think the $50 stud fee says it all.
Thanks for the chuckle.
OMG – you’ve NAILED it!!!!!!
Sadly, there are many such “breeders” around here.
Could you start doing a “linkspam”, Fugly? One of the other big traffic blogs I frequent gets so much movie news (some of which just needs one or two lines to say all you need to say) that she makes “linkspams”, which are just links to news with minimal commentary once a week, for her commetariat to LOL over. Might cut down on your mail.
Oh good god, go to the menu and the gaited appaloosa site….browse through the ‘tigre’ or ‘tiger’ or whatever registries (all private)…..don’t miss the link to their own ‘rescue’….looking for money and all kinds of stuff, including a truck because theirs burned up in the pasture??
I am just “fascinated” (rolls eyes of sarcasm) with the fact that these colts are BARELY 2 years old, and probably not even that yet… They should earn the right to keep their manhood, and at 2 years old, there is NO way they have had a chance do that – of course, this guy obviously doesn’t care – he’s got “prity blak stalyuns with kuller!” Drives me nuts… is it illegal to geld horses in the middle of the night??? Sounds like a good job for a future vet – the silent gelder! LOL!
That’s an idea! I know back home we castrated the neighbor’s bull one year! The first time he came through the the fence I took him home… the second time we called the neighbor to come get him… and the third time we cut him and left him in our pasture!
What a good neighbor you are. We’d be enjoying steaks the second time around.
luvmybaytb- what?! what sterilization shot? is this in reference to a joke i missed or something real? where could i obtain such a thing? can average vets get hold of it? oh my, the excitement! not that i would use it, of course. certainly not on the paint stallion across the street, turned out with a minimum of 8 fugly unregistered mares year round. that same stallion that’s behind sagging barbed wire, who’s owner has been turned in to animal control by myself and all our neighbors? the one where the owner doesn’t live on the property? i surely would not use it there. so, ahem, how long does it last? (please oh please say it’s permanent).this stallion owner wouldn’t even call the vet, he sure didn’t when a 6 month old colt broke it’s leg (finally shot over 24 hours later with animal conrol standing by). foals are born and die there all the time. those that live are sold for a whopping $200, or, if solid color, $150. too bad a shot wasn’t used on the owner before he multiplied. anyway, if this is real, i really would like to get more info. please feel free to e-mail me at vsoejoto@yahoo.com with details.
A “drive-by gelding”! I love it
Or sneak them that sterilization shot… ooooo – they would wonder why their big boy was shooting blanks! XD People would never know what hit them!
I wonder if the breeder of these colts sold them with an agreement that they would be gelded?
LOL Crappaloosas, that’s funny; I never heard that one before.
Yea I’m in total agreement. I have friends with really nicely breed (or is it bread…) dumb bloods who in this economy can’t unload offspring from 3 years ago. Most are selling for far less than breeding cost let alone the cost of feeding/bedding them for 3 years.
Too many horses out there and you can’t make any money at it. The GF and I were talking about it last night. We would like to breed our mares. But in the end the right thing to do is pull another set of rescues out of a bad situation than add to the population. Its kinda sad personally I would have loved to seen what would have come out of them. 5 out of the 7 horses I have ever owned have been rescues from bad places.
That’s true- just for giggles I was looking at “Friesians” for sale on Equine Now- full blooded Friesians seem to be selling for about half what they were 5 years ago, and there are lots of $2500.00 “Friesian Sport Horse Foals”. Seems like a lot of people didn’t judge the market correctly.
I don’t know about Equine Now, but on Dream horse there’s a Friesian horse scam. The scammer posts pictures of nice looking Friesians that are probably worth at least $20,000 and pretends to sell them for a couple thousand. The victim pays for the horse sight unseen and gets nothing back. I wonder if those low-end Friesians you are seeing is more of the same.
Ugh, this sounds all to familiar to me =(
Even worse, my fugly Appaloosa (or crappaloosa I actually call him that too!) was born spotless (no characteristics whatsoever).
I took on my fugly foal project, and I hope he turns into somthing decent (*crossing my fingers*). I am teamed up already with a professional trainer, a super great boarding barn, and a good work ethic!
Sadly this blog is just a sad reminder of the other zillion fugly babies (of many breeds) out there that won’t get that chance.
Afterall, how many suckers… I mean people… out there are like me and are willing to sink tons of money into somthing thats not quality or as many people have to me ‘aren’t worth it’?
Me? I’m willing to take the chance, it makes me feel slightly good about myself giving the colt the opprotunity to shine… but I am aware he may never amount to anything.
But; I wish I didn’t have to do this. I wish he wasn’t born at all. I wish someone would shut his breeder down already (common already, they clean stalls once a week and keep horses in standing stalls besides the fact that they breed and breed fugly foals… sickening!).
I wish people like this had half the common sense that most of the people who reply here to your blog posts have.
Just for contrast: Have you guys heard that the owners of Moorlands Totilas (European Dressage Champion 2009) recently decided to stand him for stud as of 2010? And get this – the planned stud fee will be between 5000 and 5500 euro – that’s like 6900-7600 dollars! Mare owners who want to breed to Totilas will be assessed as only high quality mares will be allowed to bred to Totilas. So even if you have the money it’s no good if your mare is not good enough. But the thing is, even with these kind of demands and price range, I’m sure they will have a line waiting around the corner…
Full article: http://www.eurodressage.com/news/breeding/kwpn/2010/totilas.html
this is what happens when you breed Crappaloosas. With $50 stud fees just think how many of these there will be out there.
This one is local to me. Over 150 foals on the ground and only a $100 stud fee!
http://southjersey.craigslist.org/grd/1544339383.html
You can see a few of his half-starved babies here:
http://www.elfcreekfarm.com/My_Homepage_Files/Page3.html
From your link…look at this poor horse. This is a Superior Halter Horse. Look at the condition they’ve let him get into, and they still want $6500. Look at the TOES! Dream ON!
They should give him to a home that can afford to care for him. Oh, and no mention of his HYPP status either, although he goes back to a N/H horse.
I hate seeing horses as accomplished as this one end up in these situations. He has actually sired an APHA Youth Champion, so he’s not a dud as a stud. He is 18 years old. He might not be the next hot thing anymore, but he deserves more than to have to hobble around on feet that haven’t been done in six months or more. The excuse is “health problems.” Really? They must be awfully severe to prevent you from picking up the cell phone and calling a farrier. For fuck’s sake, a hoof trim is about $35. Don’t tell me you don’t have $35 or anything left in your home you could sell to make $35. This horse deserves a lot better.
Now, the link to the stallion you posted? That thing should have been a gelding a long time ago.
That poor stallion with the horrible feet! I’m glad you posted the more tasteful picture of him. Was it really necessary for the seller to show him with his penis dropped ??? Is that supposed to help sell him ???
Also, that breeder who doesn’t want any “Impressive” bloodlines….well, I understand the fears about the HYPP, it IS serious and devastating, BUT, she is missing out IMHO. I am blessed with a GORGEOUS, SAFE, SANE, WONDERFUL, Impressive bred, Palomino Paint, Master Peppi Bar, and he is HYPP N/N. He took wonderful care of me while I was regaining my confidence after a major horse riding accident and serious injury. He is worth his weight (approx 1400 lbs) in GOLD to me.
Yeah, I always have to call out people on Impressive bashing – I do own a horse with a cross to Impressive and he’s the best horse in the world (so says his mom…LOL!)
I probably wouldn’t go for a heavy Impressive bred myself. It depends. I do NOT like the over-muscled and small feet look that seems to characterize most Impressive lines…I like the look of, say, the Hancock line much better.
But then I’m not sure I’d buy a Quarter horse anyway. Although I dislike pure TBs, I do like animals with a *percentage* of TB to get the athleticism and the elastic movement, and those are easier to find in Paints. I do know an Appendix QH I honestly thought was a Trakehner when I first saw him, though.
But I’m not going to BASH the Impressive breds…there are certainly good ones out there. Just mostly not to my extremely finicky taste in horses.
Oh man… that is SO SAD.
He has a kind eye and a nice expression, too.
THANKS AQHA for encouraging overproduction. Truly the Wal-Mart of horse breed associations.
I know. I wonder what his story is? He’s a cute horse…he’s something I would want to rescue if he were nearby and if, of course, the price wasn’t ridiculous. Again, you DO NOT GET $6500 when the horse looks like that. It’s like trying to sell a mansion that has fallen into disrepair and has leaky plumbing and no heat and you still think it’s worth millions. Um, no. You have to maintain things in proper condition to keep their value up. That did not happen here.
I 10000000% agree with you!!
If I was to buy this guy, I’d want him x-rayed first. I knew a Saddlebred broodmare mare that had one hind foot left long like that. She had some kind of foot problem, and the trim kept weight off the sore spot somehow. It was around 40 years ago, and I can’t remember what the problem was, but it might have been navicular. So that would be something to think about…
It’s a shame. He looks like a really nice guy. His condition makes me wonder how many halter winners are on steroids; or about how they condition the poor things. I wonder what a halter horse’s showing “lifespan” is; does it relate to lameness from building those muscles?
Ah, the poor horses.
Sighing, Ruthie
They are conditioned by trotting on the lunge. Usually.
Actually usually they put them behind a 4-wheeler or pony them or some other from of working them at a brisk trot in straight lines. And some actually back them uphill to build up the hind end. Longing or circles build lean muscles rather than bulk.
Hmmm…the halter people i know lunge. And what I forgot about was ponying- they also do quite a bit of that.
The worst part is that they offer farrier services at their place, yet they can’t take care of their own horses’ feet.
http://www.elfcreekfarm.com/My_Homepage_Files/Page5.html
Farrier
We also offer professional farrier services. Our farrier has
been a professional for 2 years and grew up working along
side a professional farrier.
He offers shoeing and trims.
He will work with your miniture horse up to your draft horse
and anything in between.
He uses patience and kindness when working with your
horse.
Many references are available.
Contact us to schedual an appointment!!
Good catch. The stallion seems to be one they are listing for a friend, but if I had a friend in need and I was a farrier, I do believe I’d go do their horses feet for them!
they do sell adds for other people
Please see my post below!! This is not OUR horse!!!
Yeah, and you’ll notice that even though they are selling him “due to health problems and needing to reduce the herd”, they are STILL retaining breeding to him…WTF??? So if you buy him, you will still be under contract to breed yet more fuglies! You can’t do the right thing by doing the right thing!
Hi All. I want to clarify a few things since this has apparently gone a bit awry. First!! WE DO NOT ASSOCIATE WITH THESE PPL ANY LONGER!!! (the website is outdated by 4 years) The ONLY Reason this stallion was listed on OUR website is that we were trying desprately to get him a new home!!! WE DID NOT AND DO NOT OWN HIM NOR THINK HE WAS IN ACCEPTABLE CONDITION BY ANY STRETCH! NOR DO WE THINK THAT THE PHOTO OF HIM IS ACCEPTABLE!! The owners kept and still keep their horses in absolutely deplorable conditions!! They are always “getting out of the breeding business” yet continue to have foals every year. How, I’m not sure due to the serious lack of nutrition they receive. Despite our efforts to assit them and do every thing in our power to help the horses, its almost impossible to keep up with the hooves of a herd of 25-30 horses ( most of them barely handleable) when you live over an hour from the owners farm and each have full time jobs. And with the owners unwilling to pay for the proper feed, take the time to work with their horses and animal control considering that the food water and shelter was adaquet we could no longer do anything for these horses.
This stallion has since been rehomed. I do not know where nor do I know what condition he is currently in. I wish there was more we could have done and I can’t begin to describe the conditions of the horses and the farm. As of last time I checked they had finally dropped the price of one of our AQHA stallions (who we rescued/purchased from them and who is now a gelding) 06′ colts to $500!!! Going on 4 years old unbroke and in awful condition he was previously listed at $4000. They always put outrageous prices on their horses. They bred and breed crap horses. Put big price tags on them because they are big or are the right color etc. I could go on for days but I won’t.
I am not angered by everyones comments because they are well warranted from that photo. But I could not stand by and let people assume this horse or any of the ones listed under him belonged to us. If you take a tour of the rest of the website http://www.elfcreekfarm.com you will see the condition of OUR horses.
I do not have access to the website editing program any longer due to a computer crash hence why the photos were never removed even though we seperated ourselves from them 3 1/2 years ago.
I hope this clears Elf Creek Farm’s name and if anyone has any questions or concerns please feel free to contact me with any of them.
http://www.equinenow.com/farm/galant_run.htm here is the link to THEIR sale horses. and this is THEIR ad for the above 06′ colt I was refering to. http://www.equinenow.com/horse-ad-226078. The photos were all taken in summer so they horses aren’t nearly in as bad as condition as they are in the colder months. Here is a better photo of the average condition in summer. http://www.equinenow.com/horse-ad-226075 this is the Dam to the above colt.
Oh Yes and if you take a look at the actual sales page on our site http://www.elfcreekfarm.com/ForSale.html please note the difference in the link titles http://www.elfcreekfarm.com/My_Homepage_Files/Page3.html and you will notice that the latter link says homepage files.
You will see that the Galant Run horses are not actually listed on the sales page. But as I said due to a crashed computer I cannot remove the old sales page from being viewable to the public. The current website is still very outdated.
Thanks for clarifying although if you read the comments, I did note that you were listing him for a friend and he wasn’t yours.
I did not see anything wrong with any of your horses. The other people you were listing horses for clearly had a problem. I know how it feels to TRY to help someone who cannot care for their horses sell them and I sympathize with the frustration of not being able to help the horses escape.
By the way, I can update websites if you need help with that
Yes I did note what you had said about it being listed for a friend. I just wanted to come forward myself and clarify.
We no longer have a breeding program due to the economy. One of the mares and one of geldings have passed away. All the sale horses have been sold. We only have 2 (3 if you include the one on long term lease) of the horses listed on their anymore. lol And I am pretty much only running a lesson program. With an opening or two for training. I may possibly breed my AQHA mare for my own personal foal but other than that we are putting a hold on our program until the economy picks up and we have our own farm again.
When I get the time I will do the website.
Hooray, common sense. You’re always welcome here with that attitude.
You don’t have access to the server (ability to upload webpages, control what’s shown as your homepage, etc) or you don’t have access to a webpage writer? If it’s the latter, there are many WYSIWYG (what you see is what you get) editors like Frontpage and Dreamweaver out there, some of them are even free online! You could even get a local art school kid or graphic design person to help you out if you know what you want to be on there.
Somebody has better pictures of that stallion online.
What Aficat says is true…depending on what operating system you are running, there should be a free version of Frontpage available online. (I do know my older version of Dreamweaver will not load to Vista.) If not, I would at least go serverside and either delete the page or go into the code and delete at least the linkage to the pictures. Why run your own farm down if you don’t have to with these people? I started webmistressing a site with Frontpage freeware and it sufficed very nicely.
That poor stallion to get in a condition like that is no excuse. I really hope he is in a better place and gelded.. There are so many here in Eastern TN, folks here think because of color they need to breed, a pinto/appaloosa for a few hundred bucks, a 33 inch mini stud with an adult on him and this guy today makes me sad, and no doubt hasn’t been tested for herda: http://tricities.craigslist.org/grd/1590404841.html
hm maybe I should have kept my pretty palamino paint pony a stud, least hes put together right. But he got gelded, I see no point in breeding a grade horse. I think color does matter to an extent, its not the most important thing in the world though. I have a mare that I want a foal out of one day, shes registered, put together nicely and I would keep the baby. color is something I will take into consideration, though it wont be the deciding factor. and to add on to what others have said about breeding stock paints, my mare i want to breed is a breeding stock paint (though i don’t care i like her brown color) but i did end up with a free unwanted solid paint gelding once, he was sold as a yearling because he wasn’t colored. I got him for free as a 5 yr old because the ppl who bought him had no time for him. But he was built aboslutly beautifully, perfect conformation, he won his halter class at fair twice. but he was unregistered and sold as a baby, just because he was a solid color. sad, i also know of another solid paint gelding a friend of mine had that was kept on a dry lot by himself at the breeders until he was bought and saved. he was never registered either, he was built quite nicely too. So my point is, in the paint world color is needed, some horses end up as grade horses just because their solid. these were just geldings though
We used to call them “Appalosers” … ha ha…..
HELP PLEASE?????
Can anyone help me? i am in need of a non-profit retirement or rescue home for a very nice horse that can accept a LARGE donation.
A friend of mine purchased an extremely expensive (6 figure) show horse 2 years ago and found out soon after that the horse is slowly going blind. Yeah, she was an inexperienced horsie mom who was rooked by dealers/trainers. I find it difficult to believe that the people selling this horse had NO idea the horse had vision issues…. and of course the vet used wasn’t her own, but the out of state vet that the people selling the horse knew…. we’ve all seen this a million times but not usually with horses that expensive.
email me if you have any ideas please at lwill031@gmail.com
If you are in Florida, Mill Creek Retirement home in Alchua (north of Gainesville) has beautiful facilities and 24/7 caretakers on the premises. Janet Reno (former Attorney General) pays for a retired horse to stay there. Also there is a horse who retired from Broadway. They usually only take retired police, therapeutic riding and legally seized horses, but they might make another exception for a donation. They have a web site. I have taken two seized horses there. One has been there for several years and looks great, the other had kidney failure and we knew he wouldn’t live a long time, but they took him to live out his days.
So I just had to post on here….I am a fhtd virgin to posting so here it goes….Talking about colors and prices I was looking on Madison WI craigslist and found this:
.”Rocket” is a AQHA/PHBA show/trail gelding. He will take you to the top at any show. He is currently shown by a 15 year old and 3 year old at AQHA circuts and PHBA shows. He is a great horse for small children and adults. He may be a comming 4 year old but trained like a pro. Just keep in mind that he is only 3 and still needs some finish detailed touches. He is a horse to dye for. Has the temperment of a 40 year old. He is a showmanship/western pls. MASTER. Selling due to loss of interest in Palominos.
He is a horse for young children or any person of anyage. He is very loving. He would also make a great trail horse to take on the summer trails.
Please call or email. 608-345-0460 or Koalabear608@yahoo.com
What a load of poo! I am absolutely just furious at this ad…..so Im wondering what makes this horse a world show horse oh yea here is the header for it!
PHBA/AQHA Kid.Family,World show gelding – $5000 (Poynett)
so just because she is not interested in the color anymore she is getting rid of it!?!
grrrrr…..I just thought maybe someone here would understand my frustration…..
too many stupid people out there, but I guess if it wasnt for stupid people I wouldnt have my gelding Charlie.
NO three year old, unless it is dead, stuffed and up on wheels, is a suitable mount for a three year old child.
That is not my opinion, it is a fact.
They just have not had the life experience to deal with all the stupid stuff that happens, and that a three year old child cannot deal with.
Even on the lead rein.
And there is no talk of a lead rein, on the ad.
Except that no parent in their right mind would allow a three year old child off the lead rein on a god knows how big, horse.
Would they????
I raise Arabian Pintos and you bet I color test. My buyers want to KNOW what they are buying. To not to pay a meer $25 per test would be irresponsible IMHO. When a buyer asks, “Is this colt homozygous for tobiano, or black, or not, or is he a LWO carrier or not?” I want to be able to give them an answer and have the lab documentation to prove it. To tell the buyer, “I don’t know.” or “I think he is.” is silly. Who buys an expensive horse when the seller doesn’t even know what he’s selling? Not me. The difference in that knowledge can mean thousands of dollars in selling price, or the decision to not sell at all. Of course, quality always out weighs color, but personally, I don’t want a chestnut/bay/gray foal – even a perfect one. I don’t want a solid colored foal because they sell for far less and not what my customers are looking for and I don’t want to show one myself either because I like to show at the Pinto shows as well as the Arabian shows. Why should I waste my time producing one, when color tests can help me make a wiser choice of stallions? I’ve produced several nice colts that tested homozygous, but I still gelded them. Being homozgyous is not a free pass to the breeding shed – everything else also has to be there too. This year, I got a filly which I expect will test to be homozgous for both black and tobiano, and I plan to keep her for myself to show. If and when I should ever breed her, I will be looking for that perfect purebred Arabian stallion, but he must also test homozygous for black. My personal choice and there is nothing wrong with that. I hope that we all know by now that to breed for color alone is a quick trip to the poor house for you and an even faster one to the auction barn for your foals. ( I only raised 1 or 2 a year and none for 2010 and who knows for how long after that. )
I agree with you about colour (and pattern) testing.
I just do get a little tired of the people who do it only so that they can list the colour/pattern as “rare” and, therefore, worth more money!!
Well–Have your heard of this trend– crossing Appaloosas with drafts to “create” a “new” breed with markings of the former and the size of the latter???
Apparently lots of people really like the markings found on Appaloosas, so they cross them with other breeds to try to get that breed’s gait or size with an APPY coat. I had heard of Walkaloosas (Appy marked horses that do a running walk like a TWH) but these Appy-drafts are new to me. I can’t remember what they are being called, maybe Draftaloosas?? Daftaloosas would be a good name for their breeders in this economy when even well-bred horses of established breeds are being dumped at auction houses or in vacant lots or even turned loose along rural roads.
I belong to several horse- related groups on yahoo, and am amazed that people are still posting about breeding what amounts to mixed breeds or grade horses when there are thousands of perfectly good horses already out there in need of homes. (The same goes for dogs and cats.)
I also can’t believe that so many people STILL think they can make money breeding horses — especially strange new “breeds” when there are already so many different breeds of horses already available at really low proces– or even free.
It seems that at least once every week, someone contacts me about helping find a home for a horse that isn’t wanted any more. I just don’t have room or funds to take in any more horsess, and am referring them to rescues fairly close to here, and then I read about people who are just cranking out more foals.
OT- Speaking of the ungelded- Have you all read about the stallion that killed his owner within the last two weeks or so? It’s been on several group lists. I think it happened in Tennessee, but am not sure. The man’s son shot the stallion when it charged him while he was trying to rescue his father. The father later died in the hospital of his injuries. The stallion was said to have been known to be mean, and that the man often carried a big stick when he went out to feed it. During the attack, it apparently tore one of this arms off. No word on what breed, if any, this horse was.
I’m all for any program that helps neuter, spay or geld.
I actually have a Appy/Percheron, he’s in his twenties now but a gorgeous guy and was an ubelievable mover in his younger days, I had a couple of dressage riders that wanted him but he was my buddy and I was a kid so I said no way. I wouldn’t breed a cross, theres enough out there, but he’s a great horse.
On another topic, I’ve seen spaying mentioned a lot here and would love to spay my mare, is this more common these days? What does his procedure cost?
Here’s one for sale. They call them Sugarbush horses, although I would swaer they were called Stonewall horses a few years ago. Seems the owners keep making up “registries” for them. Thank god the owner is getting out of breeding.
http://dallas.craigslist.org/ndf/grd/1551617641.html
That’s actually a really good looking stud. I wish there were more horses like him.
Original name of the registry was “Stonewall Sugarbush”, so your memory is fine.
Actually, they are sister registries. Horses with less then 50% draft breeding are Stonewall Sport Horses, and Horses with more then 50% draft breeding are Sugarbush Draft horses. There has been over 40 years of breeding quality Percheron bloodlines to the best Appaloosa stock in order to create them.
If people want a horse with “size” and the Appaloosa color, they should invest in the Knabstrupper, an endangered breed that has been around for centuries and has proven itself to be a successful breed. People already tried to start the “Appaloosa Sport Horse” trend and it was only marginally successful (I can only think of two horses who came out of that trend that were worth anything at all), so obviously this “new breed” won’t do much, either.
J & G Appaloosa (they started the “Wap” line of sport horses) have been breeding quality ApHA sport horses for more than 20 years. They are in PA, google them for more info, they have a website) I think they did very well with their line. Most people in my half of the country were familiar with the “wap” line. I had one and although a non-characteristic, his conformation and presence made up for what he lacked in color ( he was 16.3h). Just an awesome horse. The other one is WapSpotted who also was out of the same lineage (different owner) and did very well on the east coast. He is now on the west coast still breeding. He’s should be getting up there in years. So at what age is it common practice to retire a stud from breeding? Just wondering…out loud.
Just rambling…
I find it sad that appy/draft crosses are considered a “new” innovation. The Palouse tribes were some of the first tribes to selectively breed (and geld). Lewis and Clark were amazed at the quality when they used them to cross the Rockies. The US Army was shown that an entire tribe with women and children could out race them across the mountains, because they had better horses. The US plan to ruin the Palouse horse? Introduce DRAFT stallions into the herds! History, it’s a crazy place full of ideas that are all “new” today.
http://www.theleafchronicle.com/article/20100202/STEWART01/100201015
ugh:
Barnes said in addition to losing an arm in the attack, Beard appeared to have severe injuries to his chest, abdomen and one leg. No one is sure how long Beard struggled with the horse, but his arm was recovered “some distance from Oliver.â€
I just got to say I have a 12yr old Walkaloosa (Appy crossed with Racking horse)…she is the best I could ask for…dead broke, never given me an ounce of problem. She does anything I ask of her. We tried team penning the other weekend and after she got the hang of it, she really got into it, yet I put a 16 yr old who had never been on a horse before and was alittle afraid to even ride and Pebb never went any faster than a walk with her on her back. She even swam across a lake without a bit of hesitation. I’ve fallen off a few times and each time, she stops, and stands rock still even with the saddle sideways. She has a smooth gait but also has the speed of the Appy. Her attitude is sweet. Not bad for a free horse. She came as a BOGO when my sister bought her Rocky Mountain. She doesn’t have the greatest conformation but for a free horse she is the one to get all the compliments and attention.
Sorry but I just got to brag about my girl!
She’s lovely! What a sweet face!
She’s cute!!! what a sweet loooking girl. And I’ll second liking to brag about my giRL
First, I think that everyone should not that the leopard center page says “I want excellent conformation – if you mentally take away that stunning coat color and pretend its just a plain color i want to be able to say that its conformation is really excellent – I have seen too many people go color-blind and forfeited good conformation for color.” She isn’t breeding fugly. She is breeding appaloosas. Which, no matter what the ApHC or others will tell you, is not just ‘a horse with spots. Appys that are breed to look like appys (appies?) are not as wide as QH. I breed appys, I am willing to cross them with QH but only specific studs, and I’m a little less ‘oh my god must breed color’ than a lot of breeders. The two colts she sold were not leopard, which is part of her breeding program. (Yeah, I get annoyed when people think that Appaloosas should have QH conformation)
That being said, the guy standing two 2 y/o colts at 50 bucks a pop needs some sense smacked into him (in a metaphorical sense, we do not advocate violence.) They are 2 years old, and I find it unlikely that he has had a vet check to see if they are sexually mature. And THEY ARE TWO YEARS OLD! Breeding stresses a body, its why you give extra rations to breeding stallions. I find the age to be a worse offense than the price. (50? Really? If you can’t afford a $1000 for a stud fee you can’t afford the baby that will result.) And someone should explain to this guy that the only one of his colts is likely to throw appy color is the snowcap, which is a homozygous trait.
PS I totally understand the ‘no outside mares’ thing. It doesn’t look like she has a barn per say (or only room for her horses) and some stall horses don’t understand ‘fence’. And some stalled broodmares have never had to keep their baby close (which is sad when the mare panics.)
PPS has anyone heard of some HYPP mutation where the horse has HYPP but tests negative? I saw some clip on youtube about it and it freaked me out (I has an Impressive bred QH gelding that I love, and I was like ‘Oh my god, Keeper’)
I agree, an Appaloosa is not just a Quarter Horse with spots. And I know that Appytude can be a pain sometimes, but I find it a somewhat charming. Maybe I’m a glutton for punishment but I like a horse with spunk. There used to be an ApHC reining stallion at my boarding barn that had the temperament of a puppydog. He was completely solid, built and looked just like a Quarter Horse. He was from AQHA lines and had no discernible Appaloosa Characteristics. Sorry, but he was not in my esteem an Appaloosa. He was a quarter horse. If I want a quarter horse I’ll buy a quarter horse. He was completely lovely and I think he ended up being gelded because he didn’t end up performing as well as he was supposed to. Somehow it bothered me that he had ApHC papers.
I admit, I was of the mind that, like paints, appies were colorful QHs, since they are included in the “stock horse” category. What are the differences?? I know you said not as wide, but QH differ in wideness and can be acceptable a little narrower. Can you explain what you mean? What else?
Appaloosas, traditional appaloosas at least, have a different conformation. They have (or had) bigger hooves, smaller rumps, thinner/leaner bodies, different face structure, more rustic than a Quarter Horse, even topline (not butt high) and a distinctive pain in the ass personality. Many appaloosas have sparse mane and tails. Some old timey Appaloosas also had a special gait called the Indian Shuffle. I would say they’re not as “roundy” as the Quarter Horse, not as hippy and chesty. They don’t have the teensy hooves, and are not as muscular. Though with all the crossbredding you’ll see plenty of Appaloosas with small feet, hippy big butts and butt high.
I’ve known a couple of registered Apps that you would swear were draft crosses.
I had heard about the hardy feet thing…I had an appy/Arab cross for a while…cute little thing although not what I would chose now that I know what I’m looking for!!!….and technically QH shouldn’t be butt high. My trainer always taught me that was a bad thing, she was a AQHA trainer…had the high point horse come out of her barn 3 years in a row…and did not do the artificial gait, blood letting, or encourage people to buy poorly conformed horses. She used spurs and was not a fan of draw reins as a quick fix, although she would use them from time to time. I don’t own a butt high QH and I don’t plan on owning one…I don’t see them do any better in the showring than long backed horses…although I do know of one exception, but he didn’t go like he was downhill at all. The butt high look is most widely seen in halter classes…which I will be the first to say, has ridiculous standards. That’s interesting, though, to hear more about appies. I am definitely conservative in my color tastes (I like solid colors. Easier to keep clean!!!) but I always think a good horse is a good horse!!
The easiest answer is that appaloosas should be more refined. To use a dog analogy compare a standard poodle to a labrador. The breed should have the stockhorse skeletal conformation but with a refined musculature. The breed is built to work for a long day. A classic appy does not have the big muscles that QHs do. Which, when you look at them from a QH conformation perspective, makes them look off: the butt looks small from the side and back, from the front the horse has a more narrow appearance. The classic QH V is wider and less defined. The head should not be blocky, but defined and of a size that matches the rest of the skeleton. Hooves should be large with good structure (oddly my cowhorses all slide without sliding shoes on them.) They should show (no matter what training) cowsense. I know of one appy stud that stands and performs as a dressage horse but will still work a cow. Refined head, big hooves, no excess muscles and, in my book the most important feature, smarter than the average horse.
I find that it is not uncommon for a well-bred true appaloosa to reject some riders/trainers/farriers/handlers. I got my old show horse (literally, she is 25) because her rider decided she was untrainable: Sugar decided she hated shows so her solution was to lay down at the gate. Nothing could stop her decision, she wouldn’t get up until the rider got off. She is not one of those horses that would tolerate the crap some BNTs do to pleasure horses (head tying, rein picking, constant use of spurs) . Oddly this is what I like: a horse that will let you know when you are wrong (I showed her 2 years after I got her and she was fine, so yeah it was the rider/trainer.) I honestly think that it is the brains that some people try to breed out of an appy. One of my friends says that the difference between jumping horses (and yes this is a gross generalization) is that a QH will kill trying to make a bad jump, a warmblood will kill you, a TB will take both of you out and the appy will realize you messed up and circle around again.
All this being said, I have no issue with crossing appys to QH, TB and Arabians so long as the resulting foal meets my appy standards (I have three non appy mares I cross with, but before I bought them I rode each to make sure the mare was something I wanted a foal out of.) I love my QHs, my TB and my mustangs (including my sweetheart of a QH gelding that is just like the generalized QH) …but I trust my appys to tell me when I’m screwing up rather than just take it. I like to think I’m a better rider for it. And I was going to ride today…and then it rained some more, just as my footing dried out.
It amazes me how much your description of the personality sounds like my quarter horse!!!! She is a GREAT teacher because she will NOT perform if you’re wrong!!! Honesty is probably her best quality. You cannot cheat with her and yes, we use spurs, but they’re meant for lift, not punishment. She’s been the world’s best teacher….I probably wouldn’t pick her if I had to do it over again because she’s a little mentally high maintenance, but I’m so glad i didn’t know what I was doing when i picked her to buy, because i wouldn’t be nearly the rider i am without her. I think she truly does have an appy personality!!!!
Here’s an old advertisement showing a Foundation App:
http://thefab.homestead.com/files/images/Advertisements/navajobritches3.pdf
That is what I want to see in an appy show ring. The expression ‘I’m keeping watch’ (or maybe its are the girls going?) endurance body that can offer quick bursts of speed. Okay, I’d like an actual tail but hey, its less to brush right?
They come in X-large too!
http://www.confettifarms.com/Butterwap%20Confetti.htm
If I were looking for a QH conformation, that would be off. I see what you mean though. It’s still a well balanced horse and now that i’m not looking fOR Qh conformation when I see one, I can appreciate them a little more. Thanks for that!!
That’s what I think of when I hear “appaloosa.”
Never wanted one (have been blinded by the tobiano spots forever) but I had an age-group peer who had an appy that looked a lot like this and he’d do anything (local open shows) … pleasure, games, and then she’d take him home and work cows on the family ranch. He was quite the horse.
Cathy i hear you , and I am making a difference in my own “yard”- ranch. It starts there , one person at a time. I am importing a gelding for showing instead of breeding my so- so, not so great mare . She is a nice mare , but not nice enough to clone … so I wont do it. I am getting a lot of crap about importing a gelding, but hes is beautiful and has a proven show record. from what I understand he was a stallion at a auction, some Saint purchased him , probably saved him from a slaughter truck, trained him gelded him , sold him . Now he is going to live the rest of his life being spoiled, loved , and going to European shows. Success story YAHOO!!.. “just say NO to breeding” I wont support it anymore, people geld those stallions , they CAN have success in showing as a gelding. “life after castration …it does exist” i will get off my soap box now.
by the way , please castrate your stallions before selling them, if your selling them its because they arnt nice enough for YOU to breed , or YOU have produced too many.. dont wait.. casterate!!
While I don’t think anyone without registered horses with proven records should be breeding in this economy, I have to stick up for the draft/appy cross. Two of the very best (unrelated) horses I have ever owned were draft/appys. And yes, they were definitely kolored. The size, slow gait, calm and sweet nature, large rumps and abundant tails of the draft side complimented the narrower, skimpier tailed, grouchier appaloosas. They were simply fantastic horses – big, great endurance, strong feet and legs, calm as could be, and had a very natural WP gait. My 17 hand cross could jog and lope, with very little training, slower and in a more “peanut roller” manner than most of the quarter horses we showed against. They were both mares, but had a very even-tempered, “chill” personality. So, I don’t recommend breeding for this, but if you find a cross like that, snatch it up. Perfect horses for the husband or larger/solider child.
What a winning ad here:
http://chattanooga.craigslist.org/grd/1586254580.html
Are you looking for a beautiful, laid back stud to breed to your mares? I have a beautiful unregistered paint that will be ready to breed this spring. He is about 14hh and 1yr and a half old. He is very rare. He has white inside his brown and his brown is outlined in black. He has a white mane and brown tail. You have to see him to believe how georgeous he is. The pictures do not do him any justice. He has a wonderful personality and does not act like a stud. His colts should be very laid back and easily trained. Currently he is being trained in western pleasure and is doing great. On his first ride he did not offer to buck or rare up or present any bad vices. I am asking a $200 stud fee and $50 delivery or pick up. Please feel free to call us to set up a time to see him or with any questions.
Still a yearling and already being “trained” in western pleasure? He’s rare? OMG, and what great pics they have.
That’s the most ridiculous ad I’ve ever seen. Someone needs to smack this guy in the face.
“He is very rare. He has white inside his brown and his brown is outlined in black. He has a white mane and brown tail.”
..
Whaaat? Hand me my beating stick, I need to go and knock some sense into these people. A yearling stud! Being trained in WP! He looks a hot mess in those pics.
That’s disgusting. I don’t think you should even sit on a horse until its a long two year old. I know a lot of people would bash me for saying that young!!! The reason I say that young is because let’s face it, that’s how the market goes and people who are looking for quality stock horses will not buy a 3 year old that is just getting broke. I don’t think a two year old should be showing. It’s mind and it’s body is too young. I WOULD venture to say that IF you have a stock horse who is still going through bigger growth spurts at 3, I wouldn’t ride it until I have the okay from a good vet, you know, the ones that care about horses more than the profits, which there ARE some of. The AQHA horses I know who are getting injections every 6 months by 8 are the ones who were broke BEFORE they were ACTUALLY two. I’ve seen horses do well that were broke (not shown with the five year olds, just walk/jog/trot/maybe a little canter for less than half hour intervals) as long two year olds and not pushed. Also, it really depends a lot on the horse whether it’s ready at 2 or 3. I see no excuse for 1 1/2. That’s just a baby!!!
They won’t bash you for saying it here
It’s well known that I’m opposed to starting riding work under the age of 3. I agree that it just leads to paying for a lot of joint injections and a horse that is used up by 12, if not sooner.
And what a ridiculous junkyard background. Offering a baby for stud is just sick; an unregistered baby: STOOPID + sick.
Another hot contender for the “I can’t believe THIS” award…or the “just when you think you’ve heard it all” award…
I don’t get it, I really don’t. The ONLY thing this guy is selling is color, and he can’t even be bothered to get within 50 feet of his stallion to get a photo of the “unusual” pattern? (Never mind an actual conformation shot…we presume the stallion offered is the ordinary bay pinto?)
This just makes me SOOOOOOOOOOOO angry – WTF is the MATTER with these people!?!?! Every time I visit my in-laws in KY, we drive by these type of places: hilly, trees, no grass, rocks, rusting machinery/cars, a trailer, and of COURSE several fugly, pot-bellied, half-starved scraggly horses picking listlessly at a moldy round bale. And now Miss Sunshine here, who apparently is already RIDING her “rare-colored,” pony-sized unregistered piece o’junk baby, thinks she’s gonna make the big bucks breeding the thing. I can just hear the convo: “I know, here’s whatcha do: git that colt down yonder in Cooter’s field, I know he’ll sell it cheap, and stick it out back. Y’all can fool around w’ it, I’m sure it’s dern near big enough to ride now, and then we kin stud it out. Oughta git some GOOD money outta it!” GRRRRRRRRRRR!
I know what you mean!!!! i live in frankfort and go to school in Midway, which is near Lexington. And that’s the sad part about Kentucky. If you’re not in Fayette or Woodford Cty, the horses live in DEPLORABLE conditions with ROTTING barbed wire fence in horrid, hilly pastures with little or no stable ground….it disgusts me. I have seen worse conditions just outside of “horse country” than anywhere in Ohio, which is where I’m from. It’s disgusting. Dumb hillbillies!!!
Quick! Somebody call and ream them out before some dumb ass takes them up on their stupid offer. You know where there is one, there are hundreds more just like them.
stupid, stupid stupid!
That’s like the idiot who advertises his plain old bay AQHA, no thing special stud as “very potent – every mare he breeds gets in foal”. Whoopety wow, lemme haul my mare right over. Or the ‘Luzianna’ coonass who owns an uregistered spotted stud horse they can’t catch or touch, so they charge $100 to turn your mare out with him for a week ’cause they just know he sires color…they don’t even know what “homozygous” is, let alone the concept of “papers” or “pedigree”…This kind of person will never learn, either…
Elysian Fields Farm said: OT- Speaking of the ungelded- Have you all read about the stallion that killed his owner within the last two weeks or so? It’s been on several group lists. I think it happened in Tennessee, but am not sure. The man’s son shot the stallion when it charged him while he was trying to rescue his father. The father later died in the hospital of his injuries. The stallion was said to have been known to be mean, and that the man often carried a big stick when he went out to feed it. During the attack, it apparently tore one of this arms off. No word on what breed, if any, this horse was.
I live in Tennessee, and had not heard about this, so out of curiosity I looked it up, and here is the link to the full story:
http://www.theleafchronicle.com/article/20100202/STEWART01/100201015
Should have been gelded years ago if you needed a stick to enter the stall. WHY do people leave these horses intact? WHY?
That’s CRAZY.
SO many reasons a horse could be aggressive and hateful like that, and most of them are human in origin. Not all, of course – but many. Probably carried a stick because he thought that was the only way you could deal with a spirited horse, and it all went downhill from there. Complicated of course by testosterone & such.
Horses (and dogs) who are unsalvageably vicious, whether naturally or because of some human agency, should just be put down. End of story. It’s not FAIR, but it’s the least awful of possible outcomes.
I completely agree with you. It’s sad when humans have ruined them, but euthanasia is often the kindest solution.
Wow. Every idiot putting their 2 year old on a stallions’ back needs to read that story. I think I will peruse my local craigslist ads later and email some links…that is usually where you find them.
We had a double cryptorchid in our barn briefly…the lady was supposed to get him gelded but kept BS’ing and putting it off. He seemed sweet enough and wasn’t being bred, still no excuse. One day he turned on the BO and she told the owner to cut him within 3 days or move him. Our BO is in her 70′s, 5’2 and weighs about 90 lbs with osteoperosis, in no position to tangle with a young stud. Long story short, she moved the horse. Next time it was the owner that got attacked by him. THEN he got his surgery. Now he is nice little gelding giving pony rides to kids in an arena. I don’t care how “gentle” or “nice” a stud is, they have an added level of unpredictability to them, especially if left untrained, that just cannot be ignored. IMHO, they are great when properly trained and handled by someone with the right experience, but are just downright dangerous when in the wrong hands.
Monorchid/cryptorchid can really add to the problem. The horse can actually be in constant discomfort from the retained gonad, and the body heat can cause excessive testosterone production that can turn a normally polite horse into the equine equivalent of “roid rage.” Now, not every time — but definitely with some frequency.
Cryptorchids *can* be completely nuts. Of course, one of the sweetest horses I ever met was a monorchid who never had the retained testicle removed…he was a total sweetheart who would never have hurt anyone, horse or human, so there are exceptions.
It bothers me when people breed monorchids, though. It tends to be passed on.
Had a monorchid on the place for years, w who was sweet as he could be — and settled every mare he covered (Not my horse, long story). Absolutely a gentleman — until one winter he suddenly became really dangerous. Off to the vet for the full scale ball-hunt. The retained testicle was producing a massive amount of testosterone. Within a week after surgery, the gentleman was back. I’d have to say any ungelded monorchid or cryptorchid has the potential to become dangerous. It might not happen – but the potential is there.
Yeah….cuz “color” makes a good horse.
FYI…the breeder of these colts was not aware of the Craigslist advertisement and was thankful that someone alerted her to it.
Good! Well, like I say, I truly did NOT want her to feel like I was totally bashing on her – she does have some nice horses, they’re ridden, she’s NOT typical blog fodder. I had to call her out on the Impressive comment, but overall I don’t see that she’s breeding fuglies…most of what she has looks pretty nice despite the amateur photography.
But the dude standing the two two-year-olds at stud … oh yeah. HE’S blog fodder. Big time.
Hopefully she will geld them before they leave home in the future.
OT…did anyone see this?
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/news/397/294510.html
This makes me want to puke at the thought!
I have not studied up on color genetics in several years. I just went and reviewed and WOW they’ve made progress! A few years ago, there was no definitive genetic test for Tobiano, for example- you had to send in the dna sample, and information/pictures of your horse, and its parents, and any ancestors you had. They then used that information to calculate probability of homozygous tobiano. Now, they just run a genetic test.
I personally think coat color testing has its place. You can’t stop idiots from using it to breed fuglies- but remember, if the color genetic testing was not available, they’d STILL be breeding fuglies. Probably MORE fuglies, since it would take more tries to produce their desired color/markings without the genetic testing.
The availability of the testing probably does cut down to a certain extent on the number of, say, sorrell rejects off the high-end paint farms. And I say, if you want to breed for color, as long as you go for quality first, color second, go for it. I personally, coat color tested my arab mare some years ago, discovered she is homozygous for gray, and that was the end of my consideration of breeding her. I do NOT want another gray/white horse to keep clean!
Melissa
http://www.freedomtreeless.com
A BYB’er was on People’s Court today! And she is a “rescue”! And a “trainer”! She had 40 horses seized plus dogs, was charged with theft and conspiracy. She told someone boarding there that her horse had died and sold it for over $5000. The stallion she was charging $300 stud fee on couldn’t cover mares, so she was on there being sued for that. Oh, and the owner that had sent her mare to be bred (without seeing the facility by her own admision) had her mare siezed when animal control got a warrent to sieze all animals. She was breeding Freisan Sport Horses. The AC investigation came about because the mare owner’s vet called and reported the conditions at the farm. Kudos to that vet!
Judge Milian ripped her a new one, called her a liar, and told her she wouldn’t believe her if her tongue came notorized. She called her deplorable and said all the horses deserved better. This woman “Kristina” had no shame and blamed it on rescue horses she took in and eluded to just being a barn manager(even though she stated in the docket she owned the barn) and having a lawsuit pending with animal control! She also blamed the mare for the breeding not being able to take place, saying the TB ex-race horse was too small to cover.
It looked like the mare owner got a good dose of reality, saying she was no longer interested in breeding. (GOOD!) But alas, BYB’er Kristina was still in denial, stating she did nothing wrong, wah wah, nobody would listen to her, wah wah, mean animal control overreacted siezing her 40 HORSES (hoarder).
Kristina wouldn’t allow her last name, barn name or stallion name used on the show but I did a little googling and found out she is Kristina Early from Salem, Oregon and has quite the history of fraud, theft and neglect. Even found her on this blog. Anyone else see this People’s Court episode?
No but OMG! Someone see if we can get a tape! That is AWESOME!
I DVR’ed it with my cable box. Give me some time to monkey around with my DVD player and get it hooked up to my DVD player to put it on disc and I will send it to you. It is Friggin Hilarious! She makes a complete ass of herself, and I think it says alot that the judge, who had to ask what a girl horse was called because she wasn’t even familiar with the term mare, so easily recognized what a piece of shit she is.
And she wouldn’t let any of her information be used on the show, like no one watching knows how to google Kristina Oregan horse abuse and get a news article with her picture. So glad I work nights and spend my mornings dumbing it down with court reality shows.
HA! You can’t make this shit up, can you? No one would believe it.
Here’s an article including pictures. Check out how skinny that mare is. http://www.katu.com/news/50582942.html
Oh dear God, I really wish I had not clicked on your link… that poor, poor mare, a BCS 1 and a baby on her. I cannot believe she’s still alive. Why is that inhuman creature – I refuse to associate her with the human race, she is such a disgrace – getting paid for television appearances (I assume people are renumerated for going on “People’s Court”)? Why is she not behind bars TODAY? No excuse whatsoever, no “hoarding disease,” nothing in my book – just abuse and pride and lack of income and, oh, I don’t know…. I will never, ever understand what goes through people’s minds. How do you look at animals like that living in front of you.
The good news is that thanks to a kind foster ‘parent’, 4 months later she’s looking really good now!
At intake:
http://sms.petpoint.com/sms/photos/722/be4024cd-f7ad-4c37-a598-dc2aa1c919f6.jpg
4 months later:
http://sms.petpoint.com/sms/photos/722/0ae5b0a8-4f64-4ddb-bef7-ca092adc2d67.jpg
According to the Humane Society’s site, her foal came through just fine as well.
If anybody is interested in adopting her (they’re asking $400), her name is Midnight and she is available through http://willamettehumane.org, along with several other horses seized in this case. There a few that are even started/broke, I think.
ZellGirl: thanks so much for posting the before/after photos!
My heart broke this morning to see the skinny mummy – now it has been put together again seeing her frolic about… at least until the next round of photos from some f**kwit comes along.
Wow. I see SHE hasn’t missed any meals, but she has a lot full of horses that are skin and bones. Disgusting.
She’s not new news. I’ve seen her picture plastered all over the internet before. Sometimes you can just take a look at people and tell by how they take care of themselves will be an indication on how they care for others. People who associate with her should be able to tell immediately if she is someone worthy of dealing with. She’s a piece of crapola. Perhaps this is a long standing case that is just now getting to the legal end of it.
Just a pitiful piece of crap.
When you get the tape I look forward to the you-tube link so we can all see it!
I’ve seen that mugshot before — she’s been on FHOTD in the past year, no?
Yes, I thought so.
http://www.fuglyblog.com/2009/every-boarders-worst-nightmare/
TWH: I saw this. It was great. Judge Milian really did go after that loser! i thought she should have given the plaintiff a little MORE $$ for damages. It seemed like the plaintiff loved her horse, but just didn’t adequately research the person she was entrusting her horse to. Thank god there were breeding problems (on MANY levels). The defendant was pathetic, and blamed everyone but herself for 40 starving horses. And what a testament to the benefits of microchipping!
Isn’t it awesome that with so little information (first name and state), we were able to find the news reports, and better yet, FUG’s blog on this loser!
On the other hand….
If people test for color maybe just maybe there will be less horses bred in hopes of colored babies that get tossed out because they didn’t have purty colors. Obviously it’s not important to most normal people but it seems to be an excuse to throw away some very nice horses.
- PS I have one of these useless colorless paints and he is amazing.
I can understand someone not wanting an average looking horse. I have my own color favorites. Not everyone wants a bay TB anymore than not everyone wants a chestnut Quarter Horse. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but the more exotic colors do have their faithful followers and they are usually willing to pay a little more for the more unusual. I know I would.The problem comes from when like designer dog breeders, they mix two muts, and get a litter. The pups are cute, they call them a made up breed, and people snap them up for $500 each. Those same pups in the shelter can’t be give away.Two fulgies normally can’t produce a new breed (at least one that you’d want to own) any more than they can produce a show champion, but they do pop up with a good one now and then. But, what happens to the fuglies? When people can’t afford to run with the big dogs (the BNTs) they do the best they can with what they can afford, and too often that is $100 mare and stallion from the auction barn. I know someone who crossed their Arab mares with a Freisian stallion. I have seen this cross do well, and not so well. The resulting foals, now under saddle, are exact opposites of each other. One looks a bit like a QH cross, the other is homelier than a picket fence. Neither horse retained any trails of either the Arab or the Friesian – go figure! Hard to create a new breed when the outcomes are so vastly unpredicatble.
I would sure want to belong to this lady with her nice pastures, cozy blankets and lots of hay…it’s a nice change from the horrible stuff lately. I do of course like the spotted ones but thanks to this site I know that I have no need to breed, I’ve learned that there are plenty of nice foals or rescue horses available that we can buy when we feel the need. Also, thanks to knowledge gathered from this site we have 3 wonderful horses from various rescue situations.
I admit. I love Paints. My favorite horse is a beautiful, flashy, loud tobiano…I’d buy him and bring him home if I could.
But he also has a very attractive head, elastic and athletic action and an in your pocket temperament. And no balls.
Haha–good one! Personally, I like my horses tall, dark, and gelded. My young’un was cut as soon as he dropped and the vet gave the OK.
One thing is, I personally don’t understand the color craze. I just don’t get why someone would want a wild colored horse that was impossible to keep clean, when they could have a brown colored horse that looked clean no matter what it rolled in. Can someone explain the attraction to me? There are so many amazing brown horses out there…
All they have to do is use “textese” and my eyes glaze over. Use it on the text on your phone, but don’t write me this stuff. When I get a note from someone in textese, I totally ignore it and delete it. No excuse when you are at a real keyboard and can actually type.
There are some decent horses in that pedigree, but that’s not enough to breed them…
Color, schmolor.
There is nothing more beautiful than a well-put-together horse of ANY color in full bloom of health, grooming and fitness.
When the eyes sparkle, and the coat shines – sometimes also with those dapples that come out when a horse is in tip top shape – that’s just awesome, no matter what breed or color. Even a blue eyed pink skinned cremello – though there are few enough well-conformed ones that I’ve seen, that’s for sure.
Agreed!!!
100% agreed. I don’t have a problem with people wanting a purdy colored horse but they should look to conformation FIRST then coat color when breeding. Nobody here wants to see anybody breed anything with questionable conformation just because he is a purdy color.
Hey FUGLY……Sterling Rachwal was arrested last night, as confirmed by a call to the sheriff’s dept.
Now we have to pressure that he is never allowed out……maybe because he ALWAY re-offends and god knows how many horses he has killed.
EXCELLENT.
I read online that he was arrested after a couple found him in their barn and recognized him.
I’m not saying….but it’s a good thing I didn’t find him in my barn down here in Texas.
Maybe a note to the boys in the “pokie” will do what the judges haven’t.
It has gotten to the point that I don’t WANT to buy a horse of color.
There are so many morons breeding for nothing but color that it is almost a guarantee the resulting animal will be of less quality than those of so-called ‘normal’ colors. When the first word in an ad title is FLASHY or PAINT or LOUD, watch out! The breeder is hoping you will quickly look at nothing but the color and forget those cow hocks, long back, straight shoulder, and nasty disposition.
Ultimately, if color is the only thing bred for, of course there will be a corresponding downhill slide of conformation, temperament and usefulness. It is the truly rare breeder who incorporates proper breeding practices and also has color. Color is just the icing on the cake, they don’t BREED for color.
Buy a nice bay gelding with performance-bred and proven parents. He will be better conformed, more willing nature, and have years of solid breeding behind him.
I agree.
You can’t ride color. I can’t think of many extreme colored horses I’ve seen that can do half what my plain, average colored black pony can.
This is why I get my fill of crazy roan dun silver dapple pintaloosas in the virtual horse (unicorn, actually, but colors and genetics mirror those of the horse) breeding and showing game I recently started…we’ve got 27 potentail coat colors, every marking or pattern imaginable, you can get ANYTHING pretty much. Breed as much as you want, without contributing to the overpopulation of krazy kolor krap horses…unfortunately, not everyone is satisfied with virtual breeding. I mean, it’s just not as fun if it isn’t alive…of course, it’s not fun when it starts burning a hole in your wallet.
That sounds interesting, is it an online game? Whats it called?
What game is this? Sounds like fun.
I think I found it! PonyIsland?
…Ohman. Now I’m irritated. Why is this winged pegasus at 1 health and has no food? On sale for 200PG and pregnant to a reindeer pony named Acid who looks like he was designed while on an acid trip?
Hahaha, it’s the digital BYB! XD
Just an FYI Criagslist rules forbid stud advertisements, so flag away people. Craigslist has become a bastion for people with fuglies they won’t even pay good money to advertise so get them off Craigslist. I flag any stud ads on my local Craigslist..
How pathetic and desperate to charge $50 stud fees! You can make more money donating plasma or by sneaking into your local mall to scoop change out of the fountain. The sad thing is that some of the more reputable breeders in the TB industry are lowering stuf fees as well, pretty much guaranteeing that the glut won’t end.
How is it possible that so many people in the horse industry never learned the law of supply and demand? Diamonds and coal are both 100% carbon, but because one is beautiful, rare, and difficult to get, it is much more expensive. If this approach were practiced in the horse industry, it would solve a lot of problems.
Anyone breeding crap or lowering stud fees should be forced to write 10,000 times: Less horses = higher prices. Less horses = higher prices. Less horses = higher prices…….
YES! On the chalkboard, possibly at gunpoint!
Eh. Artful Investment’s stud fee is $0 this year [yeah, there are the other fees involved but his actual stud fee is free]. To me, crap is crap is crap, regardless of stud fee.
I wish people wouldn’t do that
I mean, when someone who can’t actually afford to breed to Artful Investment makes 5 babies, are THEY gonna take them in when they are starving?
People. Stop being PIMPS. Stop LIVING off of your stallion’s penis and NEEDING for it to produce income at all costs. If I see one more bad economy special I’m gonna throw up. If you’re that affected by the bad economy, you are the LAST person who needs a FOAL!
Yep-I’ve seen at least one of these 0$ fees advertised in the Reiner. It is ridiculous.
Am I the only person in the world who honestly prefers bays? It might be because the nicest lesson horses I’ve known were bay mares, but I honestly don’t care for paints or appaloosas. The weird blotches of color take away from the grace of the animal in my mind. (Okay, I admit I will drool over a nice dapple gray. But that’s all the more color I like. I’m not even fond of palominos.)
I love bays, also. I have a 26 year old bay TB mare (pony sized at 14 .1 hands). She has done everything in the world for me – we just trail ride, but have been asked to locate a couple of day old calf that was lost in the woods – she did find him and we herded him home (first time for her or me). Once we were riding with a friend who was driving his mules and a dog kept following us, he got a long lead rope and asked me to take the dog home – Echo got the dog home, but that dog was under her tail, under her legs, under her stomach, but she just kept walking him home. Most of my horses all my life have been bays – they seem to have a different aura about themselves.
Bays are my favorites, too! I blame Marguerite Henry’s King of the Wind, LOL!
MelissaV dahling, th’art a girl of my heart. I love bays. Can’t help it. My mind keeps yelling “Conformation not colour, you fool!”, but me insides turn to mush at the sight of glowing mahogany set against black detailing. Funny, I don’t like red cars…
Hey Fugs! check out this other Appy breeder. The site actually brags about having 13 pages of horses for sale. No named studs galore with breeding fees of $500. But they’re purdy kolors. http://www.rockyhollowranch.net/index.html
That ranch has been trying to sell horses for a long time! Wish they would stop creating them and really sell some! Another paper bag moment in the world of Appaloosas.
Carrie Giannandrea
Dances with Horses
Formula One Farms
Gotta love the crappy photoshopping in a lot of their photos – some of the stallions’ photos in particular! EEESH!
I don’t think the breeder of my young horse ever had her current stallion “tested” re color at Davis. He’s a big, well-bred, good moving few spot sired by a sport-horse type leopard Appaloosa out of a 17 hand+ daughter of her senior stallion. At this point, she’s fairly well convinced he IS homozygous, in that out of 34 offspring, 33 have color, and the one that does not is only a yearling. One other “solid” baby he sired started roaning out at age 3+, so the current “solid” one may also color. Everything else has been “colored” at birth, but more important, has been of good conformation and size.
How many of the 34 foals are out of *non-Appaloosa* mares? and I mean mares who do not carry Ap genes at all.
Those are the only matings that “count” when determining homozygous status by progeny. 
Here’s a local St Augustine breeder doing her best to get this mare killed in Mexico. I hate people.
http://jacksonville.craigslist.org/grd/1587052021.html
And, Florida does have trucks leaving for Mexico all the time, especially here in NW FL.
I agree with you that non-flashy horses can be great (Ive owned both flashy and non-flashy). I had an 18 year old QH mare who was amazing who was a plain bay with no markings. Ive owned plain greys and browns. Ive also owned amazing colored horses. I had a Paint/Arabian cross that was a roan paint (hes now white unless hes wet). He wasn’t registered, but I started him in dressage and he was getting 70% + on all his dressage tests. He was beautifully conformed. He had a lovely head, a nice neck, a great shoulder, he was little cow hocked and his rump was a little small, but he had lovely movement and smooth gaits. And man did he have a trot (especially for a 14.2hh pony lol)
I also agree that both non-flashy horses and flashy horses can be the fugliest things on 4 legs.
The bad thing with shows is people are followers. Whatever is winning (color wise) thats what they breed and try to copy it instead of trying to make their own great horse no matter the color.
Man when I was selling my QH mare (bay) I had people refuse to look at her after they saw her pictures and I was told she was too “plain” ugh no matter she had good conformation with a good temperament.
I guess maybe people should realize that a plain horse can stand out if ridden and trained correctly.
Seriously. A plain bay, no chrome, no nothing can look stunning when groomed up if they have nice conformation and movement. The horse I leased before my current one was one of those, in fact…
You can’t ride color.
<> I hate this time of year, because this is when you really see the horse freaks out in full force, pimping out whatever crap they have in their back yard, trying to make a buck off of them.
Yup, you betcha luvredponies…lookee here at this beaut in central Oregon:
http://bend.craigslist.org/grd/1551431790.html
My reply to them was: feed it, geld it then sell it…if u can. Ugh.
Time to rally the Fugly Troops here in our neck of the woods and get a gelding clinic going again!
I saw this article today on Virginia Equestrian.com about being very careful about giving your horse away or it might end up at a slaughterhouse:
The Perils of Free Horse Ads
Oh, please, please let me breed to one of these things. Because God knows the first thing I look for in a stud is color. Who cares what other offspring has done, what his show record is like, etc. I want to know all about his genes! Fuck me, I hate stuff like this. If it’s a stallion ad, make it a fucking stallion ad, not a damn lesson in genetics. I also have to wonder how far back in the pedigrees she had to go to find that many names to drop? Ugh.
My boy was supposed to be a stallion, he was the last foal out of one of my coach’s foundation mares…but he’s a little too thick (he’s built kind of like a brick wall, I always say…) and when he went in the ring it was “MARES!” so he was gelded in a hurry. He’s a handsome looking boy (not that I’m biased, or anything) but he is NOT stallion material. Oh, and he’s just a regular old grey Arabian.
Hey Markey-Mark… are you talking about Butterwap Confetti by any chance? If you are…he is a stud that I would own with pride! I would likely become a crazy horse lady going and “these are my studs…” whipping out pictures. I really think my stud know his balls are under constant threat. One aggressive move and they are gone. Heck, he isn’t going to stand to outside mares until I see what he produces. If it isn’t quality, he is done as a stud. I have a general policy that all my colts get gelded at 3 months. PB was the exception not the rule. I might make another exception if PB’s mom produces as I think she will next year, but that is a big maybe.
I think what is the biggest problem is that okay horses from responsible breeders end up in stupid hands. I won’t sell a horse before it is three unless I personally know you. I have told people that they can’t buy my horses (especially when they are trying to negotiate the price and talking about breeding the horse next year (a yearling filly! her price just suddenly doubled) good breeders will tell you if the horse’s personality doesn’t work with yours.
Come on, build a rep and protect it! Quality, not quantity! If you have 13 pages of horses to sell, stop breeding for the love of god. You know how many babies I had hit the ground last year? 1 same as the year before. This year I’ll have three. I know I can’t deal with more than 4 babies a year. So I don’t breed that many. I also know that When they hit the sell age, which in my book is 3 so they are too late for futurities, I can afford to hold on to them until they find the right home.
And can someone please explain to me why, dear lord IS THERE A TWO YEAR OLD PLEASURE HORSE FUTURITY?
I’ve been holding onto that for a while, Sugar’s old trainer (yeah the one she hated) offered to train her baby, if she could show Sugar’s filly Kabar in it. WTF? Do you remember that her mom hates you? (yeah, I bred Sugar at 22 y/o. after I asked the vet about the risks.)
There is a 2 year old pleasure horse futurity so that cheap asshats do not have to feed them and care for them a whole, gasp, extra year, and instead can get them out there, shown and sold and out of the barn before their legs break down by age five.
I hope that answers your question.
Is it just me, or is the mare behind this colt just a LITTLE thin??? http://tulsa.craigslist.org/grd/1583237141.html
I noticed tonight that “Zoo” was on the independent Film Channel tonight. This is the film about the beastiality ring in Enumclaw a few years ago. On the flip side, TempleGrandin, the film is being aired on HBO tomorrow night.
Did anyone get a copy of the Craig’s list ad and send it to the breeder of these colts? If she has it in writing that they must be gelded, she may be able to take them back for breach of contract.
BTW, I love bays and dark chesnuts with little to no white markings. (The horse I learned to ride on was a greyed out Tobiano. He hated baths and would get absolutly filthy at the drop of hat).
I actually know the guy. Been to his house [actually for fencing materials he was selling cheap] and saw the colts. I’m not impressed with either stud [one of which is a biter and it took everything in my power not to knock the horse's teeth after biting my boob]. He has a new advertisement listing FREE appaloosa stud service. Cannot wait to see those fugly babies at the Goreville Sale Barn. They’d be cute little geldings but nothing that I’d breed any mare too.
Oh lovely. Boob-biting colt – that’s what we need to make more of!
I don’t understand why you DIDN’T bash him a good one, I sure would’ve. If people don’t teach their animals to be civil then it’s up to me, I think.
Honestly, because he’s not my horse. Had he been mine, he would have damn well near lost his teeth. I, personally, don’t care if someone gives my horses a well deserved smack/boot up the ass if they have it coming, but not everyone feels the same as I do.This comes after popping a pony at a petting zoo who tried to eat my hand and getting in trouble [apparently, wagging whatever was left of my finger at the pony was the appropriate response].
Crappaloosa That is to funny.unemployed pregnant girl lmaoff.. Trying to put beer money in there pockets.I am in tears.Dont get me wrong i dont hate appaloosa but thats what we call the low end ones around here CRAPPALOSSA.Hey Buddy u can hate appaloosa U can talk bad about people that raise the THE GREAT BREED OF APPALOSSA.But it just BOILS down to YOUR DADDY SHOULD HAVE BEEN CASTERATED.LMAOFF.I dont drink beer but buddy send me a email and we can get together and have one.FREE APPALOSSA STUD SERVICE TO ANY ONE THAT WANTS TO PUT SOME GREAT BLOODLINES IN THERE BREEDING PROGRAM.
FYI, THAT was the response from the person standing the $50 studs. I’m always fair here, I ALWAYS let people respond — it usually makes my point, as I believe it did today.
Please stop breeding breeds you can’t spell.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DytqyLjJd0A
Can anyone tell me what the white things are in the middle of the ring toward the begining of the video?? Im just curiuos…..Sorry for the OT
Appaloosas, the could have beens of the stock horse world. Instead they are the red headed step children….If they had been selectively bred and shown I bet they would be more wide spread than the quarter horse. With flashier color coats that the paint horses can boast that range from just a light dusting to a full body of spots. Its a shame that the cowboys from the wild west and the trash of today have wreaked havoc (and continue to) on the name and bloodlines of what could have been. I wont lie to you, nothing thrills me more than to see a beautiful, well trained appaloosa being ridden. At the same time, nothing kills me more than to think of the vast amount of really crappy ones there are to the one nice one.
Poor appaloosas, thier burden is a heavy one.
Nothing wrong with color. I love absolutely every single color horses come in, myself. Yes, I have a terrible weakness for tobiano, I admit it. I have a weakness for flash.
But I have had people stare at me for saying ‘Ooh, what a gorgeous shade of bay’ or ‘I love the countershading on that chestnut’.
As far as I’m concerned, it’s not just ‘a good horse is never a bad color’. There IS no bad color. I admit that all things being held equal between two horses, if one was grey and one non-grey, I’d get the non-grey, but that’s because of the higher melanoma risk.
And I’ll confess, if you offered me a plain bay and a flashy pinto OF THE SAME QUALITY I’d want the pinto, but only if the two horses were otherwise very similar.
I got the video on youtube (though it looks pretty ghetto). Don’t know how long it will stay up since I prbably violated some copyright law, but here it is for anyone wanting a good laugh while this POS gets her just desserts! I had to split it into 3 videos and i tried to do a playlist, but no luck. They are labeled Kristina1, 2, and 3.
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_filter=0&suggested_categories=15&search_query=forfuglyreaders
I also made a little video of my fuglies if anyone is interested. Warning: Gratuitous use of cute animal pictures!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-BI6gLh6Ajw
Wow, I love how she says she is just a victim in all this at the end. Animal control doesnt just show up one day and take all of your animals for kinda bad cases. It had to be severe for them to act that quickly.
I appreciate the entertainment on this cold snowy day
I’ve heard an expression that “Appaloosas are TOUGH.” Meaning they’re physically AND mentally tough. Endurance prospects (hey, I’d love to see more of ‘em in distance riding competitions!) and they do not suffer fools lightly.
From what I’ve seen of Appys, this seems to be a decent description.
I like ‘em!
Let’s just hope he stops breeding PERIOD (literally)!
Could you repeat that again please? In English, perhaps?
How about some really good news on the sentencing front for animal abusers/killers. I hope you post this on your blog.
Horse killer gets the Maximum sentence. See the whole story here: https://www.hvcc.edu/deptweb-animaloutreach/alerts.html
Thanks for posting this link. Living in NY has some good points-this is certainly a step in the right direction.
I love that judge, how he refused to grant bail and upgraded the animal cruelty charge to a felony, and it looks like this waste of oxygen will get 7 years, even though he (eventually, after several months of playing games) pled guilty.
But, does New York not have a 3-Strikes law? I mean seriously, this sick excuse for a human already has 2 previous violent felony convictions.
OT
can someone save this poor mare? I found her on Craigslist.
http://sacramento.craigslist.org/grd/1581640361.html
this is off topic but something I think you’d be interested in, maybe with this you can stress the importance of checking a horse out throughly before buying it, or actually seeing the horse before purchase.
http://bloomington.craigslist.org/grd/1589558203.html
Off topic question but I need advice:
There are two new horses at my barn. They are both Rocky Mountain horses and are both clearly less than 2 years old. But yesterday, I saw the owner tacking one of them up and getting ready to ride him. This obviously detrimental to the horse’s health/development. Is there anything I can say/do without being rude?
Write down this website and hand it to them
I think I found four stallions that represent just about everything I dislike in backyard minis.
http://sacramento.craigslist.org/grd/1589708566.html
Um, where’s the rest of that bay stallion’s neck? And the App redefines the term “post – legged”…
*sigh*
Just to add: Appaloosas—I love them. This is me and my Apache (unknown history or pedigree, 18-y-o, 15.0 in new shoes, auction Appy mare who I had many years ago)
http://s172.photobucket.com/albums/w20/littledog987/?action=view¤t=Apachein97.jpg&newest=1
She was the best horse I have ever owned. When I bought her, I’d been riding for close to 20 years on many horses, from lesson horses, leased horses, green horses, OTTBs, first ride starting horses, done HJ, dressage, eventing, trail rides on all of the above, been a barn manager, so I had reason to consider myself a real horse person—but Apache truly taught me to Really Ride! She would do absolutely anything for me if I asked her properly, but she would punish every one of my mistakes, severely.
I could write a book about all the lessons Apache taught me. Many “Oh shit” experiences, many funny moments, even a few blue ribbons. Someday I’d love to have another Appy, all that intelligence and feistiness in a cute, sweet, affectionate little package.
The Answer to the Problem:
Where I live when we buy a horse that is branded, there is a Brand Inspector who comes and looks at the brand and markings and records the transfer. The fee is about $50.00. Everyone around here does this and no one complains. In fact sellers will call people who they sold animals to – to make sure it has been done.
Stallions should have a special State licensing registry, it can be tied in with the Brand Inspection system. Or this system can put in place in areas where there are currently no brand inspectors.
People who want to keep a stallion should pay a licensing fee of no less than $500 per year. The fee could be higher if the horse is un-registered. This fee would apply no matter what the breed or type. All stallions of breeding age would be indelibly marked by tattoo (if it is not already branded) and the mark or brand included with the registry papers. Failure to do so would result in massive fines.
Upon purchasing a stallion, the first license payment is made. If the equine is gelded within the first 3 months of ownership, or if it is a colt, gelded as soon as it is of age, part of the fee is rebated back to the owner.
Secondarily, a live foal fee of $300 should be paid to the same registry system for every live foal, paid by the mares owner. A portable cold brander with a very small brand- a different design per State- would be applied to the licensed foal by the Brand Inspector upon payment. This could be very small and unobtrusive- like under the mane.
The stated stallions name could be cross-checked in the system to make sure it is a licensed stallion to help offset cheating. Animals who are not licensed cannot register the animal (like with AQHA, etc.), show the animal or take it across state lines. This check could be included with Coggins test state line checkpoints.
With computers, this tracking / payment system would be very easy and inexpensive to implement. A lot of it is already in place out west- it could simply be expanded.
Part of the money can go to pay the inspectors and database administration. The rest of the it can go toward an assistance program to help rescued equines. Part of this program could provide for low cost gelding or humane euthanasia. You could allow local 501c-3′s to apply for the funds – with only those with proven track records and gelding programs winning the awards.
This could help solve or ameliorate our biggest problems:
Backyard Breeders -
A $500 per year stallion fee plus $300 per live foal would dissuade BYB’s from breeding for the hell of it or because they want a cyoot (free) baby horsie. That baby had better be worth at least $800.00 the minute it hits the floor or it won’t be worth it to these people.
Owners would also be more cautious about fencing and securing stallions away from mares – and more likely to geld lower grade studs.
Horse theft -
Thieves are less likely to steal horses they know are marked and registered with the state- and less able or likely to take them across state lines. People who have had a horse stolen could call to have an alert put into the database and horses of that brand and body markings watched for by brand/coggins inspectors.
Hoarding -
A lot of hoarders are hidden away off back roads. It’s hard to get sheriffs, etc out to a lot of these places.
It would be a lot easier to make a call and get a bad place inspected by worried neighbors if there were seemingly indiscriminate breeding going on – and with most hoarders there is. Brand Inspectors are invariably experienced horsemen who know when something is not right.
Low Ball horse pricing –
Again – that baby horse better be worth $800 the minute it sticks its nose out the door. This would cut down on the number of cheap horses which equals cheap meat to the kill buyers. Assistance with humane euthanasia and low cost gelding would also remove a lot of horses from this deplorable market.
Struggling (good) rescue operations – it could help them with finances.
I think this is a great idea, and wouldn’t oppose it a bit as a stallion owner. It’s similar to things I’ve said in the past – let’s impose a licensing fee and make it too expensive to BYB!
This issue really needs to be made more public.
http://leasrecovery.shutterfly.com/26
http://artisticgold.webs.com/neglectstarvationdeath.htm
http://keepingthefarm.blogspot.com/2009/06/pictures-worth-1000-words.html
Local Animal Control has been called and has been out there. They okay’ed everything b/c there is food and water. She has closed the origional website http://www.sundownfarmva.com and opened the new website http://www.foursocksfarm.com.
Dear Fugs, Long time reader never a poster until now. I was looking through farm and gardens on criagslist for a chicken hutch and I saw lo and behold the byb of this “post of shame” has a new ad up- hes not charging $50 any more.. Hes offering free stud services now…. Ugh.
http://carbondale.craigslist.org/grd/1588180455.html
Fugs, can you cover this story PLEASE? I know it’s nowhere near where you live, but this is a farm that I used to ride at as a child. My parents quickly found me another barn, as they did not like how this place was run.
http://www.nhregister.com/articles/2009/12/17/news/metro/a1_–_horses_1217.txt#story_comments
As a bonus, the barn owner commented that two of the horses seized were only skinny because they were oooooooooooold. I know how much you love that excuse.
OK, My blood is boiling now. What can I write back to these idiots?
http://knoxville.craigslist.org/grd/1590717685.html
Follow-up to the craigslist ad I posted, re: The free unbroke 18 year old AQHA broodmare.
I sent the owner this:
“Hi there,
I saw your ads and it seems like you are a professional operation. All your other horses have saddle time. I fear for your mare, though. It really is a bad time to sell an older mare that isn’t broke. Who knows what kind of knuckle-headed BYB would end up with her. And that’s only if she’s really lucky. There are slaughter trucks leaving North Florida every day and they can and will send out people who will play the part of a “nice forever home” only to send her down the road. If you were to pull this ad, put some honest hours on your mare under saddle and call me when she going well, I’d consider buying her for a reasonable price just to keep her safe. Seriously.”