An open letter to the Crappy Stallion Owners of America
Oct 19 2009
Dear Crappy Stallion Owners of America,
Yesterday someone visited my trainer’s barn and stopped by the VLC’s stall to admire him. She asked if she could pet him and was told to go ahead. While they were petting and admiring, the lady showing her the barn observed that he was currently the only stud there.
Petting lady jumped back like she had been touching fire, convinced she was in imminent danger of having her arm eaten off. She was quickly assured that she was in no peril and could resume worshiping him in the manner he thinks he rightfully deserves. 
I was told this story last night and asked myself, yet again, why stallions have such a bad P.R. problem. Well, the answer is that it’s because of you. You crappy stallion owners. You morons that permit biting, screaming, striking, kicking, and dragging. Or who dole out such inconsistent and/or crazy discipline that you make your nice horse completely crackerpuppies. Then you spend the rest of his life leading him with a chain and an aluminum baseball bat (or actually, he leads YOU) and screaming out “STALLION COMING!” like you are Britney Spears’ bodyguard clearing a path through the paparazzi.
I am sick of you! I am sick of your incompetence ruining it for everybody else. You take nice horses and create socially inept lunatics out of them, locking a herd animal away from all others of his kind and allowing him to make contact with them only for breeding. Oh, and then you try to show him, when that’s the only time he comes near others of his kind, and you wonder why you’re being dragged around the arena like a kite on a string. If you would just keep your colt running with the geldings, you’d be amazed at how much better he’d be in a crowded arena full of horses. Or turn him out with the already pregnant broodmares. That’ll knock some manners into his teenage head.
It is not an excuse that your stallion is a ‘hot’ breed. I can name stallions of every ‘hot’ breed all day who are not freaking idiots. Go talk to the endurance people. They ride their stallions 50 to 100 miles. Do you think they ride down the trail screaming “STALLION COMING!!!”? Uh, no. I’m pretty sure the other endurance people would kick your ass for that. Sheila Varian has been trail riding and chasing cows on her Arabian stallions forever and I’m pretty sure she accomplished it all without needing a baseball bat to lead them to the hitching rail.
In short, your stallion’s rank, idiotic behavior is probably your fault (and if it’s not, he needs to be gelded). It’s human-created, and it has created a P.R. nightmare for all of the well behaved and well trained stallions on the planet. And in these days of horse overpopulation, we do not need for anything that is not well behaved and well trained to BE a stallion.
So call your vet, and have it turned into a badly behaved gelding – because that’s exactly what you are going to get. Removing testicles does not fix training problems. You will now have a rank, snarly gelding, and instead of getting the training help you need, you will run around telling everybody that horses don’t settle down even after you geld them, and perpetuating the cycle of misinformation.
Yes, stallions need boundaries, but so do all horses. I’ve been hurt the worst in my life by geldings.
Here’s the kind of behavior and control you should be aspiring to reach with your stallion:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S06HMxA0iKI
Do you think Lynn ever had to yell “STALLION COMING!!!”? I’m thinking not.
105 comments to “An open letter to the Crappy Stallion Owners of America”
Leave a Reply
You must be logged in to post a comment. Not a member? Registering is free, and you do it here!
I’m torn on this one, I’ll admit.
I agree, stallions have terrible PR, and some of them are god-awful. However, if people had a little more *respect* for stallions (the training, handling, and care they need, and that yes, they do have a megadose of testosterone at times, and no, you shouldn’t put Little Bobby Sue up on him for that ‘real darn cute’ picture when there’s a flirting mare one fence over), maybe we wouldn’t have all these god-awful ungelded things just hanging around being a danger to themselves, others, and the gene pool.
RESPECT, not fear.
I’ve been to breed shows where a total idiot will stand there chatting away while her mare is being a TOTAL HUSSY, squatting and squirting and peeing all over the place, and the poor stallion two horses down is practically shaking and gritting his teeth, he’s trying to be a good boy. No respect for that stallion, right there, shown by the mare owner. He still shouldn’t lose his mind (EVER), but it’s like people have no sense about studs, how to be around them (without fear, but with respect), how to handle them, how to train them….it’s a trainweck, and of course the horses are the ones who pay.
So honestly, part of me wishes there was a little more “fire breathing stallion” PR out there (even if there were a whole lot less actual fire breathing stallions, something DEFINITELY to be worked towards). Maybe then every BYB in East Clusterfuck wouldn’t have a hideozygous yak decorating their trailer park with the fruits of his loins.
My friend owns a five-year-old Lusitano stallion a few months ago, and a large majority of the geldings at the barn are worse-behaved then he is. He is very well behaved; gee I wonder why? Maybe because *gasp* she doesn’t let him get away with anything and both her and the horse’s previous owners had consistency when working with him. She purchased him for dressage as he already shows major potential, and if she ever does breed him it won’t be until he has a proven show record and he is later in his life. She has been astounded by the people that have already told her that she should breed him, and they don’t mean in the long term; they mean now. I don’t know why people are so intent on breeding a stallion at such young ages when they haven’t so much as competed beforehand…
I grew up with another friend whose mother owns, trains and breeds Icelandics. She has one stallion who is also extremely well behaved and many of her clients are always shocked at his behavior and rant on about how THEIR stallions walk all over them >.<
Sorry for the typo, the first sentence was supposed to read “My friend owns a five-year-old Lusitano stallion and switched barns a few months ago, and a large majority of the geldings at the barn are worse-behaved then he is.”
Another very good subject, fugs. I wonder when the owner is a man if he is allowing the stallion to act the way he’d like to be able to act himself. I mostly show Arabians, and in our breed, Junior Exhibitors and Ladies are allowed to show stallions. My sister had a colt that went out with our older geldings. He would stand there and drop his head and mouth to one of them like a foal, get caught and bgo off and breed a mare, then go back out into the paddock and again show submissive behavior. He had very little body space. Once trained, you could pony a mare while riding him. We got two years of foals from him, said, “Nope,” and gelded him. He went right back out with the geldings.
I do follow some of the John Lyons stuff – you have five seconds to make them think they are going to die. Then it is over, and you don’t pick at them. If you use proper discipline and your stud is still a problem, GELD the SOB. He will pass his disposition onto this foals. Of course, so will a sour sour mare. There are a lot of horses that should never reproduce due to disposition. Too many nice ones available to fool with jerks/junk.
I LOVE it! I am in that situation right now…working with this stud (who I might get to buy if I can scrape the cash together!!!) that is SUCH a gentleman, you have to look under his belly to know what he is. He’s had a mare CRASH into him and push him into a ditch (young horse, spooked at a log…doh) and he just clambered back out wondering what THAT was all about. He can ride with mares, geldings, and other studs in front, behind, or next to him (we have tried it all) and only “talks” tied to a trailer if he can’t see the other horse. Ppl always say “boy, he is such a NICE boy…I didn’t know studs that could be like that…” and of course whenever I post about him (www.stallionadventures.blogspot.com) I keep saying how GOOD he is, cause ppl won’t believe you. Yet…when I look for riding partners (we are training for endurance right now and I want him to go with as many different ppl/horses/situations as possible), I still get the ‘ol “I can’t ride with stallions, I don’t trust them” or “I have a mare, so you can’t ride with me”…sighhhhh Oh well. Though I have to say in response to one of your comments..I HAVE seen “idiot” studs and handlers at endurance rides too, that REALLY need to go home and practice more before they come to rides. But also I have seen studs ridden the whole ride in a rope halter, “tied” at the vet stop by a rein around the neck with the long end hanging to the ground, etc. And those boys are the example i want my boy to follow (and so far so good)…
Course I also loves mares and won’t allow THEIR bad behavior either…but that is a whole nother “open letter”
There is a stallion at the barn I ride with. Unless somebody told you (or you looked) you would not know. He’s a coming 4 yo that has excellent manners. He does not bite, strike or kick. Since I get to feed and turn out on Sunday mornings – I expected a few fireworks yesterday – it was cool and the wind was blowing. Yee Hah weather. Nope – every single horse walked out to the pasture like ladies and gentlemen – including the stud. He has been handled since the day he was born by my trainer and her husband – he clips, bathes, gets his feet cleaned, mane pulled – you name it. And likes nothing better than scritches – anywhere, anytime! My trainer does it right – every time. That’s why every horse in her barn rides in a snaffle – nothing else.
I have a mare I need to find a home for, she was given to me as a long yearling with a blind eye and cloudiness in her other eye. I had placed her in a few homes but she came back to me.
She is a purebred QH, foundation bred, bay roan 5 yrs old. She lunges, ties, trailers, UTD on shots. has some fear issues with her back feet but I am working on it.
Here is a link to her pedigree:
http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/shi+bar+doc+olena
Here are some pics of her:
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o122/Wnnahrse/Horses/Mia32.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o122/Wnnahrse/Horses/Mialeft.jpg
http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o122/Wnnahrse/Horses/MiaRight.jpg
She is located in Wisconsin.
you can email me at ell_rip@hotmail.com
I have the opposite problem with my stallion. Because he’s such a gentleman at the shows, people don’t know he’s a stallion and crowd him at the gate, run into him, kids ride their ponies under his neck. I’ve been hit in the middle of my back with the bit from the horse behind me on a trail ride, they rode so close, practically on top of him. All things they shouldn’t do with any horse, but they forget and get careless. Regardless of how gentle my stallion is, I never forget what he is and have to make allowances for the idiots around him. I’ve shown him for 16 years, used him for countless demos and clinics, stood him among wheelchairs and walkers, and had parents of tiny tots want to pet him. At home, I don’t even use a rope to lead him, just grab a handfull of his mane or a hand under his chin. Yet, I respect him and what he could do, if he wanted to. However, I have had stallions that were screamers and idiots and dispite the same training, they just couldn’t be trusted in the same situations, and now they are happy geldings. I am not afraid to spare the knife on those who’s temperament, conformation, or anything else was lacking. Were they ever mean or unsafe? No, they were always respectful, just didn’t have the focus or temperament that would earn them the right to keep all their parts, so they lost them.
I have a 7 year old stud. he doesnt act like a stud, we ride with mares geldings and other stallions at shows and he minds his own business. He has a bubble and prefers that other horses not enter that bubble. he will back away quietly. on occasion he wants to say hello to another horse, nicely. has a couple of gelding pals he likes to visit with. He is also a reiner and its been my experience that reining has some really good minded stud horses. they dont scream and strike and charge around like quite a few I have seen in other disciplines. they ride with all other horses and pay no attention. give me a reining trained stud any day, if they made it in training with their testicles then you can bet he has a good mind.
Thank you for this fhotd.
I admit, for my youth and the start of my career in horses i was very afraid of stallions. I was brought up with horses on a boarding facility. Studs weren’t really allowed, but there were a few. They lived in 12×12 box stalls. Solid walls, and the grill ALWAYS closed. So, they would only wait until early mornings to let these creatures run free and they would go batshit crazy. Screaming, bucking, kicking at the handler, etc.
Looking back.. can i blame them?
- A sociable animal locked away from other animals?
- Only getting handled in “low stress” situations.. never getting accustom to TYPICAL boarding facility life/noises/smells/etc
- Gum chains.. ALWAYS.
No, i can’t blame them. I’m glad i’ve come to find well behaved stallions and break my stupid thought of “Stallions r b teh_crazy”. You’re 100% correct. Handlers make them that way. Bad life routines make them that way. Lack of socialization make them that way. Lack of consistency makes them that way.
I am still ALWAYS guarded around stallions.. just a hair more guarded than i am when i normally lead a horse. Pay attention when you lead them.. know them, and dont put yourself in a stupid situation (like, inexperienced handler just tromping up on 3 horses tied to a hitching post and trying to walk behind them. Bad idea in any situation)
Great topic!
I have had stallions for over 10 yrs , who attended shows, venues, were ridden on trails in huge groups and alone and and intermingled with mares and geldings.
Training, kindness, respect and motivational readjusting your work with the horse is a must for any horseowner not just stallions.
My stud lives with his herd- mares and geldings. He is allowed to go and mingle when I want him to and when i take him to his paddock he goes happily.
He is quiet and content. I have done his training up to now and in the spring he will start his under saddle work – with me as well,
while right now an occasional ride to the creek is all he needs to keep him happy. And we bring the mares with us at times.
Rugged lark was an incredible horse- and his trainer had the best time when she was working with him.
what a duo
fugs’ it is these damn Jonny come lately sellers / breeders who have a nothing really good ( dare I say it) Paint stallion they breed to a paint ( OMG it may be a champagne ) mare with a back longer than a semi, a neck so upside down it looks wrong even then and a head longer than the pencil thin neck on that piece of garbage. Add to this the mare is a cross of a saddlbred x tennesse walker by golly and bounces like a kangeroo when it trots and canters,
and there you have it- another fucked up breeding by someone looking for a horrid riding moving butt ugly as you can believe not worth the hay it will take to feed it back yard breeder- who does not ride this stallion and cannot handle it anyway and when she does breed it it attacks the mares it is breeding
Lovely
lets propogate that piece of shit.
no wonder horses are selling for nothing- breeders like this woman should be drawn and quartered
The sire of my first horse, Storm Tex (AQHA), was owned by an older woman who pasture-bred him. He would be out in the pasture with his “girls,” and if anyone came to the fence, he would mosey over and say hello. Had to greet the fans, and all that. Then after he’d gotten his kisses and cookies, he’d excuse himself and go back out to the herd. You’da thought it was a bunch of geldings out there.
The sire of my current gelding, Eastern Echo (TB), was another one like that. A no-nonsense stallion that, if dealing with a snarky mare, would step back, let her “get it out of her system,” and then step in to do his job. The stallion manager at the last station that handled him (EE died in December 2004 of an apparent heart attack — he was 16 years old, and had a full book of mares for 2005) said that he was one of the nicest stallions he had ever handled (and there were many in his career. He had been a stallion manager for decades). He said he would bet top dollar that he could throw a rope halter on the stallion, jump on bareback and go hunting on him.
The bottom line is, stallions (and mares) are just like any other horse (or animal for that matter), except they have hormones. They need to learn the rules — of the road, of the game, of the barn, pick one — and those rules must be fair, clearly taught, and immediately enforced if there is a “testosterone/estrogen moment” and some memory lapse occurs. ;o)
I have a friend that takes his appy stud out on hunter paces and fox hunting etc.
Here is a picture of him. He is well behaved. My friends daughter was talking to him and never realized that he was
riding a stud until later. I have seen stallions at shows and sometimes they behave so much better then a mare. Like you say its how you raise them. There was this stud that use to barrelrace with us and I never seen him being shanked. Some people just dont have a clue.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/eschneider/1429779461/in/set-203059/
Just look at how wild Sparkle is. Yes he is a stud. Look like he is so uncontrolable. I hope he doesnt give my friend a hard time. Yikes he looks like he is getting ready to eat someone.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/eschneider/1430649114/in/set-203059/
And if you have a stallion on the property, your insurance rates go way up cuz they are so dangerous, ya know.
sigh…
The junior paint stallion at our barn gets turned out with the geldings and also sometimes with the senior stallion. He was imprinted at birth and has been fussed over/worked with every day. He’s been shown in halter a couple times this year and was just started under saddle yesterday and he’s an absolute sweetie. The senior QH stallion can be a bit difficult to handle at times despite regular handling and turnout with the junior stallion, but his owner/handler is very competent and capable. I’m proud of everybody involved and can’t wait to see how the horses’ careers go.
It’s a nice change from the last barn I was at that had a stallion. He never got to stretch his legs, was never handled and only got company when he was bred (the mares were put in the pen with him). He was a sweet boy, but sadly neglected.
Ok so what about the owners who have stallions that they themselves can ride bridleless, hunt with safely, showjump etc…. And the horse behaves for them and ONLY them?
My partner shares at a house with a resident stallion. He is a farrier, so used to all sorts of miscreants, and I am his handler, so I certainly have no fear when it comes to handling all sorts of horses. We both do very well together.
However, the stallion on that property respects NOONE except the owner. Into his early teens, but is always paddocked on his own.
One example… Recently was put into the backyard to munch it down. Partner and I went out to do the washing, where we had to put up with the obnoxious brute in our faces, absolutely no respect, biting and generally being nasty. Would not respond to the normal ‘bugger off, you’re in my space’ tactics, ended up having to wave stuff in his face for 5 minutes to encourage him to get lost. Even then, I reckon it was only because he got bored of us, as opposed to respecting our wishes.
However, the worse incident occurred a few weeks ago. Again, he was in the backyard, a strand of hot tape keeping him there. I was leading my gelding out the paddock, down the driveway towards the tie up area. Stallion busts through the tape (apparently it was shorting), and comes straight for the three of us. Knocks my partner out the way (no mean feat), and comes straight for me and my gelding. This was NOT one of the situations where you attempted to rectify it… It was a ‘OH HOLY SHIT’ situation, which resulted in me being knocked to the ground, unfortunately letting go of my gelding, and watching in utter fear as the stallion chased him around the driveway a few times, before heading out on to the road. This was no game- the stallion had a job on his mind- and I was utterly petrified that if he got close enough to my gelding he WOULD have killed him. We quickly jumped into the car (which always has my handling gear in it), and took off down the road after them, they had gone about 600 or 700m before my gelding managed to turn around and head back for home. At a full gallop. Long story short…. They ended up in a raceway where it took us four goes to get my gelding out safely. Once he was gone, we haltered the stallion (calm as you please, mind you, once his ‘challenger’ was gone, he chilled out a little), and took him back to a secure paddock.
I ended up with a terrified horse, who had bite marks all over him, up to the shoulder. It took him 4 or 5 days to return to ‘normal’ in his head. The worst part though, was the fact that his old bowed tendon tripled in size. One ultrasound, and very expensive vets bill later, we determined it was only superficial swelling (also gave him a tetanus, some bute and anti bitoics for all the cuts etc), but it was a vets bill I feel could have been avoided if the stallion had even some minute respect for others besides his owner- that perhaps we COULD have got a handle on him instead of him just running straight through us.
Whereas, you get stallions on the other side of the coin, who are put out with the mares when it’s not breeding season, or geldings, and they are at least RESPECTFUL.
Worst part was…. Never got an apology from the owner. Never got an offer to help out with the vets bill. I had to keep him in a smaller yard, at a more expensive rate while he healed- still had to pay the difference. Yeah she changed the bandages once or twice for me when I couldn’t get up there- that was it. I am only on a pension so that vets bill was a big blow for me (as they always are).
THEN… She tells me not to tell other people (specifically at a new agistment place, where they have stallions) about what happened, supposedly because ‘they might think less of me for not being able to handle a stallion….’ Bull crap. It’s because you don’t want people knowing about what your precious stallion did to my horse.
*CLAP*
*CLAP*
*CLAP*
Fugs – Beautifully put! I just came home from an open show on Saturday where they have listed in the show rules “no junior may show stallions”. I understand why they put this in the showbill, but it is still frustrating for me because my stallion has been a leadline pony for four years!
Oh my God! Thank you for posting that video! Rugged Lark was my all time favorite QH Stallion! You are absolutely correct he was what a Quarter Horse Stallion should be, as versitile as he was beautiful and intelligent. Many years ago he was featured in one of the major horse magazines. That same year my daughter was showing against one of his babies. I got to speaking with the mother of the little girl who owned the, then four year old gelding, Larks Cashier Check and she said that her daughter, in typical 14 year old girl fashion, not only collected several copies of the magazine but had several copies of Rugged Lark’s Breyer model too. I have to say that I was struck by some hero worship myself. What a truely great horse but he didn’t get to be that way without all that very good, top notch training.
CONSISTENCY. Absolutely. From day one, my stallions are handled with a chain over the nose (and around the noseband) when, and ONLY when, they are teasing or breeding. No chain? No stallion behavior. When Taj was four, we took him to another farm to cover a mare who was terrified of hauling due to a wreck. We covered her in their arena; went over three times that week. Then on the weekend, he won the western pleasure class in the same arena — with the mare, still in heat, in the same class. Never twitched an ear at her: he wasn’t wearing his “stud hoss” headgear.
The mare had a gorgeous foal with a delightful disposition that won a ton.
And, oh, yes, this was one of those hot high-powered Ay-rab stallions …
I’d never have a bad-tempered stallion — there are too many GOOD-minded ones.
When I took dressage lessons (many years ago at a Morgan Horse barn), the B/O kept all his boys as stallions. I was a working student, so as I made my rounds each stallion was escorted to the stallion paddock for their turn at being outside for some fresh air. All were well behaved. These were also the horses I took my lessons on.
I know all those boys are gone now. So, to Nemesis, Cassiar, and especially Noah: Your beauty and power is forever in my mind and heart.
Thank you, gentlemen!
I went to a breed show this spring with a friend and her not-high-end stallion (Yes, yes, should be gelded, wotcha. He had no babies hit the ground this year or last year. It’s a start.) who was to be shown in a halter class and sport-horse-in-hand. In the halter class, there was some other person’s stallion standing there with all his junk hanging out and flopping up against his belly. This was not ‘dropped to pee’, mind. No. And he was doing the low, “come here, baby” nicker that studs do to mares. I was amazed that the handler didn’t correct this behavior immediately but let it continue through the class. The horse that placed first (and was of good breed type and well-built) stood on his hind legs three times while in the ring for the class. What? Why? The handler (different handler, different stallion) didn’t correct for that, either.
My friend’s twelve year old stallion who breeds mares and hasn’t been to a show (yes, yes, I know. should be gelded.) since he was a yearling stood quietly during the class. He walked and trotted in-hand without running over his handler. He set up square and stood still while the judge looked at him. We were worried, before we went, that he would be out-of-control and obviously the least-handled, least-mannerly horse in the class. Because, y’know, he’s not a show horse. He hasn’t been trained. He doesn’t practice halter class. We did some brush-up practices with him at home before the show, but this was in a strange place with all kinds of strange horses and we were worried that his training might not be up to show-horse standards.
Afterward we were kind of appalled that other people with nicer horses and more money and better show outfits and a trailer they weren’t ashamed of… had horses that didn’t freaking lead, could not stand still, flopped erections against their bellies and tried to “chat up” the other stallions in the class. Seriously, WTF? My friend’s horse was far and away better behaved than any other horse that was in the ring with him. (It’s not like he’s amazing, either. He just has the halter manners I expect from a horse, including such bizarre abilities as “Stand quietly, in-hand, outside the ring waiting for your class without chatting up nearby horses to see if you are allowed to breed them.” and “Keep all four legs properly on the ground. Do not rear or buck or bolt while in-hand, even if doing something Really Exciting like trotting the sport horse triangle.”) It was an eye-opening experience, for sure.
Also, I’m not sure the other stallions ever met any not-for-breeding horses whereas my friend’s horse sees (but is not allowed to eat) geldings and not-in-heat mares and assorted other things (cows, border collies, people) that have zero interest in sex. They’re not in his field, but they’re next door and around and about. He knows that he is not going to breed every equine he sees. He also knows that if he *tries*, they will give him what-for. (An assertive older mare that is still reasonably athletic but infertile is a great companion for a younger stud. She will manner him *right* up.) I think a lot of the poorly-behaved stallions out there need to see a little more of the world, especially the part of it that does not include mares-in-heat.
here you go, right off craigslist…why do people breed babies? I hope their 12 year old daughter gets knocked up…
Three year old AQHA mare. Bred to champagne appaloosa sport horse. Have the paper work to register her. Not broke, but no reason why she can’t be. Looking for loving home.
$150
(360)825-6360
I went to something called “the Midwest Horse Fest” a few years ago. It was in late April. Madison, WI. DH and I both ride, but we are amateurs and beginners. We went to stallion row. I can’t tell you how many times I heard “Stallion Coming”…as we pressed ourselves up against the stall doors to avoid the stallion being led past.
My uninformed opinion is this….if you can’t walk your stallion down a barn aisle without freaking people out, if you have to even mention his gender….geld him.
When I was 15, I worked in a crappy nasty rental string stable. I didn’t know any better, and there were horses there. Anyways, they had FOUR 2 year old studs. Four of them. They were really not even halter broke. Me and the other 15 year old girl were the only ones that handled them at all, because the owner was too old. We led them with a stud chain over the nose, used liberally to avoid being run away with. These studs were kept in their stalls 23 1/2 hours a day. And virtually all of the other horses were mares. That made spring an interesting time.
THEN she bred two of the studs. Resulting in one mare being injured. Oh wait, no. She didn’t breed them, she told me and the other girl to put a stud and a mare in the same stall (yes, a 12×12 stall) and watch to see if they bred. She wasn’t even in the barn! Yep, two inexperienced teenagers handling an unbroke stud for breeding. Looking back I’m surprised the only injury was the one mare (it appears he penetrated her anus, she was bleeding).
She also believed that it was necessary to restrict a stallion’s exercise. Not sure why, but she said you had to.
Anyways, that place definitely cemented in my mind that stallions are dangerous animals.
I quit working there and went to work for a horse trader. He also did some small-scale breeding. He had a VERY nice APHA stallion. This horse was the opposite of the fugly studs from the other place (actually one of them turned out to be a very nice looking horse, but is still a stud and has no life). I could lead him with just a lead snapped under his chin. I never had to jerk on his face to get him to listen.
He was ridden and turned out, and was expected to mind. He was a wonderful horse, and you never would have known he was a stud unless you saw his extra parts.
Personally, I won’t own a stallion because I think that unless you use him for breeding, it’s just not fair to the horse. But I also don’t buy into the crap that some people try to feed you about them.
I agree, I have had experience with stallions of several different breeds (all english type- TB’s, WB’s, Freisians, Lipizzans) and I have not run into very many crazy nutty ones. But, I suppose that’s because I tend to avoid those crazy nutty type owners. =) The stallions I’ve ridden have been saints. Cross tied in the wash rack with a mare cross tied right next to them and no problem at all. Riding shoulder to shoulder down the trail together, in the horse trailer together, in the dressage ring together, etc. The Lipp I knew was retired from the Spanish Riding School and was a saint at giving lunge lessons to little kids, no matter if he was sharing the arena with mares or geldings or other stallions. Along the same topic, I have a major issue with people who have bitchy mares and their excuse is “oh, that’s a mare for you.” Correction: that’s a mare who only gets ridden twice a month, by someone who only rides twice a month, thus they do not ride very well, and the mare knows this, and so she calls the shots and becomes the leader in the partnership, and then she feels she’s earned the right to be a bitch about it. Because I know a lot of mares who get daily attention, praise, and reassurance that they enjoy and crave, and they will do anything you ask them to. I tend to be of the opinion that people like this do not need horses, period. Sure, some horses are less devistated than others when you don’t come out to see them, don’t set boundaries, don’t really care much at all… But that doesn’t mean that those horses wouldn’t be a lot better off if you DID do those things. If you don’t want to put in the effort, don’t get a horse. Just pay for a lesson every month or so if you need to get your fix.
My haflinger wasn’t gelded til he was 4 (he is 7 now) and I have had him since he was a weanling. He was kept out at pasture with buddies til he was two then moved into a central pasture where he could be involved with the goings on after that. He was better behaved than my 23 year old appendix mare is now (that I have had for 20 years). Lots has been learned in that time.
I have been involved with horses for 20 of my 30some years. We own property and have personally cared for many horses of all ages and breeds over the years. The reason I explain this is for some background so you don’t think I am some weekender fence rider. I need some info and some help.
It is the badly behaved gelding situation. We have a young gelding (4 yrs, I think) on our property owned by someone else. He is the first horse I have ever run into in all this time who charges at people. He is sweet with his owner and very “well trained” in her presence. He is trained using Parelli methods I believe. (no comment) If you go out to the pasture with a “stick” or whip, he ignores you. If you come unarmed he will sometimes (not always) come charging, ears back. If you stand your ground and make yourself “big”, he turns around and offers to kick. Now I would have liked to think in theory, I would have approached this as a spoiled brat who was used to getting his own way and tell him otherwise with a swift clobber with a big stick but he completely caught me off guard. I was out checking my mares, his pasture mates (he is the very bottom of the totem pole in pecking order which I also believe contributes to his human aggression) and I was 3 months pregnant when he first charged and scared the shit out of me, stuck in the middle of a 35 acre pasture. He doesn’t do it to everyone but he now has me pegged as I won’t even go out there anymore (my safety is much more important than him thinking I am boss at this point in time!) and send my husband out to check on or catch my mares (I am 9 months pregnant now).
He did it again today to someone else. Again another horse person caught completely off guard. Another woman.
I realize I am opening myself up to loads of negative comments but I need to know what to do if this ever happens again. It is just not something I am familiar dealing with.
I will point out that I am not moving my horses, I live here and he is leaving at the end of October. Unless it can be proven that this is fixed, he will not be coming back in the spring so my problem has been solved but it will become someone else’s.
I realize this is kind of deviating from the topic but FHOTD did mention snarky geldings at the end of the post
Loved the rugged lark video, thanks for the link.
Aylisha- neat blog- also thanks for the link.
Attitude is one of the reasons I would never breed my mare (also, no papers, and she is “riding” quality but not “breeding” quality). She can be such a heinous bitch sometimes… which she does get disciplined for. I love her to death, but I’m not sure I would want two of her….
I was watching (on telly) some international level showjumping a few weeks ago. Various European teams competing at Windsor, it was. At least one, if not two or three of the horses competing were stallions. Yep, stallions taking part in a top class international horse show. And no nonsense from them either. It’s not the only showjumping compeition I’ve seen stallions competing in either.
Also interesting to hear commentators saying things like ‘That horse is only nine years old – still relatively inexperienced. we can expect better things from him in a couple of years.” Admittedly we’re talking top level competition here, but the horses aren’t expected to reach the top until about 10. The great showjumper, Milton, was 8 when he started his international career and was 17 when he retired. It seems such a waste that some horses are either shown purely as youngsters and more or less ditched after, or else broken as two year olds and expected to be competing hard as four year olds.
“crackerpuppies”? I learned a new word?!
Completely unrelated, but:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opMiCyoRzYM
Holy. Fuck. That is the single worst rider I have ever seen.
Interesting theory. Discipline, boundaries, training…poor behavior a result of a lack of the three items, idiotic owners…
Sounds like Pit Bulls to me. Idiotic owners ruin them for everyone else and the cycle of misinformation continues…
I agree totally with this post. A lot of people allow stallions to do what they want because they assume their behaviour will be the same irregardless. It’s stupid. It always bothered me working at the racetrack, not just with the colts but with all of the horses, they were so unschooled. I guess some people thought rank horses had more spirit so would race better or something like what, who knows. Still, most of the 2 year old colts there who were at the track for the first time were better behaved than some geldings and mares I’ve seen. Actually I spent one winter retraining a few broodmares and they were the absolute worst, most stubborn things I’ve ever worked with.
When I visited lexington and went to the thoroubred farms it was interesting to see the difference in behaviours at different farms. Some horses like Silver Ghost or Seeking the Gold were more bitey and mean, and horses like Pleasant Tap just stood there and let little kids hug their legs. Then again, maybe some stallions just don’t like standing for tourists but they do everything else nicely, lol.
Greetings, all.
I’m a long time lurker and avid reader of this blog, and wanted to post about a neighbor I used to have. He bred about 20 mares (for tax purposes, of all things), left them in the pasture until they dropped their babies, and then sold them at auction. He kept about 3 ‘stallions’, all of them real POS’s. Never did anything with them except breed those guys, and kept them in little bitty pens all the time. Anytime a horse trailer pulled into his driveway those studs would scream and throw themselves at the fence. I also got lots of laughs whenever one of his studs would get loose, because all he could do was find a bucket of feed and a stick, and sort of herd the stud back into it’s pen.
It was awful, and probably one of the worst examples of a stallion/horse owner that I’ll ever run across. He was strictly old school, and didn’t like to call the vet out for anything. I’m merely a trail rider, and own 2 grade geldings, and one well bred QH mare. She’s 23 and never been bred, because I always figured I had no business raising babies. Thanks for listening.
Absolutely a great topic! I owned a stallion for nearly 2 years, he came from a bad background and wasn’t the best mannered thing around. I wish everyone could understand that while a stallion does think with his boy parts at times, there is no reason to treat them any differently, my stallion was expected to behave just like any of my horses were. After a year of him being with us I can honestly say he was a doll, I had him at a 4H barn, he was great, stood in crossties with another stallion in the ties in front of him, mares, it didn’t matter, he knew the rules. I rode him in the arena with mares in heat, he never put a foot wrong. I know somewhere someone taught him right because after he got over the abuse he was a saint. He never bit or mouthed anyone no matter what. I always told him, behave and you can keep them. One day he forgot to behave, reared up and struck out at my hubby, he was reprimanded immediatly and gelded 5 days later. I really had never intended on keeping him a stallion, but he was such an angel, guess I just waited for him to screw up, lol. Now he’s living with a great family as a happy, healthy, quirky little gelding. Oh and he was 20 years old when he was gelded, never say you can’t geld an old guy!
Sigh. Well, horse people think their athletes should spend several hours a day in a cubicle with nothing to do, and that the sexy time will not only calm down their animals, but pass the mellow on to their babies, so it really shouldn’t surprise anyone anymore that the stupid burns even outside of the immediate splash zone. I’ve only met two stallions with behavior issues. One was led from stall to arena for breeding with multiple chains, since she couldn’t/wouldn’t take him out for anything else anymore, even though he was just a little Morgan, so he was going stir-crazy. The other was a 3yo Paint colt who was being broken to ride while I was at the trainers, and he got a bug up his usually-immaculately-mannered butt one day and reared up, accidentally catching the nose of the older lady leading him and almost knocked her out. He didn’t put another hoof wrong the rest of the time I knew him, but being around all those new mares at the beginning of spring was just too much at that moment. If he’s not safe and happy, it’s your job to fix it, even if you lose your “investment” to do so.
The first year we opened the adoption ranch, a stallion came through the program. His name was Tawakoni and he was by Grindstone. It’s a long, entertaining as to just how I managed to say yes to a stallion donation (let’s just say my cell phone reception wasn’t the best). Anyway, well-meaning friends warned me to stay away from Tawakoni — they were sure all stallions were vicious. One neighbor even told my husband that Tawakoni would try to kill me during “my time of the month” — an appalling but hilarious statement in many ways.
Tawakoni turned out to have been trained and handled by excellent horse people. He was kind, well mannered and very respectful of people (of both genders and at all times of the month). He taught me a great deal about how stallions should and could behave, when raised and managed properly.
Soon after Tawakoni, we had 2 other stallions come through the program. Both were also gentlemen and a pleasure to work with. Although they eventually were gelded, these horses showed no change in temperament afterward and took to retraining very well in their new homes (one as an eventer, the other as a hunter).
These experiences completely changed my view of stallions — and also greatly increased my respect for the Texas race breeders/trainers who sent those horses here.
LOVE the comment about the “hot” breed stallions. This is a true story and I would NOT have believed it if I didn’t experience it. A “horse club” friend of ours who is kind of a kook, had some very nice arabians. She was breeding white ones with pink skin(of course these were part arabs but her stallion was purebred) and getting them by using a beautiful chestnut stallion, who had been shown and had get that were doing well. We were interested in breeding my daughter’s hackney to him for a large english type pony. I know, but he turned out very nice and is currently packing his second kid around the shows. When we went to see him and check him out in person, we walked into the barn to find the owner clipping him – he was not tied and there were mares in and around the barn. She took him out and with the voice command, “show off”, he did just that, moved, pranced, snorted, bucked, acted all the fire an arabian stallion should be. When we had seen enough, she again gave a verbal command and he stopped and walked over to her for some scratching!
We did take the pony over for breeding. On the day we arrived, she had me walk the pony to the side of the pen where he was kept when a mare was in for breeding, to make sure she was “ready” to stay for breeding. He began to “show off” until the owner said, “Enough, she’s not impressed. You come talk nice to her.” AND HE DID! He settled down, walked right over the the fence and started the low sweet nickers. That was all it took for that pony(she’s easy). I had heard she could give verbal commands in the pasture to her stallions and they would obey as well, never saw that, but I believe it!
I have seen some nice stallions, but have never been as impressed as I was with her and that arab. You are completely right in saying, there is NO excuse for bad stallion behavior. Isn’t funny though how those with poorly behaved stallions, also have poorly behaved mares, geldings and young stock as well?
In our breed, POA, youth exhibitors are allowed to show stallions. You will sometimes see stallions doing lead-line with a 6 year old aboard and a 14 year old walking. They compete in every discipline, with mares and geldings both. The breed is meant for young riders, and if a stallion doesn’t have the temperament, he is very soon a handsome show gelding.
When we first got our stallion (as a 5 month old colt), my intention was to make him a very colorful kid’s pony. However, his quality and movement just kept amazing us, and his gelding date kept being postponed BECAUSE he was also very well mannered and quiet. He was broke as a 3 year old, earned several World Championships (under saddle as well as halter) and was bred for his first season as a four year old. If at any time he had gone rank or became difficult to deal with, there was always plan B. I think he knows about plan B, because after five years as a breeding stallion, he is still the easiest of all my horses to deal with.
Hey Fugly – how did the show go w/ the POA? Did she measure?
Yep, endurance stallions seem to be better behaved in general than most of the stallions I’ve been around. They get tons of conditioning and know their job and it’s not just jumping on a mare. I have seen a couple badly behaved boys, but in general, most bad behaviour has been from mares that don’t like to be passed, who are guarding their trailermate or camp-mate and squeal and give you the evil eye, snaky neck or kick at you while on the trail or at the water trough. 9 times out of 10, the horses who are out of control or are a problem are new to sport or have owners that don’t reprimand the bad behaviour in the first place. Ride managers also have the authority to ban ANY horse that is a safety concern. The vet at the ride I was at this past weekend stated something like the following: Finish line heartrate is 60 beats per minute. If your horse injures me, I can guarantee you my HR will be over 60 and we’ll use my HR as your finish HR!
omg. for the sake of all that is holy please show this video as what never ever to do while jumping. this pony is a freakin’ saint. my horse would have bucked him off instantly. i’m amazed he stayed on, and those are some big ass jumps. i have never seen anything so utterly ridiculous in the world of show jumping.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opMiCyoRzYM&feature=player_embedded
A great stallion makes a even better gelding. period. There are starving horses of every breed right now, most of them qh and tb…why is it neccessary to carry a glut of studs right now? I love my geldings!
>>I do follow some of the John Lyons stuff – you have five seconds to make them think they are going to die. Then it is over, and you don’t pick at them.< <
I agree completely. And that's for truly bad behavior - striking, for example.
>>They lived in 12×12 box stalls. Solid walls, and the grill ALWAYS closed. So, they would only wait until early mornings to let these creatures run free and they would go batshit crazy. Screaming, bucking, kicking at the handler, etc.
Looking back.. can i blame them?< <
EXACTLY MY POINT! Most people create "crazy" stallions...if you subjected any mare/gelding to the same lack of turnout and lack of interaction many stallions are subjected to, you'd get the same results.
PandorasBox - If you create a beast that only you can handle, YOU should have to always be available to handle it. It's unfair to inflict that upon anyone else.
>>Along the same topic, I have a major issue with people who have bitchy mares and their excuse is “oh, that’s a mare for you.†Correction: that’s a mare who only gets ridden twice a month, by someone who only rides twice a month, thus they do not ride very well, and the mare knows this, and so she calls the shots and becomes the leader in the partnership, and then she feels she’s earned the right to be a bitch about it. Because I know a lot of mares who get daily attention, praise, and reassurance that they enjoy and crave, and they will do anything you ask them to< <
*APPLAUSE* Dead on. Has nothing to do with hormones. A mare will be happy to be the boss if you do not seem to be stepping up to the plate, LOL. Our little POA mare (and the show is this coming Sunday so we'll see if she measures!) is like that - she got dumped because she had learned to walk on people. She unlearned it quickly!
MLH - re spoiled Parelli gelding: cross-fence and put him out by himself. End of problem. It is not worth being kicked and if someone else gets kicked, they may sue YOU for not protecting them from him. (I'm not clear if you own the property, lease, etc?) If you want to fix a charger, you have to be unafraid to clock him with a longe whip if he comes into your space. I would not advise doing so pregnant! Just put him by himself and let his idiot owner who ruined him deal with him until he leaves.
>>The vet at the ride I was at this past weekend stated something like the following: Finish line heartrate is 60 beats per minute. If your horse injures me, I can guarantee you my HR will be over 60 and we’ll use my HR as your finish HR!< <
I like him!
Good topic! Up until a few years ago, I was under the impression that all stallions were insane beasts. The only stallions I’d ever been around had been introduced with disclaimers as long as a pharmaceutical commercials. During my first lesson on an Icelandic horse, the farm owner brought out the horse that I was to ride that day and casually mentioned that he was the farm stud. Total saint of a horse. Changed my mind from that moment forward.
Excellent subject!
Proper care of a stallion is essential, but does not guarantee the animal will be good natured. Sometimes the genetics behind that animal isn’t there These stallions are nasty and sadly pass this on to their offspring – nasty tempered sons and nasty tempered daughters.
Financial gain is no doubt behind the ‘stallions are mean’ propaganda. Money always attracts the nasties (and I mean that in respect to people).
That jumping video – OMG! It was hilarious if you weren’t feeling for the horse at every moment! The comments were great too. One “I do believe he is trying to castrate himself…” But one guy said he was pushing off the horses neck so he could take the weight off over the jump? Yeah, right….A couple other comments that he was a polo player and they were doing a polo player-jumping swap which actually, kinda made sense. Did you see if Fugs? He rode like some real bad polo players I’ve seen – all in the knee, holding on to that poor horses mouth even before the jumps. Doesn’t make them a good polo player either, those guys are all about thinking they can knock the ball out of the park but they sure as hell can’t ride their ponies! I bet he is horrible on his polo ponies too! That horse should be given the Golden Apple award for putting up with an imbecile human.
Oh yeah, I’ve not worked around many studs. But my Grandfather had a QT stud he used to ride to the local coffee shop every morning and then ground tie him while Grandpa gossiped away the morning with his coffee clutch. He was always known to be a perfectly behaved gentlemen (the stud that is, Grandpa on the other hand not always!).
Yofi- Holy shit! That pony needs to be sainted! I can only hope that retard’s crotch hurts as much as that poor baby’s mouth and back.
I’m not sure which scenario I like less: people thinking all stallions are dangerous beasts, or that they’re all safe teddybears and should be coddled into rankness. (“He nudges me because he likes me!”) *gag* I do think it’s a safe bet that if someone isn’t responsible enough to own a stallion, they probably aren’t responsible enough to own any horse.
Ok, he is definitely a well behaved stallion. And I don’t really have a comment on stallion behavior because I’ve not had a tremendous amount of experience with them first hand.
But I do have a question about Rugged Lark that’s off topic and I’m seriously NOT trying to be an ass… but what’s with the four beat lope thing going on throughout? He seems smooth as can be and a lovely ride, but at the same time very stiff and restricted in his movement. At one point she’s posting the hell out of the trot and he’s giving maybe an ok working trot. Was he just really old in the video?
BarnyardPunch –
From what I can tell the pair of legs are actually striking at the same time. Collected canter always looks kind of choppy to me, and I think the fact that he’s in such a long frame contributes to it. The few times he lengthens out his stride looks normal. Why she had him collected to that extreme I don’t know; the tempe changes do require collection but I would prefer to see more impulsion as opposed to that nearly-WP lope. The posting I have no clue about. Maybe she’s showing off the fact that a QH has a postable trot? Lol
I will never understand not training an animal you own. I don’t care if its a 2lb Chihuahua or a 1500lb horse. Why on earth would you want do deal with something that misbehaves all the time?!?! For my second horse (first was an polo pony, Argie TB that was a total whackadoo) I went out and bought a 3yo Arab stud colt. He didn’t have a lot of handling (he’d tolerate being groomed, having his feet done and getting shots and things like that, but wasn’t touched much other than that kind of thing), but he was kept in a little bachelor herd of the other boys his age at his breeder’s. Everyone called me crazy and thought he’d kill me.
I brought him to a boarding barn and within a month he was one of the best behaved horses there. He’d never really been around mares so it was very carefully (with a “carrot stick”…hey…they’re good for something!) in no uncertain terms that he still had to walk nicely on a loose lead (screw stud chains, it was either a flat nylon or rope halter) despite pretty girls or whatever else might be catching his attention. I horrified the hell out of a couple of the boarders that I would dare smack the poor darling…and with a stick! But you know what? He’s still my best buddy – you won’t find a more in your pocket horse. He understands the rules, that there are consequences for breaking them. He knows that I’m always fair and consistent.
I further freaked out the other boarders by breaking out the big bad stallion in a halter because he had been ear twitched really badly somewhere along the line and I couldn’t get a real bridle on him because I couldn’t get it over his ears. I don’t really believe bits control horses anyway so we went with a plain old flat halter with some reins clipped to it. I rode in a couple of different clinics with him early on in just that halter and people think I’m nuts when I still occasionally take him on the trails in a halter. One of the clinics we did had a focus on obstacles you might find on the trail (bridges, logs, opening a gate, putting on/taking off a rain coat, etc.). My boy had never seen most of that stuff before, but guess who wasn’t the freakazoid about it? The big, bad stallion the Parelli people were afraid of all day. Guess who was? The Parelli-ed geldings. It was hilarious to me to watch all the people who’d been giving me “advice” for the past couple months have whackadoo horses while mine took a nap.
Most of the boarders were afraid to have him out with their horses because he might eat them or something. I’m not really sure what they thought the 700lb Arab was going to do to their 16+h giants, but hey. I went along with it. He did get to go out with my friend’s Belgian and Percheron geldings. The Belgian is the same age so they played idiot colt games together and the Perch babysat and kept them in line.
I did ultimately geld him, but only because he was a cryptorchid. Had he not been, I would have shown and possibly bred him had he done something in the show ring. It really didn’t change his personality much. He got a little bit more lazy and a little bit less mouthy, but that’s about it.
I had the priviledge of sharing my barn with a super sweet gentleman of a stallion for the last 6 years of his life. All I have to say is whomever taught him manners did an awesome job. I hauled him to my vet, after I moved him here….and he was in the stocks and having his teeth floated for about 45 minutes before either of the technicians noticed that he was a stallion. I had to make a remark about him being one before they noticed. Being an ex show horse, I rode him with mares, geldings…whatever. Under saddle or with a normal halter on, he would never think of looking crosswise at a mare. I could tie him next to any of my mares in the trailer..or at the side of the trailer and he would never bat an eye or make a sound.
His cue for being a “stallion” was a particular halter, a stud chain (only time one was used), and the scent of a certain soap that I used (as did his previous owner) to wash mares. But, he was always in control, and I could tell him no and shut him down in a second.
I did always ask people if it was ok for me to bring him on a trail ride though..since some people did have issues controlling their mares (or think that they would) when riding with a stallion.
Now, I did have one stupid boarder…she thought that since Jim was such a nice wonderful boy..that it was ok to bring her mare (in season) up to the other side of the paddock fence that Jim happened to be in….what an idiot. He didn’t do anything other than come prancing over and posture in that stallion like way…and talk to her…but geez. Give the guy a break. He had no handler, so at that particular moment..he was just a boy.
I miss the old man dearly. He truly gave me an appreciation for the heart that a stallion posesses, and he was pleasure to have in my life.
Almost forgot – then there was the time I went to a stallion show with a friend – to help handle her well-mannered stud. As we were all standing at the in gate to go in (me and my son hold various pieces of equipment) an absolutely huge dun(think butt as wide as a semi) let go with both back feet. He was not crowded, ears up, no fidgiting- all was quiet. He caught me square in the gut with one of those feet (good thing I was through having kids!) and almost dropped me. Show management was totally pissed. Owner or handler of horse – not a word. Are you ok – gee I’m sorry. Nada. If I had been thee inches closer, he would have caught me either in the sternum or under the chin.
My gelding’s sire was known for the color that he threw, he was a homozygous tobiano and if it were not for my gelding I guess he may have been thought to be homozygous for black too as Cody was the only chestnut by him (although he only sired a handful of foals, thankfully!) Bright Hi Flash had a horrible reputation for being dangerous, I heard horror stories of him breaking a girl’s hand against a wall, kicking someone’s car and taking off with the trainer on his back, clearing a couple of fences and falling into the neighbor’s inground pool. Yes, this was all learned AFTER I had Cody and AFTER Cody was safely a gelding. I actually brought Cody to that trainer’s farm (I learned all of this after I had him there, needless to say, he didn’t stay there very long!) The folks who worked there told me this as they thought Cody was going to be just as dangerous, the first time they had to turn him out they were leading him out, one person on each side of him…a chain over both sides of his nose…of course they all felt stupid after they learned that he was a well behaved GELDING!! They also sheepishly admitted that even Cody was looking at them funny as they led him out in such insulting fashion! He quickly became one of the favorites:)
I watched in horror the one or two times that they were breeding “Joker”…as Cathy mentioned leading the rouge stallions with the chain over their nose and an aluminum baseball bat yelling to clear the way for the stallion…omg!! That is how they got Joker from the stallion barn to the breeding area, about 100′, excep it was a wooden twitch and two people leading him, one person literally hitting him in the head as they went along…he would then savage the mare as he tried to breed her…it was all so sad. Come to find out, many years later, I guess his testicles were not fully dropped. They were being pinched and he was very much in pain. After he was gelded (around 13 years old) he was then sold to a young girl who rode him all over – SAFELY! So, a stallion CAN be gelded and rehabed to be an honest citizen. Joker was actually quite sweet in the stall, he loved attention and wanted you to talk and play with him. He would stick his nose through the feed door (just big enough to fit his nose) and he would stick his tongue out for you to play with it.
He would readily come to the front of the stall for attention, ears up and begging for you to talk to him. I am glad that he had a happy ending.
I admit that I’m the same way as the person who was petting the stallion. I was always taught and told by the “intelligent” stable I use to ride at, that stallions were wild and crazy. I know there are stallions out there like Rugged Lark, but I haven’t seen any in my little time with horses.
There was one horse at our stable who was a retired racehorse. I don’t know if he was gelded or intact but that horse would go nuts! He broke his stall bars once (mind you, these were simply wires crossed together to look nice) and he would scream. Out of the few months I had been there, I think I had only seen him out in the pasture once. I may not have been around to see him out more than that but I think I would be kinda upset if all I did was work all day with not play to hope for.
For ahughes798 and others that have heard “Stallion coming through” at the equine expos, their contract requires that we do this. A year and a half ago, I took Sprocket to the Equine Affair in Columbus, Ohio. Whenever we took Sprocket out of his stall we had to have three people around him: one leading the “crazy stallion”, one walking behind him to keep people from getting too close, and one leading the parade announcing “Stallion coming through”. I felt like such an idiot and sighed everytime someone plastered themselves to the wall when hearing my 13.0hh grey pony was a stallion.
http://SommerPonyFarm.com/stallion.html
I love that video, they are having a great time together. The rider has a huge grin the whole time!
Actually, there ARE endurance riders on stallions who yell “STALLION COMING”. Some friends & I were headed up a switchback trail when a well known endurance rider was coming down. She yelled down to us “Stud horse coming down”. My friend yelled back “Mare horse coming up”. LOL We knew the stallion owner quite well & she actually thought it fun to get her stallions acting studly in public.
I’ve been at vet checks where the line had to be cleared because a mad mannered stallion was acting up. Just last year there was a serious injury at an endurance ride, caused by a stallion attacking another horse & getting hold of the rider’s leg. The rider was pulled from the horse & had major injuries to the leg which required surgery.
Yes there are very well mannered stallions doing endurance, but I’d say there are almost as many ill mannered stallions out there as well.
Bravo fugs! Excellent topic.
Having worked as a groom for racing standardbreds, I can tell first hand that there is a wide variety of “stallion” behaviour. It does depend a lot on handling, but I believe breeding as well, as there were some race lines that were just known to be pissed-off horses.
I had to buy one of my favourite (gasp!) stallions because he was sooooo well mannered. If he was in cross-ties you could walk a mare right under his nose, he’d give off maybe a little nicker, but that was about it. No screaming, no pawing, no striking, nothing. He lived with two geldings and was NOT the leader of the group, the 28 yr old appy gelding was most certainly the boss!!!
Most shockingly, I for a time, had TWO STALLIONS and TWO GELDINGS in ONE PASTURE!! YES PEOPLE!!! IT CAN BE DONE!!! Mind you, these were two of the most well behaved stallions, most of the time. There were the odd kick-fests but nothing too dangerous (that I could see anyways). They just sort of minded their own space and if one got two close, the more dominant one would just glare, and the other would back away. Out in the wild, there are so-called bachelor herds are there not, where just lonely stallions would group together? Sort of like in my back yard!
Now that there have been two passings (old appy gelding and older stallion) it’s just one gelding and stallion. Best buddies they are! However, I am looking to move and will be forced to board my horses for some time, and just about every boarding stable that I have spoken with have said “NO STALLIONS” so I will probably have to geld him.
Thanks a lot asshat rank stallion owners! Way to ruin it for the rest of us!
******* Jumper rider from hell *******
Off-topic….but I can tell you that THIS guy probably isn’t going to be able to breed after this…. (the rider, not the horse)
You guys NEED to check this out. Seriously. Scary.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opMiCyoRzYM
StillLearning, you hit the nail on the head. The man who sold me Huey said, “Every horse needs groceries and a job to do.” That means everything from pasture pal to endurance and everything between. If a horse is fed the equivalent of jet fuel and never turned out or worked, it will turn into a screaming idiot, too, whether intact or not. My guy currently isn’t getting ridden much because I’ve got a torn rotator cuff that will require surgery in a few weeks and then we’ll be another six or so weeks before I can ride. I have several options with him — everything from daily turnout to sending him to one of my instructors for a month. Regardless, he’ll have lots of attention and a “job” to do. He’s pretty laid back — “uncomplicated” is a word that has been applied to him — so whatever decision I make, he’ll be okay with it. I’m not going to have a raving looneytune after all is said and done.
Someone else in another topic said that if people have horses, they need to understand that there are responsibilities that go with them. To my mind, having animals is just as important a task as having children. EACH need to be monitored and disciplined, guided down the correct path — praised or “paddled” as needed. The parenting of two-legged or four-legged “children” is a serious business. The end result after all the work and expense is a “child” to be very proud of. A suitable goal for anyone.
well, i guess i am going to fall into the crappy stallion owner category! we had a nice stallion prospect that we could not get to to stop nipping. i believe we tried every method known to man, consulted trainers, owners, “googled” and had 2 different trainers come out to help us(1 of them suggested gelding) we decided to geld him and his behavior started to change within 2 weeks and in 2 months the biting was over. he is a happy fellow with diminished hormones. he was maturing extremely fast and i have to wonder if that was not a factor, even the vet commented on his advanced development. we have a new stud colt, similar lineage, with no such problems, and he responds to normal discipline techniques. but since i really do not want to deal with stallion behavior at all, he will be shown in-hand, have seman collected and frozen, then be gelded before he starts his real career. if his lineage weren’t so rare i would not even bother to collect and would just geld at 6- 9 months. watching a close friend of mine raise many foals through the years has convinced me that many are easy, some difficult and a few nearly impossible. she had raised 4 of the nicest behaved colts ever, then came the “buckskin monster” and she became a fan of early gelding. i am just glad there is the option of gelding and wish it were utilized more often!
I’ve had varied experiences with stallions. My mare’s sire is absolutely the sweetest stallion ever — possibly the sweetest horse. But he has low testosterone, so that explains some of it. He’s quiet, well-mannered, does not bite, can be turned out with pregnant mares, foals, geldings etc. He does know when it’s time to breed, but he has a “breeding halter” to signal that, and is quite a gentleman. Does NOT like tall chestnut mares after getting kicked by one when he was trying to breed her. Other than that, the only breeding mishap he’s had was going over the chest bar of a trailer once when arriving at the repro vet for semen collection; he got a little overexcited and tried to head out the escape door… but once he realized he was trapped, he stayed perfectly still while he was freed.
His son at the same farm is much more “all boy” and needs more careful handling. He does listen, though. My mare’s breeders do a really good job with ground manners on all their horses.
There’s an elderly standardbred stallion where I board… 31 years old, foundered, not terribly capable of anything but he’s quite the talker and has been known to bite. My mare is not too impressed with him, but he’s quite the Romeo towards her.
>>well, i guess i am going to fall into the crappy stallion owner category! we had a nice stallion prospect that we could not get to to stop nipping. i believe we tried every method known to man, consulted trainers, owners, “googled†and had 2 different trainers come out to help us(1 of them suggested gelding) we decided to geld him and his behavior started to change within 2 weeks and in 2 months the biting was over. < <
Nope. You’re a great stallion owner. You realized yours did not have the disposition to stay a stallion and you took appropriate action.
OT – This little mare needs an upgrade. She is very close to me but I just don’t have the money or the space for another one right now….I just hate seeing an animal tied out like this one.
http://macon.craigslist.org/grd/1418621943.html
or if the ad gets deleted:
http://community.webshots.com/album/575175049VpRUAw
I compete in NATRC Competitive Trail Rides and it’s common for people to compete on stallions. They ride (and picket!) their stallions right alongside other people’s mares and geldings, my mares included, and it’s never an issue. Often you only know it’s a stallion because there’s a yellow ribbon in the tail (signifies “stallion” like a red ribbon signifies “kicker”.) Most regular NATRC competitors have well-behaved horses!
I really had no experience around stallions until a few years ago- when I moved to GA and discovered a fellow NATRC competitor lived nearby- I spent some time with her at her barn, and she took me riding on her Tennessee Walking Horses- her stallion is wonderful. He’s well-behaved and a fun ride, with loads of personality. I loved riding him so much that I bought one of his foals. The filly I bought was also well-behaved, personable, well-socialized, and easy to handle. She has since grown into a wonderful mare with a great temperament just like her sire.
Now that same person has a young stud colt, about 2 1/2 yrs old now, and he’s also well behaved and very friendly. He will one day be their herd stallion and I have no doubt he will be a perfect gentleman at the barn, in the ring, on the trails, and in the breeding shed. I believe that any stallion they own will be well-behaved because they insist on good behavior, and aren’t afraid to use discipline.
I myself would probably never own a stallion, simply because I’m not prepared to deal with putting up stallion-safe cross-fencing to keep a stud away from my and my neighbor’s mares. I like being able to cross-fence with hot tape or hot wire and know that worst-case, the hot fence goes down, and my horses wander into a pasture I was resting!
QUESTION for FUGS (or anyone)- what do you consider stallion-safe fencing?
Fugs, in my dreams every horse owner is responsible enough to do right by thier horse and themselves…Then I wake up.
To any one who has a stallion: Take a look at your horse and think “Can he do even half of what Rugged lark has done?” If your answer is and certain yes don’t breed him, and I don’t mean his potential to accomplish but has done!!! Its the stallion owners JOB to get his/her stallion fit, trained and shown, and at shows he needs to place consistently in the top three spots. If you do this with your stallion for 2-4 years and he does all this then GREAT, keep him whole. If he isn’t placing high at any shows and you cant be bothered to figure out how or what would fix that, then cut off the set and make him a nice gelding…he will be happier and so will the rest of us. A stallion is a business, if he wasn’t he would be a gelding, and if your consistent and firm he will be a nice pet too.
I know many stallions – mostly Akhal Tekes – who are extremely well-behaved. I believe that what they have in common is that they are all very well trained when young. Most have demanding jobs to do still, so the discipline is constant. My own boy was a herd stallion before he got any training at all, so when he went into training he was extremely opinionated about what he would and would not put up with, to the point of attacking his trainer. Gelding put a screeching halt to that, within a couple of weeks he was finally listening to humans. His ground manners are just lovely, and he is currently being finished (if a horse ever is) by a wonderful, kind, firm trainer who adores him and won’t take any crap from him.
CdnEq I am wondering if he is an ex X games participant and is trying to do the “superman” trick of the horses jump??? LOL
People think because the Minis are so little and “kyoot” they don’t NEED manners…far from the truth! They can STILL hurt you bad!
All of our boys can be lead without chains, even when breeding. You can dance, snort, whinny, blow, but that slack in that lead better not get taut! And it doesn’t.
We have five senior stallions and five junior stallions. Three of the juniors and one senior have a “date with destiny” down the road once the flies are gone. The four seniors left have “earned” the right to stay entire but will lose that right should they EVER put a mark on any human. The two juniors will earn their right to keep the twins this coming show season. If they’re lucky!
And why do we have so many stallions? We only breed less than five mares a year. (If that- we’ve cut WAY back) But- we like to show stallions! We like the fire and brilliance, they make super driving horses, sensitive and highly tuned. Plus we have the space for them. All our seniors are turned out every two days for 12 hours. They can see other horses both in the barn and outside. All the juniors run together in a big field, with the old gelding in charge.
Last March I took one of the senior stallions to the Horse-O-Rama in Fort Worth. One of the classes was “Pinto/App Colored” so for fun I entered him. It was ALL genders and sizes. There were 26 in the class. We stood in the warm up arena waiting. Lotto NEVER moved or made a noise. One child was holding a Paint mare who kept creeping over to see Lotto. He didn’t even twitch an ear as the mare got closer and closer…. I finally had to tell the kid that he “was a stallion and might strike” although I knew he wouldn’t, just to keep her away. He took 6th in that class!
>>QUESTION for FUGS (or anyone)- what do you consider stallion-safe fencing?< <
Depends on the stallion. Mine goes out on wire mesh with a hot tape across the top. He would never think to challenge that. His two oops foals, from before I owned him, were the result of JUST hot tape that, oops, was not hot. Fortunately he chose well out of his mare options and I like both mistakes
but in general, any kind of non-solid fencing like hot tape alone is a bad idea with a stallion.
Due to the very real possibility that they may strike at a horse in an adjoining pasture, I would not want to see any kind of fence they can stick a leg through and hurt themselves. I.E. New Zealand wire.
There are stallions that require what we think of as stallion fencing – something like 6 foot tall panels or 6 foot rail fencing, but I think they’re in the minority. Mine would no more jump 4 feet for no reason than he’d eat a snake, but yours might. You just have to know your horse and put something around him that will hold him for sure, and something that he is highly unlikely to injure himself on. A friend of mine has a Thoroughbred farm, and she’s had colts effortlessly sail over 5 foot tall board fence that certainly LOOKS like it should hold them…but it doesn’t.
Having had my stallion on stallion row or in the breed pavilion at the Equine Affaire, I can tell you that we are instructed by the staff to have people walk ahead and behind our stallions while in the isle ways moving to and from the barns. It is for the safety of the public, who are often newbies with small children. In fact, we are supposed to have people in front and behind when moving ANY horse in the isles, but esp. for the stallions.
Great post! My trainer’s Arab stud is so well trained that pretty much anyone can handle him. She doesn’t put up with misbehavior from ANY of her horses, regardless of gender.
I don’t think I’ve ever met a mean stud, although perhaps it’s just a limit to my exposure and experience.
When I was in college the farm had 2 studs on site and another out showing. The studs themselves were a bit hard to handle, but none of them ever needed a baseball bat to lead from place to place. Even the “mean” stud could be handled by student workers and was handled during classes.
When I was taking lessons there were 2 studs on site: a purebred Andalusian and his 1/2 TB son. The full Andy had a pen right by the entrance to the barn where he could watch all the activity going on, visit with people and such. His son was ridden in some of the higher level classes by advanced students, to get him used to being around other horses and stuff. Later, after I graduated from college, they brought in a younger Andy Je Fe who had a bit of a ‘tude. Who could handle him was more restricted (I was allowed to handle the other stud, but not Je Fe), although he behaved for the barn owner. I once saw him hit a back hoof 6 foot up the wall in a 12×12 when he was showing off for a mare. He continued the tantrum until the barn owner walked over, opened his stall door and said “stop”. He did. Stood polite as you please.
At the stable I interviewed at for an instructor position after college they had a stud that was being boarded. I felt horrible for him: locked in a dark stall, no way to look out, never let out. It was torture, IMO. I didn’t take the job (that was only one reason, but it didn’t lend me to think that the barn was going to be a good place for horses or employees).
Was trying to e-mail you this one Fugs.
http://greenville.craigslist.org/grd/1429364957.html
Goes with all the breeding of HYPP n/h & h/h horses. They are trying to sell two n/h broodmares that have only ever been used as broodmares.
Why is it that you recognize that bad stallion breeding and management makes for dangerous animals, while the stallions themselves aren’t inherently dangerous or to blame, but you still lump pit bulls into one “big & scary!” grouping that should be exterminated?
Heck, at the county fair, where we were not permitted to have stallions as we were all 4-Hers and underage, we always yelled “Horse coming through!” when we moved horses up and down the barn aisles, simply because a suprising percentage of the general public don’t get ouf the way of 800-1200 lbs animals walking towards them.
>>Why is it that you recognize that bad stallion breeding and management makes for dangerous animals, while the stallions themselves aren’t inherently dangerous or to blame, but you still lump pit bulls into one “big & scary!†grouping that should be exterminated?< <
1. I don’t think they should be exterminated. I think they should not be bred. There is a difference.
2. We can still have dogs if we do not have pit bulls. We cannot have horses if we do not have stallions.
I blame Walter Farley
I visited the Real Escuela Andaluza del Arte Ecuestre in Jerez, Spain last year. ALL their performing horses are stallions, every single one. The mares are kept on another site. The stables you can wander around before the show. There are 30 plus stallions in stables and standing being washed and groomed – standing butt to butt being hosed down. Not a kick, not an eyelashed bashed, nothing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5NHL_V7C18
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVkkAwbILHY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHxWhDfQbY0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHGxJP3HXb0
And to get a foal from any of those stallions costs a pretty penny too!
**Bossmare wrote: To any one who has a stallion: Take a look at your horse and think “Can he do even half of what Rugged lark has done?†If your answer is and certain yes don’t breed him, and I don’t mean his potential to accomplish but has done!!! Its the stallion owners JOB to get his/her stallion fit, trained and shown, and at shows he needs to place consistently in the top three spots. If you do this with your stallion for 2-4 years and he does all this then GREAT, keep him whole. If he isn’t placing high at any shows and you cant be bothered to figure out how or what would fix that, then cut off the set and make him a nice gelding…he will be happier and so will the rest of us. A stallion is a business, if he wasn’t he would be a gelding, and if your consistent and firm he will be a nice pet too.**
what? Rugged Lark has accomplished what he has accomplished because his owners had deep deep pockets, showing at that level takes major bucks to accomplish. so in your opinion unless we have that kind of money then we have no business owning a stallion? There are many locally owned and shown stallions that are very nice and affordable and used by many people to sire nice babies so they can continue their hobby, showing locally and enjoying their horses. I am probably reading your thought wrong but to me it sounds like if your stud can not compete on the same level as rugged lark he should be gelded. thats very unfair and if you thought the horse market was collapsing now, the repercussions of only being allowed the use of high dollar studs would pretty much kill the small horse owner and local shows. Stallions are not a business, they are just like any other horse. they need to be trained and handled with common sense, if they can not, then gelding is best, but there are many of them, as evidenced here, that are very tractable and get along just fine fully intact. There are many that have accomplished things on a local level and may be used on occasion for breeding but still do not pose a problem when not bred. have to look at the big picture and not assume that just because its not a world champion it should be gelded.
I do agree, that rank vicious studs are better off cut, cross breeds, unregistered back yard horses etc. I dont stand mine at stud but I am not going to run out and geld him as he gives me no reason to do so. JMO
This is an actual post to our local horse community from earlier this very week (name changed of course):
“Hi my name is “Dipshit” I am new to the island and I am looking for a place on the island to board a very well mannered stallion. Iam willing to give a free breeding and barn chores in exchange for some money off the board. Iam very experienced with horses and reliable.”
What’s wrong here? Let’s count the fouls. So, You” breed your stallion, that I haven’t bothered to describe, to any mare I care to name in order to knock some cash off the board. Well great. I somehow doubt the stud in question has any sort of performance record, so I’m guessing that if this plan succeeds, there would be yet another fugly foal created as a result of human ignorance and poor planning. An auction bound fugly foal most likely.
Not to mention that you assume I should be so delighted to have your un-gelding on my property that I would be pleased to do it for cheap – instead of charging you a premium!
And speaking of poor planning – who moves to a new locale without any previous idea about suitable boarding arrangements for a stallion in the area? And who’s stupid enough to take on Ms. Dipshit and her “very well mannered” stallion based on this post, despite her assurances of being “very experienced with horses and reliable.”
This is a “real world” example of precisely how stallions get in trouble, get bad reps and make more useless, unwanted stallions. They have “Dipshit” owners.
If you don’t see anything wrong with this picture, I’ve got some waterfront property in Naches that I’d like to sell you . . .
I know you guys all love the fugaloosas, but really it was a Fugaloosa named Marshmallow who cured my fear of stallions at the tender age of 16. I was pretty intimidated as the trainer lunged him over hellacious obstacles, but as the man kept insisting I was a pansy if I didn’t get on him, I did it. He was just coming up on his 3 y/o year, and rode like a freaking Cadillac. Before that, I disliked Appy’s in general, but since then I’ve had opportunity to ride several who were all pretty pleasurable (not your usual mean, stubborn stereotype), and if one ever came my way, I might consider owning one (QH girl that I am). The fuglier the better.
5minpins, no, not everybody is going to make it to the World Show, but IMO a stallion should be able to earn points in breed show competition close to home, or some kind of equivalent level of accomplishment in jumping, dressage, endurance, whatever, before he is used for breeding. I see a lot of people doing it ass-backwards – the horse “will” be shown or is “going” into training but they are currently standing him at stud. I hate that. Just wait. He won’t die, even if he says he will.
I owned two stallions back when my body still allowed me to have horses and be a horseperson in all sense of the word.
One was a QH and the second a Paint (out of the mare in my avitar, by a son of Three Bars, so that tells you how long ago that was!). Both were gentlemen, handled daily, squealing never allowed. I purchased the QH as a yearling, so he was a bit more work, having been turned out since halter-breaking and weaning. The Paint I was utterly responsible for, and he was first handled when still wet. Both trailered with mares, were pastured with mares (after the mares were preg checked), I never had a problem catching either, and when they were used to cover an outside mare, the deed was done in a special corral that each horse knew was his “office.” I’d allow him to tease on the opposite side of the high boarded corral (used for working cattle) and once the mare was set, walked him in, put him on a long lead, and let him go to work.
You simply can never think that anything a stallion does, anything that could be considered disruptive and eventually dangerous, is kyoot or manly. You don’t have to beat them to train them, for me it was short, simple corrections with immediate respect. Never did any baby talking to either horse.
And yes, Walter Farley was very misleading!
I probably would not own a stallion today simply because they are a lot of work—at least if you want a nice one!
What about stallions that are just bred to be good horses, and not to earn ribbons?
Say Red is a nice Quarter Horse stallion, 8 years old or so. Red has no big names in his pedigree or flashy color, and has never won at anything fancier than a schooling show. He does however have correct conformation, a good personality and good training. He goes on trail rides, gives lessons to small kids, and works cows on the ranch. His owner has several of his foals on site, all with similar conformation and personality, all have an appropriate level of training for their age and are not for sale because she bred them to be good all-around at-home horses like Red. His owner asks for a very moderate stud fee ($300?) because she knows he’s not fancy and isn’t trying to make a living by breeding him, just help cover the cost of his feed. She only accepts a limited number of mares that she approves both in temperament and breeding – some appropriate outcrossing allowed, such as a TB mare for an Appendix foal.
So, does Red not deserve to be bred just because his owner is not interested in showing? Yes, there are a lot of good all-around horses for sale, but some people would rather raise their own horse from birth, do all it’s training themselves, and not worry about what may have happened to the horse before they bought it or what problems may pop up 6 months later.
Red’s foals will not have a high enough value to keep them safe in this economy. Therefore, Red should not be bred. If Red’s owners cannot afford to put a competition record on him, they should geld him and enjoy riding him.
The problem is that I can name 50 stallions who have everything Red has going for him plus an AQHA ROM in pleasure or they’re NCHA money earners or they’ve already sired horses who’ve won at the national level. And they’re ALSO standing for $300-$500 in this economy. Their foals are more marketable and have a higher value than the foals of a stallion who has not proven himself in some sort of significant competition – it’s just a fact of life. Higher value = increased safety.
The shortest job I’ve ever held was working for an Arabian breeding farm. It had 6 stallions, 30 some mares, and 2 geldings. One of the stallions was a national champion – a total gentlemen in his twenties. The other 5… well… they were his offpsring, and the most impressive thing they seemed able to do was eat lots of grain. *eyeroll*
Each and every one of them was kept in a box stall. The real shit head of the bunch went out for a few hours in the daytime, and the real sweet 3 year old got let in the indoor arena sporadically, but the rest? All stuck in their tiny little stalls all day long – all housed within 20 feet of mares. It was downright abusive.
The only ones that were so much as halter trained were the ones she had bought from someone else, and they were so rusty it was a nightmare just moving them around. I think the owner was afraid of them, and I know I sure as heck was. I shrugged it off at first because they were “hot blooded Arabs” so different from the stock horses I was used to, but it still felt off.
I quit three weeks in. It wasn’t worth the small sum a hand makes to have to go into a box stall to feed, water, and clean out the shit head’s stall because the owner sure as heck wasn’t going to pay for my hospital bills, and it was only a matter of time before I got hurt.
Ah, I get to the barn today and find the old Standardbred stallion gone… He was taken to a big vet hospital yesterday — I not sure why — and was put down. He did have a nice life and was well-loved at the barn. Got half-day turn out in a roundpen where he could see all the other horses but not touch them, and was very happy with that arrangement. Very much a flirt whenever a mare was led by, but not insane, just a bit talkative in the “hey baby!” sense.
mine has a show record, money earner. on a local level. as much as I wanted to send him to the big time I could never afford it. I am happy with him and his accomplishments. he is currently teaching me the sport I have waited a lifetime to compete in and he does it with the utmost patience. my point in my previous post was that because a stud horse has not competed on the same level as a horse like rugged lark, is not reason to run out and castrate him. he does not stand at public stud currently because I do not have the facility to stand him and have outside mares.
as for fencing, I do have mine in hot tape and hot wire, 3 strands tape and 2 strands wire, all 5 are hot. would love to have wooden plank fencing, with a hot wire on the top plank…but yeah…very spendy
I was emailed this. How can this be a quality breeding prospect when he is sickle hocked and club foot on front? He is even OUT OF another stallion : ) Black is NOT rare in Andalusian although, like the Arabian, people think it is. $20 000? You CAN buy a trained, not to bad quality shown and well trained Purebred Andalusian for less. Seriously you can just look! I hope the photo shows!
— On Tue, 10/20/09, DRYSTALL@aol.com wrote:
Received: Tuesday, October 20, 2009, 2:31 PM
——————————————————————————–
Mosquetero Del Dejado
Mosquetero Del Dejado has it all, gorgeous looks, fabulous movement and a temperament that is unmatchable.
He was born in May of 2008. He is out of Dejado II. His grandparents include Ganador vlll and Mosquetero Del Viento. His mother is 1/2 Andalusian. He is pure black and will stay that way! He keeps amazing us with his ability. We put a saddle on him yesterday and he bucked once and than acted like he wore one his whole life.
This is a spectacular horse and a once in a lifetime find that will strengthen any breeding program.
He will be missed by us, however, he is just to smart as well as gorgeous to cut and we are not in the breeding business.
$20,000.00 and to a “perfect home” only!
Please contact: Kimberlie Teel
Cell: 949-636-8102
After my horse passed away at the ripe age of 45 (yes…..45), I wanted to get back around horses.
I [mistakenly] answered a [Craigslist] ad in which a woman was looking for some help around her farm. We chatted briefly, she sent photos of their farm (that she initially said they just bought….but come to find out they were renting).
They had a handful of stallions:
Two REALLY nice looking Quarter Horse stallions (built just right), and both of them were not registered, but they were breeding them to produce “nice looking sport horses.” *insert eye roll #1*
They had a Thoroughbred stallion that looked like it had chosen a piece from every fugly on this site to make the “complete” horse. He was being bred to produce…………………”nice looking sport horses.” *inser eye roll #2*
As we go around her farm (which, by the way had been run down to nubs of grass on the pastures – as that’s what happens when you have 10-15 horses per 3 acre pasture), I start counting….71….72…..86…87…..88. 88 horses…..20 acre farm. No WONDER she needs help!
Then comes the piece de resistance of her “stallions.” We shall call him, “Fool.” He was a large sorrel stud standing with his rear end facing the front of his stall, his personal fan (sitting out in the aisle facing into his stall) blowing on him, and his other fan above IN his stall on him as well. Clearly, this must be their show stallion? So pampered?
I call to him. He ignores me. I call again. His ears go back. I call the third time, and he double barrels his stall door. Nice. His owner opens the feeding door and calls to him, his ears stay pinned back, he turns and lunges towards his bucket slamming into it, throwing it around and kicking his stall. Nice again.
Owner decides she needs to have her stall-peons clean his stall. Stall-peons will NOT enter into his stall. Instead, owner goes in, scared to death, and she nervously calls to him. He stands there, ears pinned. She clips his lead rope, turns, and he runs over top of her out of the stall and starts frantically looking around (did I mention his window was permanently closed until they could install bars in them?). She tries to calm him down, but he is a fire-breathing snort monster. She corrals him to the stall across from him, and he has a hissy fit – kicking, calling….just a beast.
I ask about him.
“Has he ever been bred?”
“We bred him once. He couldn’t figure out what to do and tried to breed the mare’s head.”
“Do you ride him?”
“Oh H*** NO!”
“Uh – what do you DO with him?”
“Nothing really. He’s my pretty baby.”
Pretty baby, my arse. Someone get me a knife to geld the sucker!
I think ths goes for mares as well. I adopted a 18 month old mare whose biggest accomplishment was being haltered fairly easily. She was so bad with her feet that I had to wear a helmet to pick them up b/c she kicked. She was also pushy, bossy and would charge people in the field. After a few month she’s improved 200%. I can have someone hold her head w/o a halter and pick out her feet with no problems. She is much more respectful of humans in general.
Stereotypes suck. The problem with them is that you get what you expect. (I’m not saying that there are no temperament differences among breeds.)
If you EXPECT hot behavior from a stallion, you will not discourage it, because they’re “just that way.” Additionally, you will forget to reinforce good behavior, because it doesn’t fit the stereotype.
My boss back when I was a Saddlebred groom, was off at a show when someone who wanted to breed called to look at one of the studs. He was a mess, so I groomed him and trimmed him up. My boss was amazed when he came back and found that I did it by myself, without a twitch! (Except his ears. A barn-friend “eared him down” for me.) Yeah, the horse was pretty hot, but the poor guy was stalled 24-7 except for a brief turnout in the arena, and breeding. (Note: this is _not_ the stallion I loved so much.)
Ruthie
Just wanted to out this one. Don’t know them, don’t have a grudge – Just plain disgusted!!
Here’s another moronic stallion owner a Buckskin Paint (of course)
Stallion goes lame with mystery hock problem, eventually diagnosed as unsound, but hey lets breed with him! *headdesk*
Get this!! they are coming up with ways to “help” him serve but don’t have the cranial mass to think “oh hell he’s not breeding material”
linky if it lasts and any of you are interested
http://www.outbacknoticeboard.net/OAO/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=15217
you’ll probably have to join to see
(they usually delete and disbar anyone that isn’t all (((hugs))) and clueless)
Were you at our last show? We wwere standing in the entry arena, with our 4 year old Arab stallion, who was dozing, foot coked, as our class started, and the “other” stallions started to roar through the gate. “STallion coming through!”, shouts galore, and we woke our guy up, and trotted into the ring. Yes, we placed. Yes, one of the other stallion handlers got kicked by his own horse. Yes, sad. And yes, when we tour clients through the barn, and go through our stallions paddock, he will comie up, looking for treats or a rub, with his buddies, two geldings, and when I tell the clients, this is our stallion…They dont believe it! My opinion, if they dont act like that, why do you allow them to keep their testicles?
*late to the party*
LOVE your letter!! There are SO many dumbasses with stallions…. *sigh*
2 points I will disagree with you on:
1) Though he was well-loved, won a lot, and was a real gentleman, I will be a naysayer and state that Rugged Lark wasn’t All That. I remember seeing him perform his “Spanish Walk” and other pretend dressage moves, and he never ever EVER engaged his hind end. Going over those LOW jumps, he’s just sort of lazing over them like a bored lesson horse, and by the way, he’s hanging his knees something AWFUL. He was really, REALLY well-marketed, and there was a lot of “buzz” around him because he was “versatile,” and he was good at learning tricks – but he did “dressage” about as well as Adam Sandler’s Opera Man sang opera.
2) I think that in certain areas – hardcore ranch or trail country, for example – an unshown, possibly unregistered (ugh) stallion CAN be a good match for local mares, if he’s proven himself in his job and throws babies that are in high demand in that area. The owners have to be smart about it, though, and it’s not gonna work everywhere.
I’ve seen this work successfully in my area with a few stallions, and again, I think this isn’t the Best Practice in a lot of markets. But again, Know Thy Market.
I *just* adopted an Arabian stallion in his upper 20s — he was a show horse in his day, original owner only bred him a few times (a gazillion years ago), but as far as I can tell, he’d done next to nothing for the last 15 years. And he’s spent a good portion of that time in a stall w/a tiny paddock, unable to see any other horses. Poor guy. He’s basically a sweet horse, but not well socialized (probably was better when he was younger and exposed to more horses). It just makes me so angry — solitary confinement for years, completely unnecessary. And it made rehoming him difficult after his owner died — no one wanted an elderly stallion.
Once I acquired him, I moved him to a boarding barn — he’s been way overstimulated by the sight of other horses, and when the few mares that are on the property came into season a week after his arrival, he went bonkers. Castrated him 10 days after his arrival — hopefully he will now have a happier, healthier rest of his life. (Yes, as Fugly has said, you CAN castrate an elderly stallion — we ran bloodwork & made sure everything was in good order prior to surgery, took him to a clinic, he stayed overnight, came home the next day…all is well).