It won’t take no ridin’ to get that hair off of him!
Nov 29 2007
My comments are in blue…and properly capitalized.
“LAST PRICE REDUCTON (or what? You give up and geld him? One can only hope.) EXCEPTIONALHORSE $2,000
HE HAS BEEN RIDDEN SEVERAL TIMES HE JUST NEEDS THE HAIR RODE OFF HIM” (Eh, if you want the hair off him, that shitty fence ought to do the job just fine. I can see a bunch of it hanging on there already!)
“HE IS VERY GOOD NATURED. FERIER HAS NO TROUBLE WITH HIM, (farrier farrier FARRIER, it’s not that fucking complicated, use a dictionary if you’re that confused!) TAKES BRIDLE, AND SADDLE VERY WELL WE HATE TO LET HIM GO BUT HE NEEDS SOMEONE TO TAKE HIM AND GIVE HIM A JOB HE WOULD BE HAPPIER BEING RIDDEN EVERY DAY (and living with someone who doesn’t have such shitty, dangerous fence. He’d really think that was awesome!) ANY QUESTIONS CALL anytime OR EMAIL US”
FHOTD in: This horse is a good example of the fact that you gotta have eyes, too, and not just look at a pedigree like you would a car. I mean, bloodlines-wise, this is a well bred horse. If all I saw was his pedigree, I might think “sure, that could be a breeding quality stallion.”
However, we have other information here – like the pics, which show that he’s back at the knee and has a fuuuugly neck. There are some very nice things about his conformation otherwise – he’s got a nice hip, a good shoulder, he’s deep through the heart, not downhill and well balanced. Despite being of halter horse breeding, he has good pasterns. He’ll make a very cute gelding and for the price ($2000), somebody ought to have had the brains to have gelded him already. Folks, there should never be a $2000 stallion. If it’s worth $2000, it’s not a stallion. Stallion quality weanlings are $5000+ in any breed. I’ve never seen a good adult stallion selling for less than $7500 minimum and usually more. If you can’t get that kind of money for them, that right there is pretty much a foolproof sign that what you have isn’t breeding quality and you ought to lop its balls off. 
But before you spend money on that…for the love of all that is holy, replace the goddamn fence. When I see babies behind barbed wire, and I think of all the godawful, disgusting, bloody, pussy, proud-flesh, permanent injuries I have seen on babies turned out on barbed wire, I want to fly to Missouri and chase you into the fence a few times so you can see how it feels.
Hot tape – $30 a roll. If you are too damn lazy/cheap to replace that fence, sell your horses and get cows which is what that fence was designed for. Then at least you can barbecue them when you can’t sell them despite your “last price reducton!”
336 comments to “It won’t take no ridin’ to get that hair off of him!”
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mattsontraining.net said…
Kay-
Yes, this summer he is actually a blue black (well until he bleached out as all the horses live outside) The few things I would fault him on are pretty much what make him an Akhal Teke
Lower set neck and longer back.
He has been a pleasure to work with, though he is the first Teke we have bought as a re sale horse (he came not even halter broke to us this last April). He is a complete pussycat when it comes to handling now
Where are you located, is it BC it didn’t actually say on your website.
I admit they aren’t everyones choice for body style etc but they were developed to excel at a certain type of terrain. No they aren’t stock horses but that simply makes them different. Frankly I also love the showy high headed Saddlebreds also.
forthefutureofthebreed said…
“Dontyouridenofuglyhorse – LOL on “coming out of the closet”. Hey, I know first hand how that goes here! LOL.
Cool on beating Jack B. with your horse. Very cool.
Oh, and stereotypes? Look what I have to deal with owning a black and white stallion! With a Tobiano gene! EEEEEK. He MUST be a piece of shit, don’t you know. LOL. And I’m sure you know about that with a cremello. They just don’t cut you any slack, which is actually a GOOD thing for us breeders. Keeps the bar high.
”
Shhhhh! My cremello stallion is a secret….. Don’t tell anyone I have one I do not want people poking fun at me! Wait until I get him out there as a rope horse.
mattsontraining.net said…
“dontyouridenofuglyhorses-
you wouldn’t happen to be interested in a very well bred and built Indian Artifacts daughter that due to a trailer accident is only broodmare sound? (she now wings due to the way her old owner left the leg to heal, sad as she is a stunning hunt mare)”
Actually I might be interested in a nice HUS broodie. Please email me off my website.
Dear Dontyouridenofuglyhorse, thanks for sharing about showing your (ahem) “older” stallion at 12. Sounds as if he’s a nice boy and done good.
You know me, can’t resist an opportunity to plug my favorite breed, so must get on my soap box and mention that commonly our WC halter horses are “aged) (ie over 9) and some in their teens. Oh, sometimes a little hottie of a yearling or two-year-old wears the roses, but not often. Plus, our Morgans that win as youngsters in one division such as halter or driving most commonly go on to other divisions over their show lifetimes through pleasure and saddle and equitation and carriage and lifers in their 20s still compete and look good doin’ it.
Okay, back to your regularly scheduled stock breed discussion.
Mattsontraining….
Is the Akhal Teke hard to collect with that long back and low neck? Although as far as AT’s go he is a bit shorter backed…
Dontyouridenofuglyhorse – LOL. Ok, I won’t tell, even though he’s the best one I’ve ever seen.
sara marie, I think your horses will be fine. I have never given warm water in winter and knock on wood I have not lost a horse to colic in 22 years. As long as the water does not freeze over they will be fine.
forthefutureofthebreed said…
”
“Dontyouridenofuglyhorse – LOL. Ok, I won’t tell, even though he’s the best one I’ve ever seen.
Now Susan, people will think I paid you to say that. He is a beauutiful horse. I want to get him broke out and roping cattle to prove he is good for something other than throwing 100% color.
Dontyouridenofuglyhorse said, “Now Susan, people will think I paid you to say that. He is a beauutiful horse. I want to get him broke out and roping cattle to prove he is good for something other than throwing 100% color.”
That’s great you’re going to do that with him. It will put him one step up from the rest, for sure. I need to do the same with mine, if I can ever get it done.
Dontyouridenofuglyhorse,
I LOVE LOVE LOVE your stallion. I do love a nice looking halter horse. He looks surprisingly USEABLE. I just wish they would place more horses like him all over.
Here, a nice horse never makes it out in the top. They place the ugliest bull-necked things!
I, too, own a palomino – not as dark as yours. If you want a picture, I can show you. She is like a light sorrel in the summer – with a white tail and mane. LOL.
luvmyfuglyhorse,
I just walked out to the barn to hug my guys and tell them they are loved. We are all so sad and sorry your daughter’s horse is so ill. Peace be with her tomorrow.
colorisnteverything said…
“Dontyouridenofuglyhorse,
I LOVE LOVE LOVE your stallion. I do love a nice looking halter horse. He looks surprisingly USEABLE. I just wish they would place more horses like him all over.
Here, a nice horse never makes it out in the top. They place the ugliest bull-necked things!
I, too, own a palomino – not as dark as yours. If you want a picture, I can show you. She is like a light sorrel in the summer – with a white tail and mane. LOL.”
Thank you so much for the compliments on Floyd. I would love to see a photo of your mare. Just email me from my website. You should take her to the PHBA shows and show her in the color class. With a dark gold color you will do very well.
the-farmer’s-wife said…
Dear NYXIN, what state do you live in? Once I put the word out I’ve got several replies about palomino Morgans. JstPam, get in line….
Hey,
I am in Colorado.
Before you open the flood gates…
Over 10, or acts old.
Slow, smooth, docile.
GELDING
GOLDEN
15HHish
For pleasure, parades, arena, local shows, trail.
Thanks everyone!
*sigh* The place I’m getting my boy from is fenced in rusty barbwire too.. No foals around, but they do have a couple yearlings. And no matter the age, I do worry about it. I get my boy tomorrow so he’ll never see barbwire again, but I still cringe thinking about it. And this is supposed to be a boarding facility =/
I think he’d be a very cute gelding. Heck, I’d take him home and chop his balls off if he was near by
“TWHs aren’t my favorites, but most of them that I’ve known have been good-natured, easy going horses. I guess it’s their easy going, good nature that causes them to allow people to torture them with the methods used to create that “big lick” style. Honestly, it is totally disgusting to me.”
HA!
One of my all-time favorite fantasies is to have a magic wand whereby I can go POOF and change (Mid-ride, of course)those poor, sored and tortured TWHs instantly into Arabs or TBS.
I’d love to clap and cheer as the uber-creeps who do these things were tossed three counties away into barbed wire fencing and concrete blocks.
There is a sad saying: “Bad horses do not go to hell. They come back as Tennessee Walkers.”
Luvmyfuglyhorse, I will remember to light the white candle for your beloved mare. Peace to her and healing energy to you and your daughter.
Thank you Soli!!! I was gettin kind of aggitated at all the doggin of TWH’s but Soli said it just right. I have shown TWH’s for many years. started in the youth classes at age 6. There are FLAT shod classes as well. Which is what i have always shown. Regular horse shoes like any other breed. The natural gait is awesome. I will have to post videos of my mare. If you go to a show put on by TWH association they have people there that check the pads for foreign objects and they poke the foot to check for soring. They at least make an attempt i suppose but im not naive enough to think that this checking actually works. We had a TWH big lick that was taken off his pads at the retirement age of 6. By 10 years old he developed calcium deposits and could not be rode. By age 11 we had to have him put down because he could take two steps without falling. He was such an awesome horse without the pads. oh and another thing that peeves me about the TWH show world while im ranting. Last show i did was an association show. I entered the spotted saddle horse plantation pleasure class. Which is a flat shod only class. I watched people unload their horses on pads. Take the pads off and show flat shod and win!!!! Then worse put the pads back on and showed the big lick classes and won those too!!! how fair is that??? oh and here is a pic of what a flat shod twh should look like at a show walk for anyone interested. Im blacked out cause it was a cute day lol
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i261/kyotee02/l_53aa7569faa186f09c8c898cbef2ee26.jpg
oh and cnsdubie:
my horse that i just posted the link to her pic… is pusher bred. she has the same lineage. Thankfully never seen a pad in her life. And most TWH’s have the ugly head. Its just part of the breed. Yes there are exceptions but typically they hae ugly heads.
Congratulations, you are now getting more replies to your blog then Scott Adams (Dibert cartoonist)
You have hit a nerve with a lot of people.
…and that would be Dilbert.
Darn notebook computers.
Long and OT -
Thanks to all on this board for your kind words, thoughts, prayers and encouragement. I have been reading and posting on this blog for a few months now, and feel like I know so many of you -though we’ve never met.
Yesterday afternoon I got one of those silly forwarded e-mails that I usually delete: “if you say this prayer and send this e-mail to 8 people in 8 seconds you will receive a miracle tomorrow.” In my desperation, I actually did it. Guess what? It didn’t work.
Or maybe it did.
I gave Winter one last dose of the Rheaform last night. (this is the fourth medication we’ve tried). I then asked God to please give me a sure sign this morning that I have made the right decision.
This morning, her nice second-crop hay remained untouched, and she had plenty of grain left in her bucket. And the one bowel movement she had was a puddle on the floor.
Perhaps the miracle was not the one I wanted: which was to see normal poop on the floor this morning, and a funny-looking bald-headed horse munching happily on her hay.
Perhaps the miracle was the sure sign I had prayed for – there is no doubt in my mind that I am doing the right thing now.
– but, Jesus, this is so painful. My poor kid already has two buried out in the back pasture. Her beloved elderly pony, and a saintly elderly arab mare…when we got Winter, who was given to her after the arab died, we thought, “great, a nice young horse” she was early teens. That was just 2.5 years ago. My kid is only 13 years old.
Sorry for the long OT ramble.
I know I have to do this for Winter’s sake. I can’t keep struggling for my own happiness – The vet will be here at 1 or 2, as well as the backhoe.
Then this will be behind us and we can keep and cherish the good memories. She is one AWESOME horse who came into my daughter’s life at the time she needed her most. She got her through her fears and gave me daughter the confidence to ride again.
Thanks again to all. I know most of you have been here at one time or another. Death is part of life.
luvmyfuglyhorse: you and your daughter are in my thoughts this morning.
luvmyfuglyhorse-You and your daughter are in my thoughts this am as well.We have a “Winter” too and your sentiments hit very close to home.I pray that you and your daughter’s hearts will recover soon.
Cyber hugs to you both.
Dontyouridenofuglyhorse: You have an entire barn of nice horses. Pat on the back!
Did anybody see this that I posted earlier? Completely OT, but this has got to be the best (worst?) sale picture EVER:
http://www.dreamhorse.com/show_horse.php?form_horse_id=1123385
I am still chuckling about it.
Hey…I take offense to the dun comments…LOL…I have a dun mare that I don’t think is too fugly. I don’t show her cause I flat out don’t have the time, money or skills. You can see her at
http://community.webshots.com/user/anthrobia
Her album is Sheza Dee Bar Dun
One day I’ll actually find a stallion I feel is worthy to breed her to, so far I haven’t seen one to meet my criteria (I’ve only been looking 5 years now). He will have to have points in something that actually shows athletic ability. I would eventually like to breed a replacement for Dee.
whisper_the_wind said…
Hey…I take offense to the dun comments…LOL…I have a dun mare that I don’t think is too fugly.
You’re right – she’s definitely a cutie.
Don’tridenofuglyhorse,
You and your daughter are in my thoughts and prayes today. It is never easy to loose one particularly one that is so young but try and remember the joy she brought into your life and know you are doing what is best for her. Take care and give your daughter a big hug from me.
To luvmyfuglyhorse: My condolances to you and your daughter. My daughter has her beloved horse’s ashes in a wooden urn in her bedroom, and we still mourn his loss after 3 years. And you are right about how answered prayers are not what we envision as the answer. At least you are horsewise enough to have prepared for end of life issues, like backhoes.
Re:fences, Barb wire can really hurt, but so can running through board fences. We were trying to decide on fencing when my daughters horse (20 year old Arab) ran thru a board fence behind a 27 year old TB. ((Vet said the TB was probably looking behind him at the younger horse, saying “NYAHHH I beat you!” and then hit the fence.) So we put up polypropylene wire with a hot wire at the top. Not perfect, our mini can push thru if motivated. But 4 board plank is a frigging maintenance nightmare. I have seen concrete post fence in Europe, and wonder if electric wire/poly and concrete post would work???
Sorry that should have been posted to luvmyfuglyhorse. I’m not in too good a shape this morning.
Lauren_MI_Eventer said…
Did anybody see this that I posted earlier? Completely OT, but this has got to be the best (worst?) sale picture EVER:
http://www.dreamhorse.com/show_horse.php?form_horse_id=1123385
I am still chuckling about it.
That is a funny picture although it doesn’t seem that out of the way to me since I see a lot of this type of thing up at the arena. The horse looks like a real doll though.
luvmyfulgly…
I am so sorry for this news. I wish I knew more, I always feel like I can somehow figure a horse’s weird illness out. I know I can’t, but maybe I was a medicine (wo)man in a past life.
I lost the most precious horse EvAr to me after 2 years of yearning over him and only 15 months of ownership once my dream was finally realized. It was an awful demise, the vets totally sucked.
I know that you must feel completely out of control and have that knot in your stomach, the wondering, the what if’s, the why ,me’s.
I hope you take solace in knowing that your horse has probably had the best life it ever thought possible. So many horses will never have it so lucky. And having a friend to take them to the Rainbow Bridge is a wonderful gift.
You are doing a brave and admiral thing and your daughter will remember your compassion and strength.
My warmest thoughts,
N
Here are the two stallions from my site http://mattsontraining.net/Index_files/Page507.htm
Both are registered. (really should put that up there!)
Luvmyfuglyhorse, my prayers are with you, there is nothing as painful as owning a beloved animal with a baffling serious illness.
Totally off topic, but my first thought when I looked at that horrid TWH video was, “EWWW SPIDER!! GET IT OFF ME, get it offf meeeee !!” It seriously crawled my blood.
Dontyouridenofuglyhorse said…
OFCOL said: ”
He’s exactly the type I’m talking about when I say that there ARE some decent halter horses, and people doing right by them, out there.
It’s because of the popularity of the bizarre unwieldy unsound-looking-and-moving type of stock horse halter animal that we have this terrible sterotype and people continueing to breed into it.”
Yes I agree. It is SO difficult to buck the trend though. I am not a fan of the hippo type of halter horse, or the little zippo breds that have that funny little choppy up and down and not forward movement. It makes it difficult to LOVE AQHA horses and compete at any level with them. Just like my buckskin colt, he is not REALLY my type, he is much more “riderish” than I care for. But is a phenomenal mover. Mabe he will do well at the performance halter? Time will tell.
November 30, 2007 7:24 PM
The only people that ARE fans of the Hippo types are the ones that DON’T RIDE THEIR HORSES – EVER. They LEAD THEM… they CONDITION THEM… they FEED THEM… they GROOM THEM… but ride them? Not on your life.
Good Job beating Jack B… People seem to forget that he is breeding his HYPP H/H BR Maximus and that ALL the get he’s got are N/H. Bummer, because that’s just silly IMHO. Not to mention the abhorrent useless toplines he throws on his horses, with the jacked up legs.
It’s horses like what he’s showing that give halter horses a bad name.
luvmyfugly, my sincerest condolences on your loss.
“…replace the goddamn fence. When I see babies behind barbed wire, and I think of all the godawful, disgusting, bloody, pussy…”
I too would keep my scabby,disgusting bloody pussy/ies behind barbed wire! I believe the term you wanted was purulent. Before casting stones at the misused caps and poor spelling, proof read.
Sundog said…
“…replace the goddamn fence. When I see babies behind barbed wire, and I think of all the godawful, disgusting, bloody, pussy…”
I too would keep my scabby,disgusting bloody pussy/ies behind barbed wire! I believe the term you wanted was purulent. Before casting stones at the misused caps and poor spelling, proof read.
December 1, 2007 8:34 AM
As a student in a Biology course at the University level (I know it’s not much, but heck, it’s something!), I can say that pussy is correct, as well as purulent.
http://medical.merriam-webster.com/medical/pussy
http://medical.merriam-webster.com/medical/purulent
Though, I do believe that purulent, in this circumstance, would have been the most tactful.
Luvmyfuglyhorse:
Give your kid a special hug, there are many sending their vibes to you both, to let your hearts heal.
Even so you only had 2.5 years with Winter, the horse was lucky to have found such a wonderful family.
>>Neiq said…
PATHETIC!!!!
You lot should go back and look at the shit you post.
I have a gorgeous pony from this lovely person.< <
This is proof to where the blame lies.
I still think, in the end it’s the consumer who is truly responsible. They are the ones putting money in the breeders pocket, letting them continue producing crapshit.
They are the ones holding the purse strings.
They support the shows with their money, the breeders with their money, the vets and trainers with their money.
I don’t think it’s much different in dogs than it is in horses. People are more informed buying a washing machine, than a dog/horse/other animal.
They don’t check out info on confirmation, breeding, raising, they just “fall in love” with the fugly.
That’s why the puppy mills are still in business, the folks that continue to buy dogs will keep it that way.
Lauren_MI_Eventer said…
“Dontyouridenofuglyhorse: You have an entire barn of nice horses. Pat on the back!”
Oh gosh, Thanks! *blushing*
Luvmyfuglyhorse, I am sorry you have lost a family member. I had the same thing happen last fall to a filly. Nothing apparently wrong, but her appetite was not good. The vet came out and drew blood and could not find anything definitive. He thought she probably had a massive internal abscess or a perforated ulcer. Either way she did not make it. I know that helpless feeling you have.
Winter was lucky to have found a caring and compassionate home. I am sorry for your loss and there is nothing I can say that will ease the pain. Only time can do that. You and your daughter are definitely in my thoughts.
luvmyfugly–I am SO SORRY. I think most of us have been there, unfortunately, and it’s terribly painful. I felt a certain amount of peace being there when I lost my beautiful horse when he was only 7, and when my friend recently lost her beloved horse when he was 15… because I knew both times it was the right decision and the suffering stopped. My prayers are with you and your daughter.
I don’t think it’s much different in dogs than it is in horses. People are more informed buying a washing machine, than a dog/horse/other animal.
Absolutely! And in my experience, presenting “what makes a good breeder/shelter/rescue” as a *CONSUMER* issue makes it all more palatable to the average person. It’s way too easy to dismiss the well-meaning rant of a horse- or dog person as coming from the “horsenut” or “crazy dog lady” because “We don’t want a show dog, just a ‘pet’.” or “We just want a pony for the grandkids, nothing ‘fancy’.”
But make it a consumer issue, and folks listen.
luvmyfugly–
I’m so sorry to hear of your situation. My thoughts are with you, your daughter, and Winter.
starrynightxxi,
http://www.nezpercehorse.com/a.html
The stallion that was shot is down at the bottom right side of this page. Real sad that it happen. It has happen several times in the Pocatello and Firth area of Idaho too.
Heads up folks, the goverment HAS a effective equine fertility vaccine, PZP used on assateauge and BLM horses. Only works on mare thus far but stilll… WHY THE HECK ISN”T THIS AVAILABLE THROUGH OUR VETS?!
Link to article from a reputable breeder on this very point.
http://tiny.cc/RvWYc
True open-minded breeders who breed for GREATNESS and not just what they will be able to sell for $800 to some schmuck who will pay that… yeah, they seem to be few and far between. Sadly.
Oh, but they want to breed FAMILY horses.
That pisses me off so much. THe justifications for breeding mediocre-to-crap horses and marketing SPECIFICALLY to people who don’t know better.
They convince these un-horsey families that what they need is a cheap, low quality animal…when really, what family doesn’t want a nice, well-bred animal? When you look at the cash output for a well-bred gelding (a cull from a good program) vs. the cost for the shit-breeder’s “stallion prospect”…
I get so mad about this I can’t even rant. As a first time horse-buyer I cam SO CLOSE to falling for the garbage. In the end, I picked up my little grade pinto out of a responsible breeding program…but he IS a grade…they just happened to be breeding for some specific traits from the rest of his family line. He inherited them all.
I just shudder at the thought that I could have ended up with some of the absolute GARBAGE stock horses for sale all over the internet by people who are scamming nice, well-meaning people.
You don’t need a show horse…WHY THE HELL NOT? What’s wrong with a good pedigree, a history of soundess, beautiful gaits and a pleasing conformation?
Oh, and here’s a message for all you self-appointed “grammar mavens”…
You look like fools.
No one likes a grammar maven on an internet chat board. While everyone here appreciates a conversationally-correct post with minimal spelling and usage errors…there’s none of us perfect in that respect.
If you only poke your noses out to critique GRAMMAR, you are demonstrating to the world that you have nothing relevant to say…that instead of reading for ideas and then contributing intelligently, all you read for were superficial mistakes.
Bravo.
http://www.picturesquefarm.com/picturesque_goody_gumdrops1.htm
i had no idea that people were breeding for heads that small on horses that large. o.O;
As for the big lick gait… it’s ugly, and I have yet to find a happy looking TWH performing it. (I’ve been looking for one, BTW). IMO, gaited horses are at their best performing the natural gait.
sarcastabitch said, “Oh, but they want to breed FAMILY horses.
That pisses me off so much. THe justifications for breeding mediocre-to-crap horses and marketing SPECIFICALLY to people who don’t know better.
They convince these un-horsey families that what they need is a cheap, low quality animal…when really, what family doesn’t want a nice, well-bred animal? When you look at the cash output for a well-bred gelding (a cull from a good program) vs. the cost for the shit-breeder’s “stallion prospect”…
I get so mad about this I can’t even rant. As a first time horse-buyer I cam SO CLOSE to falling for the garbage. In the end, I picked up my little grade pinto out of a responsible breeding program…but he IS a grade…they just happened to be breeding for some specific traits from the rest of his family line. He inherited them all.
I just shudder at the thought that I could have ended up with some of the absolute GARBAGE stock horses for sale all over the internet by people who are scamming nice, well-meaning people.
You don’t need a show horse…WHY THE HELL NOT? What’s wrong with a good pedigree, a history of soundess, beautiful gaits and a pleasing conformation?”
Oh, you are right on. I just got my Quarter Horse Journal stallion issue yesterday. Inside is an article on “Improving Your Breeding Program”.
Quote from the article – “There’s more interest in horses from newcomers and those just wanting to compete in weekend-type shows. I think some of these all-around horses are going to make a bit of a comeback. And a lot of it is market-driven pressure. There’s a lot of influence on breeding decisions because of the economics that produce these high-dollar horses in these individual event-specific areas. But I think there is a market out there of people just wanting to have a horse they can rope on or enter a ranch versatility class and not go out and win a big cutting show. I think that’s kind of where our foundation-bred horses may be able to stage a bit of a comeback.“
Puke. This is nothing but pure justification for breeding mediocre foundation crap. Like you said, what is wrong with breeding, buying, or owning an exceptional horse? No one is saying you have to do ANYTHING with it. But if you wanted to, it’s there.
Dear Luvmyfuglyhorse:
I am keeping you and your daughter in my heart and prayers today.
We have “been there” with more than one of our beloved dogs, over the years, although not yet with a horse… They are all family members, and each time one passes, it is a genuine loss.
Currently I am going through something, with one of my daughters, that I don’t know how to fix, so I do understand lifting that overwhelming burden every morning when you get up… As mothers, we fix things. We make it alright, or at least BETTER; and when we can’t, it’s just unfathomably painful.
Please know that you and your daughter are being sent love and best wishes from many of us at this difficult time. Please take comfort in the fact that you tried everything you could think of, and then, in the end, chose a peaceful solution to Winter’s suffering. Your love for her is what she will carry forward on her journey.
Peace ~
Sally
To Luvmyfuglyhorse my condolences on what you and your daughter are going through. Myself, I have spent more money and effort trying to deal with a pet’s illness because of the heartbreak it would cost my daughter to lose that friend. You mentioned some of the things that your daughter has been lucky enough to have, including that AWESOME horse, but the most important thing that she has is an AWESOME mother, there for her when needed, teaching her how to live her life and care for those around her. Think of the problems we could solve if every kid had a mother like you. Best to all of you.
Grotesque said…
http://www.picturesquefarm.com/picturesque_goody_gumdrops1.htm
i had no idea that people were breeding for heads that small on horses that large. o.O;
The head is oddly small on that pony, although I don’t think 13 hands is particularly large. On the other hand, they do know how to put up some good sale pictures. Nice side views from a good angle, both with and without tack, and the photos of the child on the animal are appropriate, as the pony is apparently ridden by children all the time, the little girl is using all the correct equipment and seems to be able to ride as well. No Darwin Parent of the Year here!
Bethy wrote: Heads up folks, the goverment HAS a effective equine fertility vaccine, PZP used on assateauge and BLM horses. Only works on mare thus far but stilll… WHY THE HECK ISN”T THIS AVAILABLE THROUGH OUR VETS?!
Because it is still considered experimental. The one lab in the country that produces it is only allowed to sell it to programs that are licensed to use it in experimental trials.
It will never work on stallions (or any other male animal) because it sensitizes the body to the proteins in the zona pellucida, the membrane that encases an ovum. When the body detects a zona pellucida it sends antibodies which bind to the potential receptor sites for sperm. When the sperm arrive, there’s no room for them.
No male animal produces a zona pellucida with their sperm (or anywhere else), so this immunocontraceptive will not work for them.
One of the problems with PZP is that it works for a highly variable amount of time. Usually for just one year but in some mares it works for two or more years. It usually doesn’t permanently affect fertility unless the mare is given 9 or more injections (2 the first year, then one per year for seven more years) but sometimes it does permanently affect fertility.
I think it’s very promising but I can see why no pharmaceutical manufacturer has stepped up to finish developing it–too many unanswered questions. Plus, right now it is refined from pig ovaries, which limits the amount that can be produced.
Once it can be produced via genetically engineered bacteria (like insulin), I think it will be much more tempting to pharmaceutical companies.
I’d love for PZP to be available now but I can see why it isn’t.
On the other hand, the Canadian version from ImmunoVaccine Technologies only needs one shot and I’m under the impression it is already licensed for use… in Canada.
I do like imagining Fugly Ninjas armed with blow darts. LOL!
Luvinmyfugly
I am so sorry. I have made that prayer you mentioned. My dog with the insulinoma started seizing a few minutes later. Not the sign we wanted but any confusion/hesitation we had about the decision did go away. We had kept him alive and relatively happy nearly twice as long as the vet predicted. I feel for your daughter. These decisions are hell to make as adults. Facing it for the third time at 13 just seems hellishly unfair. I wish you and your family the best and I hope the pain fades to the memories of the good times quickly for you both.
Just Kreeping Up wrote: “The head is oddly small on that pony, although I don’t think 13 hands is particularly large.”
I think the pony is adorable but I suspect he’s probably gotten himself ready for a really hard winter. He’s beautifully turned out and presented but his belly seems a bit, er, overly rounded compared to the rest of him.
I don’t think he’s grotesquely obese the way that pic of a Gypsy Vanner that FHOTD featured was but he’s probably a little more rotund than he needs to be.
Of course it can be difficult to keep weight off some ponies, which seem to gain if you just lead them by a feedstall once a day and let them inhale deeply!
Luvmyfuglyhorse,
I’m so sorry to hear about you daughter’s mare, my thoughts are with you. Was she tested for pemphigus?
sarcastabitch said…
Oh, and here’s a message for all you self-appointed “grammar mavens”…
You look like fools.
No one likes a grammar maven on an internet chat board. While everyone here appreciates a conversationally-correct post with minimal spelling and usage errors…there’s none of us perfect in that respect.
If you only poke your noses out to critique GRAMMAR, you are demonstrating to the world that you have nothing relevant to say…that instead of reading for ideas and then contributing intelligently, all you read for were superficial mistakes.
Bravo.
My aptly named but transposed friend, Fugly enjoys the grammatical errors and mis-spellings as well as other literarly foibles of her targets. This was tongue in cheek, so I would suggest perhaps you understand the context in which things are written and proffered before snaking out to bite. But I am not the type to opine to those with whom I do not know nor have a connection. Enjoy your day.
“Oh heck while we are having true confessions…. I do not even like to breed outside mares at all. Most of the mares that people use for brood stock are mares I would not drag home for any reason, not even for free.”
Nice to know you’ve cleaned up your practice since starting the blog – even got rid of the old website – but:
Who’s Your Daddy
What happened to those rescues you were breeding?
shovels said…
“Oh heck while we are having true confessions…. I do not even like to breed outside mares at all. Most of the mares that people use for brood stock are mares I would not drag home for any reason, not even for free.”
Nice to know you’ve cleaned up your practice since starting the blog – even got rid of the old website – but:
Who’s Your Daddy
What happened to those rescues you were breeding?
Well Shovels, I am not sure what you could possibly mean by cleaning up my practices since starting the blog. This is not my blog. It has never been my blog. The owner of this blog IS a friend of mine, and she has been for several years, but she thought it up and runs it completely independent of me. I am not in any way, by any stretch of the imagination FHOTD. In fact she did my website for me and there is a photo of her riding My Fancy Reflection on the for sale page of my website.
As for the filly in the ad you posted, I can tell you anything you want about her. I purchased her dam, Cageys Fancy Miss at the Yelm Auction. The mare has 5 halter points and is a 2x AQHA performance ROM producer. The man who sold her there told me he could not get her in foal and he had bred her several times over the summer, the latest being mid July. She was bred to his Peppy San Badger horse, and I do not know the stallion’s name. Anyway I turned the mare out in my 36 acre field with my other mares. I had a very sweet but a little bit ditzy gal cleaning stalls at my place, who accidently let KLR Reflection out a couple of times while cleaning his pen, by leaving the gate open, not remembering he was out in the pasture attached to the stall. We did not believe any of the mares were in heat at the time, and she admitted MUCH later that she had let him out 3-4 times on accident the same way. The following spring, the mare was apparently cycling well and we pasture bred a handful of the mares, Cageys Fancy Miss being one of them, since pasture breeding can sometimes help an older mare who has trouble concieving. The mare quit cycling over the summer and I was sure we had her in foal. In August of the same year she bagged up and had this filly. Since the mare foaled August 7th, the filly COULD have been very over due and by the original owner’s stallion or one of those times the stall cleaner accidently let the stallion out could have resulted in this filly. When I sold that filly to her current owners, I told them that they could have her DNA’d and if she was by KLR Reflection I would be happy to provide them a breeders certificate free of charge. If she was in fact by the dam’s original owner’s stallion they would have to have AQHA contact him, and he told me at the Yelm sale, that he would be charging a stud fee for the filly. She was sold for 700.00 as a grade filly and if the people who purchased her wanted to chase down her DNA they were welcome to do it, again if she is by my stallion I will be happy to provide a breeder’s certificate. I never had the filly advertised and kept her until spring of this year, as I was going to sell her as a broke 2 yr old grade filly. To me she does not look like she is by KLR Reflection and I have no interest in paying a stud fee for a cow horse filly I have no use for. That is BTW a TERRIBLE photo of her, she is quite a cute little filly.
I have rescued many different horses at sales and privately. Most of the horses I have rescued have gone on to be riding horses for various folks. I do like to buy mares, and I have asoft spot for them. We did lose a pathetic old TB mare we bought at the Woodburn auction for 5.00, she got fattened up pretty well, but slipped and broke her femur on the concrete alley way. I have also purchased broodmares at public auctions. I have purchased several at Hermiston and Yelm over the years.
BTW feel free to check KLR reflections produce record after 2000. You will find the vast majority of the foals he has sired are out of my own mares.
Kay-
The stable is located in WI. The picture on the homepage is of me competing in BC, though I would love to go back to BC to stay.
Sarcastabitch, you hit the nail on the head, once again.
Any horse with 4 legs and a disposition that doesn’t require an advanced rider can be a family horse. 3 out of 4 horses have these requirements. They are NOTHING SPECIAL.
By breeding ‘family’ horses specifically FOR being ‘family’ horses and no other purpose… you are simply breeding JUNK.
Another favorite of mine is ‘all around.’ Puhleez. That’s usually (but not always) code for ‘We have no idea what to do with him, but we’re fairly sure he has legs and a head and boy wasn’t he cute as a baby?!’ Bull-oney.
Just like ‘prospect’ is code for ‘not broke.’
People think that wording things attractively makes the actual object more attractive. Obviously.
People also talk themselves into charging crazy amounts of money for their animals out of unproven parents and grandparents, based solely on their attachment and their skewed reality of what they think the horse might be able to do under the tutelage of a capable trainer.
I really look forward to the pricing pieces FHOTD does… the comparing of horses in a certain price range. Because there are TOO many people who just don’t understand that ‘Little Dunny’ is NOT going to bring $2,000 as a weanling, when his dad, mom, and all his grandparents have done NOTHING but create more babies. No matter how much you like him, or how ‘sweet’ he is, or how much ‘potential’ you think he has.
If he DOES bring that price, it simply means you found a bigger fool than yourself and buffaloed them.
GAH. Wake up, shitheads.
Dontyouridenofuglyhorses – You explained things just fine. In fact, when I looked at that filly’s pedigree, the first thing I saw was a very well-bred dam. Who cares where she came from? There are diamonds in the rough out there, even if they’re at a local auction. It never hurts to look. In a market like this, people dump pretty high quality horses left and right. It’s a buyer’s market, for sure. Those doing the “criticizing” are usually the ones with the cheap crappy grade fugly horses.
These simple-minded people are just on a witch hunt. I’ve been the target of similar minds, in the same position, while trying to logically explain similar things to people (who really don’t care what explanation is given). They only care that they got out their petty dig in front of anyone who will read the crap, and hope we make fools of ourselves with any explanation. Many very credible people are the target of these types on the internet. They pick and choose something and run with it, and by the time it goes around a few times, it’s so twisted and blown out of proportion it’s not even funny. People can be real shitheads.
Dontridenofuglyhorses… thanks for the explanation.
forthefutureofthebreed said…
Dontyouridenofuglyhorses – You explained things just fine. In fact, when I looked at that filly’s pedigree, the first thing I saw was a very well-bred dam. Who cares where she came from? There are diamonds in the rough out there, even if they’re at a local auction. It never hurts to look. In a market like this, people dump pretty high quality horses left and right. It’s a buyer’s market, for sure. Those doing the “criticizing” are usually the ones with the cheap crappy grade fugly horses.
These simple-minded people are just on a witch hunt. I’ve been the target of similar minds, in the same position, while trying to logically explain similar things to people (who really don’t care what explanation is given). They only care that they got out their petty dig in front of anyone who will read the crap, and hope we make fools of ourselves with any explanation. Many very credible people are the target of these types on the internet. They pick and choose something and run with it, and by the time it goes around a few times, it’s so twisted and blown out of proportion it’s not even funny. People can be real shitheads.
December 1, 2007 4:09 PM
Amen to that, FTFOTB.
Seriously, a friend picked up a mare this summer with fantastic running bloodlines fairly close-up in her pedigree for $600. The mare had cut her shoulder fairly badly, and they didn’t want to pay the vet bill for her, so they sold her for the bill.
There ARE bargains out there, that’s for sure. They’re just hard to find.
FTFOTB said:
“In fact, when I looked at that filly’s pedigree, the first thing I saw was a very well-bred dam. Who cares where she came from? There are diamonds in the rough out there, even if they’re at a local auction.”
I purchased 2 mares at Hermiston one year, who are full sisters to a horse with over 2000 AQHA points in practically every event known to AQHA, including halter, WP, HUS, Barrels, Poles, Roping, cutting, Reining, western Riding hunter over fences etc. This horse also was AQHA’s versatility horse of the year in 2001. The bay mare has a daughter that was Oregon High point WP horse for two years running and is now in New Mexico where she is the High Point AQHA WP horse. I paid 1,000 for the bay sister and 1300 for the black full sister!
You bet there are some bargains in sales out there. Cagey’s Fancy Miss is also a VERY well bred mare, she was fat and sleek, and stood out at the sale like a sore thumb, she is hanging out here kind of as a pensioner, as she only had that one filly with me.
mattsontraining.net said…
Kay-
The stable is located in WI. The picture on the homepage is of me competing in BC, though I would love to go back to BC to stay.
Hey I’m just south of you in N. Illinois, what part of the state are you in?
Dontyouridenofuglyhorse – Oh, I know it. I found a QH daughter of Azure Te (TB) a few years ago for a friend of mine. Cheap. They did 3 embryo flushes on her for an ET…but never got a viable pregnancy going. At the time, she wasn’t that old and had a foal at her side when she sold. She was just beautiful. Stakes-placed, and dam of 6 ROM race foals by some of the industry’s best stallions. Female line to die for. $1500. They had to put her down at age 32, after she raised several orphaned foals. She ended up being priceless.
It takes an educated person to recognize the good ones. They are wherever you find them.
I haven’t bought one at auction since 1971 (Pomona, CA…when Tonto Bars Hank sold for $90k). If I went to the sales now, I’d be buying too many and don’t have anywhere to put them. But then, I’d be accused of breeding “rescues”, too…LOL.
Do the free ones count as “rescues”?
This blog is visited by truly caring and compassionate people.
We laid Winter to rest at just before 1PM today. She was gone within literally seconds of the second injection. When I saw how quickly she went, I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt, that I had made the right decision.
Sally said: Currently I am going through something, with one of my daughters, that I don’t know how to fix, so I do understand lifting that overwhelming burden every morning when you get up… As mothers, we fix things. We make it alright, or at least BETTER; and when we can’t, it’s just unfathomably painful.
You have hit the nail on the head. Just before the vet came I hugged my daughter and told her how much I wished I could “fix” this problem. That’s what Moms are supposed to. It broke my heart into a million pieces to tell my daughter that I could not fix this one….
justkreepin up: Thank you…
decorum : She was not tested for pemphigus. At first we thought the hairloss/itching was due to an allergic reaction to Panacur- but have since decided it was likely an auto-immune thing, secondary to perhaps a cancer. The sores were not open like pemphigus. She just rubbed herself raw because she was itching so badly.
Nyxin – I live very near a reservation and have a great degree of respect for their medicine men and women. I also am a true believer in “past lives.” I gave some thought to Native medicine, and did look up some “cures.” They all involved getting her to eat something, which would likely have been unsuccessful. Also, by the time I turned to “non-traditional” medicine, it really was too late.
Prior to making this final decision, I had a call into an equine chiropractor/accupuncurist who also does energy work. She was going to come today, – but Winter’s condition was so bad, that I knew she was beyond this help, and decided to end her suffering.
To everyone: Please know that all the kind words of wisdom and comfort, thoughts and prayers have really touched me and my daughter.
Though still consumed with grief, we are also at peace, as is our dear friend Winter.
Now it’s time to start paying attention to the three others, who have been sidelined during all of this.
Special dinner of beet pulp and alfalfa pellets tonight!
Peace and thanks to all!
Kay-
The Appleton area. we are about 3 hours from Lamplight Equestrian Center
mattsontraining.net said…
Kay-
The Appleton area. we are about 3 hours from Lamplight Equestrian Center
You are quite a distance from me I’m about 20 miles north of the Quad Cities.
Do you normally go to Madison for the Horse Fair? I went last year but probably not this coming year. I think I’ll be going down to Springfield to the Illinois Horse Fair.
I usually go for tack, did some demos there quite a few years ago. Won’t be going this year as I am going to Germany in Jan. and not getting back till early April and have to have horses ready for end of April hunter pace. But will probably be taking my clients stallion there in 09.
I have never been to the IL horse fair, is it worth going to? I seem to be down in IL half the summer anyway between shows and buying track brats! lol
I’ve never been to Springfield for the fair but I think it is a great deal smaller than Madison.
I’ll basically go down there this year if Tommie is performing down there. I see his act a lot but I enjoy his clinics.
Luvmyfuglyhorse,
Auto immune disorders are hard, a life on steroids not much better sometimes. It didn’t sound quite like pemphigus, just an idea. Hug the ones you still have and take care.
“These simple-minded people are just on a witch hunt. I’ve been the target of similar minds, in the same position, while trying to logically explain similar things to people (who really don’t care what explanation is given). They only care that they got out their petty dig in front of anyone who will read the crap, and hope we make fools of ourselves with any explanation. Many very credible people are the target of these types on the internet. They pick and choose something and run with it, and by the time it goes around a few times, it’s so twisted and blown out of proportion it’s not even funny. People can be real shitheadsâ€
Isn’t that what this blog is for? Fugly says “sic em†and everyone starts slobbering? Though, we should never, ever, never, really never, say anything bad about close friends (and this makes this blog different from others how?).
Just happens I’m in the NW, know of Cathy and Shelly. If this blog had started a year or so ago, well, probably ya’ll would be snarking them. There will always be an excuse, though – I’ll take money on that.
This blog topic is long overdue, just seems everyone is a bit quick to “follow the leaderâ€. Maybe instead of being so quick to jump on the snark wagon, we should all take a look inside, then – let he who hath no sin cast the first stone?
I confess, I breed & ride those fugly little cow ponies. Our horses were in barb wire as a kid, though on a few thousand acres, rotated with cattle. I personally seen more damage done by those tight steel cable fences than barb – but that’s just me. I don’t wear a helmet when I ride (but neither does Fugly – thanks dontridefugly), though I do wear boots in a saddle. I ride bareback, with a piece of baler twine sometimes. I can’t get my fat arse on a horse over 15H anymore. Oh, horror – I’ve been riding horses since the day I was brought home (yes, my parents were fugly, dumshit, hick farmers) – I still ride with a trainer (who rides with trainers). I wear sweat pants, painted, ripped sweat pants. I can’t take a decent pic of a horse. I am simple-minded fugly fodder… I should feel so ashamed, but I don’t.
shovels – Yes, that’s what this blog is for. But obvious sour grapes is sour grapes. What you said wasn’t benefiting anyone but you. Hopefully, the blogger and the people commenting can benefit more than just one person, in the form of education and entertainment. THAT is what I think this blog is for.
And if you breed fugly little cowhorses, how about debating the logic in that instead? Something tells me it can’t be done. I’ve gotten into many discussions with those who breed by pedigree, and it’s not pretty. There’s a common mindset among them to resort to the personal attacks, rather than debate the subject at hand. I think some of them see themselves here at times, and it makes for an angry, resentful person.
So, I’ll start. And if you see something you don’t agree with, let’s hear your side of it.
Barbed wire? No excuse for it if you give a shit about your horses.
Fugly cowhorses? No excuse for it if you give a shit about the future of the breed.
Shovel said…
“This blog topic is long overdue, just seems everyone is a bit quick to “follow the leaderâ€. Maybe instead of being so quick to jump on the snark wagon, we should all take a look inside, then – let he who hath no sin cast the first stone?”
I’m guessing most people here are like me: I’m sick of the stupidity and the hurt horses. Not ‘follow the leader’ but kindred spirits. Most of us here are too outspokenly independent to be followers of anyone anyway.
Maybe it’s not a sin issue (where did you pull that up from on a secular list?) that we protest seeing horses mistreated and bred indiscriminantly so they can wind up on a meat truck. Quite the opposite. I know you meant the following thing. Save the shaming for those who hurt innocent lives.
Luvmyfluglyhorse, I weep with you. I’m so sorry. I am praying for you and your daughter tonight. Know you did your best to fix her and you let her go when you couldn’t. That was heroic to end her suffering.
Godspeed, Winter. Fly across green pastures and enjoy the caresses of your Maker.
Prospect does not always mean not broke. When I list horses as a prospect for a certain sport it is because they have been going w/t/c and show potential for a certain discipline. ie a horse that has correct form over fences and loves to jump but is not brave outside of the ring would be a hunter prospect.
I do agree that being a family horse is not a qualifier for being a stallion or broodmare. You can breed quality horses with proven bloodlines for certain disciplines and still have the type of horse that can be ridden by a less experienced rider. Would you rather have a well built horse that will stay sound and be able to go win in the show ring AND be ridden by a child? There are quite a few horses out there that can be both, where there are not many ‘lower end’ horses that you can say “the stallion won at class A hunters and stayed sound and the mare won the child’s hunters and retired sound to be a broodmare” so this young horse should have great potential to be my child’s next hunter.
There are diamonds in the rough out there, I make a point of searching them out to turn into a higher end show horse, and yes I have bought a couple from the auction that have went on to be quality show horses, but those have been few and far between. Most often they come from a certain bloodline and all have correct build that will hold up rather then brake down after a couple of years of showing.
ihearttwh,
My Walker boy does not have an ugly head, thank you very much.
http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b219/beau_justice/Random%20Horse%20Pics/Beau2.jpg
He doesn’t have the most enthused expression in that pic, but if you ignore that…certainly not ugly.
Of course, I may be biased. Just a little.
Well Saucy Wench, there is no mistaking him for anything but a walker. LOL!
Mattsontraining.net, It is commendable that you are into the training end of the horse market. The horse world needs more good trainers who are willing to take on a project instead of digging into rich peoples pockets to satisfy their own egos. Your site looks like it has very well conformed horses that will hold up to serious competition. Your judgement of a good horse is evident.
Shovels, why in the world do you read this blog?
shovels said, “Isn’t that what this blog is for? Fugly says “sic em†and everyone starts slobbering? Though, we should never, ever, never, really never, say anything bad about close friends (and this makes this blog different from others how?).
Just happens I’m in the NW, know of Cathy and Shelly. If this blog had started a year or so ago, well, probably ya’ll would be snarking them. There will always be an excuse, though – I’ll take money on that.”
You want to know what I’ll take money on? If Dontyouridenofuglyhorse or FHOTD raised fugly little cowhorses, you wouldn’t have said a thing.
_________
Dontyouridenofuglyhorse – Yes, I wondered the same thing. Why do they even read this blog? I know several who can do nothing but bitch to me about it, and I just tell them, “Don’t read it if you don’t like it.”
There’s more than one fugly horse breeder here under the guise of a loyal FHOTD follower. Maybe some realize that they have a whole herd of fugly little ill-bred foundation cowhorses they’ve created that they have their whole life savings into? They can’t sell them or give them away, no one wants them, and they don’t know what to do with them. They try running them through an auction and can’t get $100 each for them. Hay now costs more than what their common little horses are worth. They realize that FHOTD is right, and they’re probably pissed.
I know some people who breed positive HYPP halter horses that this would also apply to…
Maybe if the fugly little cowhorse breeders tried starting their own registry like the HYPP halter horse people are trying to do? Oh wait. They already did that. NFQHA and FQHR.
FHOTD- could this be a potential new topic?
I think FTFOTB might find this interesting too, especially since I believe it got a brief mention in the QH Journal.
There is a new association called the World Conformation Horse Assoc. which, as I understand is, is a group of QH halter breeders trying to preserve the integrity of quality halter horse conformation. It almost sounds like a response to the recently discussed AHHA (Halter Horse Assoc, not Holsteiner Horse Assoc). I briefly looked through the site and didn’t see anything about HYPP, and they aren’t even intended to be QH specific, but hopefully it is a step in the right direction!
I really want to see some input from the Halter and AQHA savvy people here (hence why FTFOTB comes to mind, although I know you are more of an APHA person but the industries are very similar) on whether they are doing things right or not, or if they even have a chance at making horses like BS Maximus-whatever-his-name-is and Kids Classic Style obsolete.
WCHA website
AQHA News Release
And just to do a little finger pointing and provide an example of what I hope becomes laughable: Ranch breeding N/H mares to N/H stallions, even though their oh-so-perfect N/H stallion died at age 7 with no mention of circumstances
Warning: be prepared to see a LOT of ultra-bulky ticking time bombs…
Addendum to above comment:
Jack Brizendine is one of the founding members of the WCHA.
WTF?
Addendum 2:
I looked at a handful (5-6) of the breeders’ webpages who are founding members.
They ALL have at least one HYPP N/H stallion.
I am so disgusted… unless there is something I am missing, I cannot fathom why people would go through the effort to create a new association with a great goal- to focus on halter horse conformation and breed for correct, sound horses- and at the same time continue to perpetuate a known genetic defect.
Can someone who knows what they are talking about please put this in laymans terms for me please?
Before some testicles “accidentally” get separated from some 1600 lb muscle-bound testosterone machines?
HeatherAQHA, I believe FHOTD already did a page on the World Conformation Hore Association.
She did one on the American Halter Horse Association, here and they are certainly similar, but this is a new one.
I was hoping the WCHA would be the opposite of the AHHA, but so far it is looking like a mildly disguised copycat. Ugh.
future,
Sorry, guess I hit a sore spot, huh?
Don’t have but a few fugly little cowponies, they’re still selling quite well (breaking records, go figure). Don’t know NFQH or the other, sorry. Don’t think they’d take mine, anyway (3 Bars was a TB).
On the subject of foundation – didn’t you refer to the nice breeding of a mare just a few comments prior, yet she’s foundation bred (not cow bred – learn the difference if you’d like to discuss it), so is she nice or a scrub foundation bred?
Barb on less than 100acre, not good (my fencing is all no climb or rail).
Breeding question (just something I came across). There are no reining stallions with NCHA finalist, but cutters have NRHA finalist, why?
“Shovels, why in the world do you read this blog?”
Because it’s the www and I can – that freedom thing, ya know? Heck, it’s probably more entertaining to someone who actually knows some on here than those that only have what they read.
I don’t read it for the education, though there are a few actual horseman on here. The entertainment value of mid-life crisis, the hypocrisy, society circles, it’s all here. High School wasn’t even this entertaining.
I suppose now I’ll get banned for not seeing what wonderful work ya’ll do… Gosh darn.
Why do Americans always insist on calling stuff “World Assoc of…” or “World Championship bla bla Show” when they really are just American Assoc or events?
Sure you may get a few people attending or becoming members from another country but really guys, come on, these events are not truly international – they are aimed at Americans. Not the Chinese, Japanese, Australians, Brits, New Zealanders, Swedish, Germans etc etc.
They usually feature QHs. Now guys I’ll let you in on a little secret – QHs may dominate the American horse industry/scene but they just DON’T in the rest of the world. I will admit that they are increasing in number – at least round where I live. But here the TB and WB are still more frequent(and in the eastern states there are lots of Australian Stock Horses). The other common American breeds (saddlebreds/TWHs and morgans) are UNcommon outside America.
But then I spose Americans believe that America IS the WORLD so they think they’re justified when they call their stuff “World bla bla”!!!
(sorry – pet peeve)
(Another secret – I don’t even LIKE QHs much. I HATE all that muscling that you guys LOVE. I love a long hip but what is WITH that bulge they get at the back of their thigh?? Very gross to my eyes. I actually really like well conformed QH yearlings – but then they grow up and look like Arnie!! Yuk!!)
By the way guys – I’m just having a little dig. No need to flip out at me – just “statin’ ma opinun” as you guys would say!!!LOL
Shovels – nothing like tooting ones own horn. Where’d you get your “I’m The Only Expert On Here and You Guys Don’t Know Shit” degree?
taldara,
I’m no expert on anything, trust me. Obviously not a great communicator, if that’s how it came out.
Something that’s been on my mind for years, do they rope kangaroos (or anything I guess without a horn)? What exactly do you do with them? What is Alice Springs like on a Friday night? What events are in the rodeos (again, a roping thought)? For some reason I always thought of Australia having stock ponies, TBs, and Andulusians. Can you list a site about OZ? What’s the differences from OZ and NZ? I’m an American, no expert on anything, just a lot of hot air – but I would like to learn more about the “outside world”. Thanks.
Like them Aussie stock horses, by the way. A few have managed to swim the pond and get here.
Shovels…glad to see you have a sense of humor!!
To answer your questions (thanks for asking BTW – sometimes feel very left out here LOL): No we don’t rope roos!! (Although I do work in the zoo so I’ve handreared a few!) And our stock saddles don’t have horns cause I guess we don’t ‘rope’ anything! Sheep and cattle are generally mustered into yards and worked there. Mind you I’m no expert – even though I breed a few Aus Stock Horses I’m into dressage and don’t currently ride in a stock saddle (have my eye on one though – very comfy for trail riding and good for breaking in)(Oh and you don’t get your bra caught on the horn – really, you should try one!!). (Did work on a big poll hereford station riding polo ponies/stock horses in Queensland about 10 years ago for 6mths but don’t think that counts!!) It’s really the eastern states and the big stations (read ranches) away from the capital cities that have working stock horses and I live in South Australia in the Adelaide Hills (if you look at a map of Australia, South Aus is the bottom half of the middle third of Australia and Adelaide is the capital).
Alice Springs is about 1000 miles from where I live!! For some reason you guys think that because our population is small Australia is a small country but we are almost the same size as North America!! It would take me about 8 hours to drive to go visit Blackfluffyhorses for instance who lives in Victoria.
Check out the Australian Stock Horse site for info on campdrafting – a little like cutting (go to the sport page I think).
http://www.ashs.com.au/website/default.asp
We have some rodeos but again mostly in the eastern states (where most of the people live – the thing about Australia to remember is that most of the people live around the edge of the country pretty much where the fertile land and water are). I think they do roping etc at these and ride in American western saddles. In SA the majority of people ride English. Warmbloods are the latest craze and lots of people are spending big dollars importing semen and breeding to Aus TB mares (lots importing mares/stallions/riding horses too). (I’m planning to do the same with ASH mares – I’m breeding for type not breed).
New Zealand is to Australia as Canada is to the US or Ireland is to England!! We have lots in common, lots of differences and we love to tell jokes about each other. Aussies say that Kiwi’s (New Zealanders) like their sheep a liiittle too much if ya know what I mean
(How can you tell if a kiwi’s been in your fridge? Love-bite on ya ‘leg of-lamb’. etc etc)
Wow this has gotten really long – sorry!!
Shovels, when did I ever post that my friends are off limits from being snarked?
For heaven’s sake, my friends are all quite capable of fighting their own battles. They do not need Mommy to protect them on the Skeery Internets. (They were on the Skeery Internets before they even met me, in most cases). If you want to snark my friends, feel free. They’ll snark back, of course. Although given that some of my friends here have identified themselves, you would certainly look more credible if you did likewise.
P.S. I’ve said before that I personally do not wear a helmet, except to jump or play polo. My points in the past have been that as a parent, you are responsible for putting a helmet on your child. That is part of responsible parenting. Someone who is 18+ may make their own choices and I don’t judge either choice. But if you’re gonna smack your toddler on a sale horse, PUT A HELMET ON HIM!
“But if you’re gonna smack your toddler on a sale horse, PUT A HELMET ON HIM!”
Oh Christ on a Cracker, yes. Please yes.
But then, I also have to wonder what’s the sales pitch of putting a toddler on an unbroke yearling to prove how tame the horse is. The kid is just sitting there like a lump, drooling a little for effect, and hopefully not making any mysterious smells. I mean, I think I could prove the same point by putting a couple sacks of old potatoes on the back of the same yearling and save the toddler a potential trip to the hospital…
Heatheraqha said, “I think FTFOTB might find this interesting too, especially since I believe it got a brief mention in the QH Journal.”
I find it extremely interesting, especially since I know of almost all of the founding members. You’re right, they are N/H or H/H proponents. They’re not all of a sudden going to change their position on that, I can guarantee you, since they were the strongest supporters of being able to continue to breed their defective horses during the “HYPP wars”.
“Conformation” my ass. It should read “World HYPP Halter Horse Association”.
mattsontraining.net said…
Prospect does not always mean not broke. When I list horses as a prospect for a certain sport it is because they have been going w/t/c and show potential for a certain discipline. ie a horse that has correct form over fences and loves to jump but is not brave outside of the ring would be a hunter prospect.
Right, which is why I said ‘most’, and not all. There are exceptions to this, obviously made by people who actually know a thing or two or five about horses and training and know that a certain horse shows potential in a certain discipline. However, you’ve got to agree with me when I say the majority of horses marketed as ‘prospects’ in one way or another are quite literally unbroke, and the seller is trying to ‘church them up’ a little by saying they’d be good at *fill in the blank*.
Now Shovels, where to start?
Again, I resent the comments that insinuate that we are all followers. That’s not right, and it’s not fair. Agreeing does not make you a follower, and being a friend doesn’t mean you agree.
But since we USUALLY agree, I suppose that, to the casual observer, we are viewed as a clique. Well, where do I sign up? Because, for once, a clique got it right.
Oust the breeders of mass-produced crap? Certainly!
Oust the folks who continue breeding unproven and unmarketable animals that likely wind up occupying dinner plates, rescue stalls and auction houses? Absolutely!
I don’t know any of these people here in real life. We’ve got a few mutual acquaintances, but that’s where it stops.
I simply happened upon this place one day and said ‘WOW, these people think just like I do!’ Do I have any strange loyalty to them? I do not.
But I DO recognize that the majority of folks who are regulars here are against the way the stock horse market–nay, the equid market as a whole–is headed down the tubes and are trying to come up with a way to help.
I have nothing against a good cutting horse, and it is in fact a discipline I have dabbled in and enjoyed very much.
But I have to draw the line at starting long yearlings under saddle to be ridden in futurities as 2 and 3 year olds.
And I have to also draw the line at the size of them… 14 hands is a PONY, no matter how you square it up and no matter how good it can cut a cow. I have no problem with them being SMALL actually, but c’mon. They’re not quarter HORSES anymore, they’re quarter PONIES.
Bickering amongst the ranks here seems futile when there are SO many others out there more deserving… even regulars here on FHOTD, as FTFOTB pointed out, that breed poorly and think that since they read the blog, that they’re doing right.
Just reading and commenting here does NOT mean you’re doing the right thing. It does NOT buy you immunity. Making educated, intelligent decisions, however, DOES.
I also hear folks bitching all over about FHOTD being ‘so mean’ and that we would have a ‘positive message’ if they would just quit ‘picking on people’ … puhleeeez.
For YEARS we’ve all tried being nice–honest, but polite and nice–and we’ve all met with disaster.
It’s time for the gloves to come off. Reality check: we’re ALL guilty in one way or another of doing something that may not have been the best idea.
The difference between us is that we choose to LEARN from our mistakes and the mistakes of others.
forthefutureofthebreed said…
Heatheraqha said, “I think FTFOTB might find this interesting too, especially since I believe it got a brief mention in the QH Journal.”
I find it extremely interesting, especially since I know of almost all of the founding members. You’re right, they are N/H or H/H proponents. They’re not all of a sudden going to change their position on that, I can guarantee you, since they were the strongest supporters of being able to continue to breed their defective horses during the “HYPP wars”.
“Conformation” my ass. It should read “World HYPP Halter Horse Association”.
December 2, 2007 6:49 AM
AMEN TO THAT.
Look in any journal and see what Jack Brizendine is showing. GOOD LORD, WHO THE HELL WANTS A HORSE WITH NO WITHERS, A FLAT-AS-A-BOARD TOPLINE, POSTY HOCKS AND WEENSY LITTLE FEET?! AND HOW THE HELL IS THAT CONSIDERED A ‘CONFORMATION HORSE’?!
I have to laugh.
Brizendine stands BR MAXIMUS… H/H stallion extraordinaire.