Rescue me from the rescuers!
Aug 23 2007
Lately, it seems that everybody is a rescue! The government is happily handing out 501(c)(3) designations to folks who do nothing more than smack a killer buyer’s horses up on the web (with a substantial upcharge to profit them, of course!) and then scream all over message boards that “the truck is coming.” Of course, if you point out that the horses would have a better chance of finding a home if they were selling at market price and not $800 for a 20 year old with navicular and one eye, you are soundly trashed as someone “who wants to see horses die.”
*insert massive eye rolling*
Furthermore, half the farm web sites you see advertise themselves as “rescuers” even though everything they are doing is opposed to what rescue is about. Here’s my take on what a real rescue does:
1. Takes in horses who are neglected, abused, or headed for slaughter
2. Does ALL the vet work…at their own expense
3. Does ALL the farrier work including remedial work and special shoeing…at their own expense. Does not spend more time begging for $$ on message boards than caring for horses. GodDAMN, those Friends of Barbaro have created a whole batch of monsters, it’s ridiculous.
4. Once the horse is ready, evaluates its training level and honestly advertises it based upon that evaluation.
5. If the horse is unhandled/untrained, provides training before adopting the horse out so that the horse may have a better chance at a happy future.
6. Does not adopt out without an in-person site check, reference check including vet/farrier, and legally binding contract forbidding resale and requiring a standard of care that is to be maintained.
7. Conducts follow-up visits at reasonable intervals to ensure care is being maintained.
8. Never takes in more horses than it can care for and keep everything up to date on.
9. Maintains its own premises in the same condition it expects from its adopters – i.e. clean stalls, safe fencing, no hazards in the pasture. Does not whine about having soooo many horses and not enough help and make excuses for their own place being a shithole.
10. Never disposes of a horse it has failed to place via a dealer or auction. Is unafraid to euthanize a horse who is crippled and suffering, or who is so mentally unpredictable that its chances of finding a safe home are close to zero.
Those are my minimum standards for real equine rescue. Anything else, in my never-humble-opinion, is just a variation of horse dealing with a warm & fuzzy marketing spin because that helps sales.
I want to say that I’m NOT opposed to a rescuer also having a breeding operation…if they are breeding responsibly. You know my rules: conformation + disposition + performance record. And obviously that you have a base of knowledge to know the bloodlines of what you’re breeding, what nicks with what, what genetic diseases must be avoided, etc. I DON’T believe that just because a mare has been rescued, that immediately should disqualify her from further use as a broodmare. I’ve seen some hella nice TB mares rescued – just because they were owned by an asshole who sent them to a sale when they came up open doesn’t magically make them non-breeding-quality.
However, a lot of so called “rescues” are also doing a whole lot of irresponsible breeding and that’s what we’re going to talk about today.
The site I was alerted to today starts off with a big diatribe about the difference between animal welfare and animal rights. Because, you know, we MUST differentiate ourselves from those horrible skeery animal rights people who do dangerous things like…protest. This main page contains so many falsehoods about the animal rights movement that I would not even know where to start, but that’s not the point of the blog, so I’ll skip past that. It is the Equine Sale page that caught the eye of my alert reader. Their words in bold, mine in blue.
DUE to DROUGHT Hay prices are tripled this year for us. To put that into perspective last year our hay bill was $3,000 this year it will be almost $10,000. There simply is not enough money for this. ALL these horses listed here must find homes before winter. Nothing like planning ahead! I simply do not understand how people can live in blissful ignorance of the fact that hay, like gasoline, CAN and DOES increase in price, often without much warning. By the way, here’s how you come up with $7000 extra over the course of one winter: both you and the missus get off your dead butts and go work at a minimum wage job Saturday and Sunday. Even if you are dumb as a post, they will take you at Taco Bell. Voila, $7000 extra over the winter! It is not the world’s problem that you don’t have money to feed what you created. It’s your problem.
All foals are pastured raised with no little or handling.
Well, of course. Because God forbid you get off your dead asses and go handle them. Hey, Mr. and Mrs. Asshat? I’ve tamed plenty of babies in the pasture. You go out there, and you mess with them, and you scratch their little butts, and you pick up their little feet, and you groom them, and you put breakaway halters on them. You can do this without ever once taking them out of the pasture. That way, when it is time to wean and sell them, someone will actually want them. This is how you avoid having to sell them for…
Any foal listed here $400 or best offer.
Except this one. This homely-headed critter is a “Thoroshire” and they want $2500 for it. Did I mention they have a Shire stallion and an APHA stallion? I’m not even sure what all they have for mares, although you can kind of put the story together from the rest of the sale page. Yes, it’s another 31 Flavors of Horses – one of my readers said we should call them BRB’s (Baskin Robbins Breeder). It’s for breeders who have a half-dozen or more different breeds of horses in their program, with absolutely no focus or logic to be found. I love it, I think I’m going to start using it.
The collection of bargain priced unhandled wild-as-a-march-hare foals includes:
APHA registerable(application will go with) any fees buyers responsiblity filly, probably homozygous..always produce paint color. Yes, becuase it’s such a good idea to throw grade horses out into the world and HOPE that someone will spring for their papers. But hey, whether they do or not, she is “probably homozygous.” So breed her!
colt(boy) out of a BLM titled mare and our APHA stud. he should mature about 14.3 own your own “Spirit” GAG. OK you bred a Pinto Mustang mix that’s going to mature to that EVER so marketable height of 1 inch too big for a pony but too small for almost anybody else who wants to buy a horse, and your big marketing tool is to compare him to a cartoon? Let me guess, you’re not gelding him before he leaves the property, are you?
CURLY momma (BLM titled curly mare) along with our apha stud has produces this gorgeous colt(boy) Of course, they’ve got curlies too…I’m just shocked, not. By the way, if you do not know a colt is a boy, you should not be buying one.
BLM titled gelding approx 4 yrs old about 15hh. was trained at the blm, to leadm pick up all four and load. He is very hard to catch. he has been pasture kept 2 years and should be considered wild again. Although he should learn very quickly as all the ground work was done $50 must go. Yoo-hoo, killer buyers! This one is on sale! You’ve got a nice profit margin going here, he looks like he’s real good weight. If you can catch him of course. Maybe someone can rope him. Or chase him into a corral with a helicopter, that’s probably how they got him the first time!
(Then they list a rather nice, broke gelding that, of course, they didn’t breed. Then it continues.)
Our APHA stud is for sale open to ANY offer.
If he doesn’t rip out his jugular on the lovely fence first!
Of course, this is yet another APHA stallion that doesn’t have a single accomplishment of any type listed. In fact, his name doesn’t even google, so odds are he’s never produced anything of note either.
19 year old TB gelding, came with the house when I bought it. Oh great. He is a retired racer and had his legs pinfired at some point. Poor horse, he’s just been hitting the bad luck lottery in life. He is very good natured and sweet. Due to drought he is a little thin now. He isn’t thin due to the drought, you shitheap. They don’t lose weight because it’s DRY. He is thin because you are cheap fucks who won’t feed him the way he needs. He’s a TB not a goddamn Mustang. The previous owner was riding him in the pasture and says he is very calm and good natured as a riding horse. I have never tried riding him. For which I am sure he is insanely grateful. He needs a home. I am sure he can be ridden lightly by beginners, because the fellow who had this place was not a very exp horse person. make an offer. I just need him off the hay bill(pics coming soon) he is a chestnut color. Stop me before I drive to Missouri and pick up this poor horse. I have to be a responsible rescuer and accept that I cannot take on any more right now. *sigh*
Curly mare BLM titled about 14.3 hh 5yrs old. was halter trained at the BLM to lead, load and do all 4. She has been pasture kept here. Translation: We haven’t done a thing with her, and sure hope she remembers all that training she got at the BLM! She isn’t a spooky type horse, but we have not worked with her in about 2 yrs. Yeah, pretty much what I thought. She currently has a chestnut pinto foal(boy) selling seperately(pics soon). She should be bred back to our APHA for a pinto colored foal next year. You can’t afford to feed what you’ve got now and you bred back WHY? Too lazy to bring the stud in from the field, perhaps?
also selling for a friend 2 TB mares..these are racebred mares extremely thin. he has had an even worse time with drought and lack of hay than I have. These are $300 each. firm if interested email for info
He will put them down rather than lower price, so please don’t ask. I don’t even want to know what these two look like. I really wish I could somehow stop ignorant people from buying Thoroughbreds. They are not easy keepers. You can’t just throw them out in the field. They often have a myriad of physical problems from the track and need expensive vet and farrier care. And the portion of equestrian society that cannot afford hay is usually the same portion that can’t RIDE a Thoroughbred, anyway. Yet I see people pick them up because they think it is “cool” to have an ex-racehorse. Is it cool to have them starving in your backyard? Asshats and your asshat friend, GET OUT OF HORSES.
Hey, y’all – but the asshats have been licensed as a shelter by the State of Missouri, so they must be rescuers!
These people think they are rescuers because they buy at auctions and sell to riding homes, and because they foster dogs for the shelter, but the whole picture needs to fit to be a rescuer in my book. The irresponsible breeding of horses that have NO value, crappy facility with barbed wire fence, and dumping of a horse they haven’t touched for $50 are SO FAR from what any reputable rescue would do as to be ridiculous.
The State of Missouri may have given you a 501(c)(3) but you failed the FHOTD test for rescuers…miserably. Quit trying to portray yourself as something you’re not. Get off your dead lazy asses and go work with those foals.
STOP BREEDING. STOP IT! STOP IT! STOP IT!
198 comments to “Rescue me from the rescuers!”
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Michelle said…
“And how would an x-ray prove it? Unless it is a brain-cavity thing?”
They were x-rays of myself after he hurt me and x-rays of the trainer I worked for at the time when he hurt her.
Fuglyhorseoftheday said, “You know, if we could merely cut breeding down to only allowing horses who are broke to ride to breed, I will bet we could solve the horse overpopulation issue right there.
Food for thought, hey?”
*Giggles* But then FortheFuture could not breed her phenominal stud… hehehe
Also, I have to agree with GeldTheBreeders… Horses serve so many more purposes than JUST riding. what about Minis that are too small to be ridden? What about the beautiful cart horses?
Now FHD, if you had said something along the lines of, “If we could merely cut breeding down to only horses that are sound (of mind and body), athletic, intelligent and quality specimens of their breed and intended purpose,” I would be right with you. (Which in fact, you have already said a billion times and so has pretty much everyone else on this list… lol)
**Disclaimer– I didn’t mean to offend anyone by this post, nor were my intentions to start an argument or war. My intended purpose was humor. Ya know… LOL?**
Drile said…
I volunteered at a rescue ranch over the summer and they were great:
http://www.longmeadowrescueranch.org/
I just went to this website. They are the Humane Society of Missouri.
I should hope that they would be the best that a rescue group can be. JMHO.
chromecowgirl – Thank you for calling my horse phenomenal.
And, yes, he IS broke to ride.
FHOTD said, “You know, if we could merely cut breeding down to only allowing horses who are broke to ride to breed, I will bet we could solve the horse overpopulation issue right there.”
If people were only allowed to breed via AI (artificial insemination) that would cut down on A LOT of irresponsible breeding, because breeding AI isn’t cheap and easy, whereas any moron can turn a stallion out in a pasture full of mares and see foals 11 months later.
As an added bonus, to breed a horse AI, the horses have to be handled at least enough to be able to catch them for the vet, and more so for the stallion.
Kerry said…
If people were only allowed to breed via AI (artificial insemination) that would cut down on A LOT of irresponsible breeding, because breeding AI isn’t cheap and easy, whereas any moron can turn a stallion out in a pasture full of mares and see foals 11 months later.
As an added bonus, to breed a horse AI, the horses have to be handled at least enough to be able to catch them for the vet, and more so for the stallion.
What an excellent idea!
michelle – im not really sure what kind of response youre trying to elicit. you havent provided pictures anyone could critique, so are you trying to get someone to leap on what you bred just to start a fight?
from her pic your mare looks supercute, im a huge clydesdale fan and they (and first crosses of lightening blood) make fabulous all round riding horses. bone, substance, sense, movement, easy keepers, excellent mammas – whats not to love!
you clearly put in the thought and chose high quality – what i DONT get is it sounds kinda like you were aiming for a jumper – so why did you breed a draft horse to a dressage horse? (honest, non-bitchy question)
Oh save me from the Dealer “rescues”. I think almost everyone in the horse internet world knows how I feel about certain rescues who aren’t! Taking some pictures and slapping them and double the meat price on the net does not make one a rescuer. Neither does sending horses to slaughter. LOL save the horses from rescues like these!!!
Michelle I would not breed this mare to this stallion. I can’t see her but I’ll just assume she’s a decent sort.
the stallion is nice but frankly there are lots out there that are nicer for the same stud fee range or a little more. I think they should take him out and campaign him a bit more to prove he’s going to be a good stallion. Frankly I think he’d make a SUPER gelding for someone looking for a big pretty WB type of horse.
I wouldn’t cross a Clyde with him because there is not a huge market for draft crosses. The breeders will try to make you believe that but the truth is in the kill pens and they are FULL of purebred drafts and draft crosses. But OK say you want to keep this foal forever and ever. Except you could get hit by a bus tomorrow, then what happens to him? OK you planned ahead and have an excellent home for him if that happens. So he goes there and the next day THEY get hit by a train! And oops they forgot to make arrangements for what happens to the horses. Nothing is guaranteed.
Another very big reason I would not breed a draft to him is you already have 3 sets of genes that are of similar but different body types. WB, TB, and Paint (which may have looked like a TB but still carries those stock genes!) and now you are going to introduce a vasty different body type to the mix.
When crossbreeding you get much better results mixing horses of similar body types than different ones. Which is why TBs and WBs cross well but WBs and say Arabs not so well. As in some are nice and some are WEIRD looking. Just like draft crosses, some are nice and some look like they were put together by committee. An infighting committee…
You can also get a horse that looks like one type or the other type, a nice blend or the fugly blend above.
Like OTTBs and mustangs not everybody is the right person for a draft cross, esp. a 1rst generation one. Which is fine if you are keeping it but not so fine if it gets sold.
But the most important reason I wouldn’t breed these together is… for the time and money spent you could go out NOW and BUY whatever the heck you want in a horse for a fraction of the cost and be riding (or training) tomorrow. There are too many horses of all types out there and plenty of good ones that need a home and some training. Why breed more 1/2 Draft, 1/4 WB, 1/8 TB and 1/8 Paint horses? Go to any PMU farm and you can pick from 100 or more babies of JUST that sort of horse.
That is why “I” wouldn’t breed these two together and not that I’m picking on your mare (that I can’t see) or the stallion that isn’t a bad sort, just not a GREAT sort.
I have a lovely mare who is not perfect but pretty good and I never did or would breed her simply because I can go to any track and pick up a TB just as nice for peanuts or go to any number of TB farms and pick up an even nicer one probably for free. Why spend the money and risk losing mare and foal when there are already a good number of horses out there as good as whatever I would produce?
even bigger added bonus to breeding only by AI – no more fucking racehorses or racing
Lol ForTheFuture… You are welcome. I actually think your stallion is rather nice looking! In the only picture I have seen of him (Though I KNOW I have seen him online somewhere, but cannot find the ad), the only parts I would like to see a bit different are his croup and withers, and a bit more open through the hip (this may very well be the picture though). I LOVE his back, legs neck and head.
His color is a nice added bonus too.
Also, I thought I remembered reading (in an earlier post) that your stud is NOT broke because you have been unable to find a trainer that you trust. I apologize for getting this bit of info wrong.
Hey chromecowgirl, here’s a photo for you. Of course, I couldn’t take the picture and ride my horse all at the same time. LOL. I have many photos of my horse being ridden, but unfortunately, they’re not all that good.
Stallion
Drile – did you work with the horses who were in the double-decker wreck? Please e-mail me if you did, I would love to hear a first hand account of the horses and the rehabilitation efforts, and I’ll post it here!
For those not familiar with the story, Longmeadow rehabbed about 20 horses that were in a double decker, slaughter-bound truck wreck. One had a healthy foal. Yes, some total waste of oxygen sold her to slaughter pregnant.
I will definitely extend the “riding” rule to include driving! Driving is great. As for halter horses, they should ride or drive too! At least get them trail broke. Having a job other than sex keeps your stallions well behaved and easy to handle. NOTHING but NOTHING is worse to handle than a stud who is only ever haltered for breeding. OMG, I have had to deal with some crazy bastards over the years because of that kind of handling. That is how people get killed and how stallions get bad reputations.
Break ‘em out and make ‘em work for a living. Sire AND dam. It won’t stop crappy horses from being bred, but it will certainly diminish the numbers if you had to put some effort into training. Furthermore, it would mean there would be homes for the 20 year old mares who don’t settle anymore. The way they get dumped at auction is one of the huge, shameful secrets of the breeding industry.
Again, I’m not anti breeding and that’s why I’m not against a rescuer also having a breeding operation. I am against breeding poor quality horses. I am in favor of responsible breeding (i.e. you take that 20 year old mare and you tune her up and you find her a nice 4-H kid when she can’t settle anymore). If someone finds a stakes winner of 250K at a meat sale, why shouldn’t she be bred? How does she differ from the stakes winner of 250K who is lucky enough to spend her whole life on some equine paradise farm in Lexington?
chromecowgirl said, “Also, I thought I remembered reading (in an earlier post) that your stud is NOT broke because you have been unable to find a trainer that you trust. I apologize for getting this bit of info wrong.”
My horse IS broke. I can’t find someone competent to finish and show him. I broke my back in two places a year and a half ago trying to do it myself.
>>>IncognitoMosquito said…
I don’t know that I would use the term “tweek” to describe the Art Deco line horses I worked with, but what I can tell you is that they would just occasionally “be dangerous”. The main one I worked with would be fine for weeks at a time and then suddenly completely explode. While he was in this state he had no sense of self preservation, which is how I got hurt.
They finally retired him when he was going along cross country just fine then out of nowhere he went straight up in the air, flipped over backwards onto his rider, then ran face first into the side of the carriage house.< <<<
Mercy snakes, sounds like some bats in the belfrey in this line.
smithereens, that is interesting your opinions of Art Deco et al, because that farm has such a stellar reputation. Sempatico is undoubtedly the most favored, but the whole farm has a good reputation and I’ve heard very few negatives over the years.
For what it’s worth, for anyone looking for more information on that type of thing (Art Deco, Silverwood, warmblood/sporthorse breeding in general) I would strongly recommend the Chronicle of the Horse’s Sporthorse Breeding forum, you’d be sure to get a variety of opinions and personal experiences on there from a generally very knowledgeable group of warmblood/sporthorse breeders.
Lifelike.. Did you know that originally, horses were not raced until they were mature (many of them being raced well into their teens)? (Imagine that… what a concept! lol) The average race was SEVEN MILES long.
Eventually, some idiot(s) got the brilliant idea (said with extreme sarcasm of course) to promote their young, up-and-coming horses by racing them on short tracks (a mile and a half)… Sort of a futurity event for the TBs. Unfortunately, the concept caught on and led to the current “disposable racehorse” industry.
Add to that the other disciplines that followed suit; i.e. Reining, cutting, etc. Its a really sad and bassackwards idea.
I think the
Eventing/Jumping/Dressage people are right on considering at least they seem to know that a horse cannot physically, nor emotionally handle the rigors and stress of such demanding work at the age of two (and usually more like 1 1/2 yrs old).
chromecowgirl, here is another picture of him being ridden. Not the best picture, but you can see he is broke to ride. He’s just not finished. He has w/t/c and stops and backs nicely. That’s it.
Stallion
ChromeCowgirl – exactly. Racing is not the problem. Riding them way, way, WAY too early is the problem, in various disciplines. It’s how you create horses who are permanently lame by age 10 and have no future.
Ok This strikes me as odd? How many other rescues out there have added to their wish list money to pay the rent? and money to buy the property they are renting? NO SHIT! Check it out for yourself…
http://www.mudponygallerie.builderspot.com/page/page/1870072.htm
Also I have not seen any horses poeted as available in about 2 years now? Hmmm… Fishy, very fishy… And we all thought rescues that were also breeding and adding to the problem were bad…
OOOPS! poeted should have been posted. I let my brain go too fast for my fingers.
ForTheFuture… I am sorry to hear of you breaking your back. That is a very difficult injury to recover from, if one can recover from it at all. I see lots of glucosamine, msn, devils claw, yucca and Hyarlurin headed your way. I hope that your injury doesnt cause you too much discomfort.
Just curious (and not for bashing purposes), did your horse injure you, or was it some sort of off the wall freak accident thing?
Fuglyhotd, if you go to the Longmeadow link the whole story is on there including a video of the rescuers talking about the wreck when they worked it. It’s a tear jerker. I love that foal they named Twist of Fate. They had a contest to let the public choose his name. Twister for short. Sooo adorable.
Oh yeah, I’ve read the site. I was hoping for an eyewitness account with more details. They don’t post a lot of updates or very detailed ones about the horses. I’ve sent money, and I’d love to learn more.
CutNJump… Holy crap! That is horrendous! Hey! I rescued my 5 yr old rotten heeler (he IS rotten and a very naughty dog, but I love him anyway). Do you think you could give me $8000 for a pickup please? (My Palomino mare is blind in one eye too and so I suppose she could be considered a rescue.) I am willing to apply for my 201(c)3 if that will make you feel more comfy giving me your hard earned cash! lmao.
WTF!? Why does ANYONE NEED Parelli products? Any old rope halter will work just fine (better yet, buy some parachute cord and check out a book on knots from the library and make the damn things yourself!)
Ugh that is really irritating… what a pathetic “Wish List”. My wish list looks a lot like theirs actually! hahaha
This one REALLY gets me and discredits them as a rescue completely in my book: “1 Million Gazillion dollars….boohaa haa haa!” Who the heck writes stuff like that on a professional website!?
chromecowgirl, here are two more photos. I’m not sure what you’re referring to with the hip and withers. He has a great hip and great withers. He’s a real nice horse, for an APHA horse with a Tobiano gene, and he has a pedigree to match.
Stallion
Stallion
chromecowgirl, it was a freak accident. At my age (52) and my physical condition, I shouldn’t have been on him. I didn’t warm up him properly, and it was the first really cold day of the year. Not a good combination. My horse is as laid back and sweet as can be. I collect him by myself for shipping semen. I have for 3 seasons now. He’s 16.1 hands and 1485 lbs.
chromecowgirl said, “That is a very difficult injury to recover from, if one can recover from it at all. I see lots of glucosamine, msn, devils claw, yucca and Hyarlurin headed your way. I hope that your injury doesnt cause you too much discomfort.”
Thank you. I’m doing fine. No meds. Just HA. The hardest part was taking him over to unsaddle him and put him away before I called for an ambulance. I was home alone. Big no no.
EXACTLY. racing itself is not the problem. its the greater systems of abuse that have arisen as a result of greed associated with racing that ARE.
if racing could be regulated with any sort of emphasis on preservation of the horses which are its lifeblood, i would have no problem with it. until hell freezes over, i will look away every time an abattoir passes by at 60kph.
“Michelle said…
Oh, and here’s more trolling for you guys, I know you love it!
I’m a GREEN RIDER! I bred my Clydie to a “colored sporthorse” and I’m not even a competitive rider! HAHAHAHA!
Why? Because going to auction and picking up someone’s garbage Quarter Horse was pretty unappealing. You can’t get everything at auction, or from the BLM.”
Wow, you really are trolling hard.
Just FYI, we managed to pick up someone’s garbage QH at an auction, but a little training on him, sold him for a nice profit, and he managed to take his next owner to Young Rider Champs in, guess what, dressage. 4th Level. One person’s garbage is another person’s treasure.
No, I wouldn’t have bred your mare to that stallion, but I bet you’re going to take the baby right on down to the AWS aren’t ya?
ForTheFuture… Thanks for the pics.
He is really pretty, and I know what you mean about quality Tobianos… Since the Homozygous craze has hit (not to mention the black fad… UGH), anything and everything with a tobi pattern is being bred. UGH! Even many of the highly promoted Tobis look like crap.
Lol I saw an ad for a homozygous tobiano sorrel stud once. He was listed as double homozygous. People threw a fit accusing the owner of lying… But I just laughed because (as I am sure you know) in all honesty, EVERY sorrel horse is homozygous… for red that is. hahaha
This side shot of your horse is a much better pic to critique from.
I don’t see anything wrong with his withers, and his hip looks better. Regarding his rump/croupe, its a bit more “goosey” than I prefer, and that’s all I meant.
What do you find your stud’s faults to be? Personally, I like to be able to list my horses’ faults as easily as I list their strengths. What type of mares do you find he best compliments? What do you feel his greatest strength and his greatest weakness are?
I’m not going anywhere with these questions by the way… lol I just enjoy talking horses with confident, knowledgable owners (or even enthusiasts).
Wow ForTheFuture… That must have been really frightening. I don’t like working the horses without someone else outside with me. Or, at least I inform them of my intentions and ask them to check on me every 20 minutes or so. I also keep my cell phone on me at all times for this very reason. Even the MOST “bombproof” horse can become 1200 lbs of fight or flight.
I rode a horse during a lesson about 20 years ago that was 20+ years old and had NEVER thrown anyone or even attempted to buck. As luck would have it, the horse, unknown to the owners, had a cataract that just happened to have progressed to the point of him only seeing shadows the first day I went to ride him. He threw me three times before I finally refused to get back on him. We found out a week later about the cataract. The horse became so spooky and terrified, thet he had to be put down…
Just another example of those freak things that can happen.
Lifelike… I agree with you completely. If there is any area of equine sport that needs to be addressed thoroughly (no pun intended) and immediately, its racing!
Racing is such a noble and beautiful sport… horses doing what comes naturally to them. Its a shame that the money hungry grubs (aka humans) involved in the sport cannot be more responsible. I just find every rule of the entire industry disturbing, backwards and completely ridiculous. Ugh.
LMAO guess I am on a roll… butter and honey please! hahah…
That being said, my kiddos just arrived home from school, so I will leave the computer (its too damn hot in AZ to do anything else until around 8 pm!), and see how their day has been.
Yep, one person’s garbage is another person’s treasure.
And no, this baby can’t be registered with the AWS. Just a mutt, just for me.
ChromeCowgirl- they recently spent tons of money on attorneys fees fighting over horses from one of their other ranches. They used the money that should have been spent on the horses for that- while asking the volunteers for hay and feed and everything else. Classy joint there eh?
Since I have ‘rescued’ my share, can I ask for a new truck too? I could also use a 6-8 horse gooseneck while we are at it.
Oh, Oh, Oh and how about some acreage? With lots of grassy meadows so some of the actual ‘rescues’ that need it can come live with me, instead of suffering through life at the hands of the ignorant.
Come to think of it I will also need a new barn and covered arena too… Hell why stop there? I’m sure we could all use some new, high dollar, top of the line tack couldn’t we? And feed? Blankets, a tractor, halters, shoeing, etc. Did I forget anything?
Michelle, Smithereens_86 and IcognitoMosquito:
Very interesting discussion on Art Deco. I have always admired him for his looks, but as they say “pretty is as pretty does”…I only have a general knowledge of dressage and jumping, so I’ve not seen him or any of his offspring in action. My sister and I were looking at him and Sempatico the other night. I will have to tell her about your info on behavior traits. It reminds me of some of the odd behavior that comes from certain Paso bloodlines.
Michelle,
all I can say is that I hope you get a nice foal out of this cross, because asking for opinions AFTER breeding, certainly won’t allow for second thoughts on the matter. Picture# 62 was probably the best shot of your mare (conformation.)
On another note:
As a photographer and horseperson, I wrote an article for our regional newsletter a few years ago on how to take the best pictures possible of your horse. It’s almost impossible to do it all alone, and even with someone holding the horse, they don’t always cooperate. Even my own bloody horses won’t always stand square for me, but it’s best to at least try. Black horses and Grulla horses are the hardest to photograph. Blacks because they lose detail from bright daylight, Grullas because their color is hard to capture accurately.
On hay in Missouri…
the pickins were so slim earlier this year, that my sister had to drive three hours to the KC area to get hay. The only hay available down there were crappy round bales that looked like they were two years old and were going for $85/bale! My hay guy ran out of his hay, but kept finding sources in the area to keep me in hay. So far things are looking good for the winter, and I’m not expecting a great increase in cost either. Not like that lady was talking about anyway!
Well, advice given BEFORE this breeding was quite a bit different
Interesting to see how things change though. Maybe it has to do with the slaughterhouse closures?
chromecowgirl said, “What do you find your stud’s faults to be? Personally, I like to be able to list my horses’ faults as easily as I list their strengths. What type of mares do you find he best compliments? What do you feel his greatest strength and his greatest weakness are?”
As far as conformation and correctness, I can’t find any weaknesses. All the angles are correct, and he’s very balanced. I know, no such thing as a perfect horse. I’m my horses’ harshest critic, too. By TODAY’S halter standards, he would be too heavy in the neck because I don’t sweat it. So far, he’s just been a breeding stallion, and I don’t breed halter horses (although I eventually would like all of my horses to do both). I like my horses to have enough airway to perform, even though a tiny, tight throatlatch and slender neck is what is pleasing to the eye for most folks. Sometimes fads aren’t in the best interest of the horses. He is a little goosey in the croup (not really a fault), but you ought to see him sit down and turn around. So it has its benefits. He is unique, for sure.
For performance, he has everything he needs. He has good bone (really), is super correct and straight, is 100% sound and barefoot without a blemish, and is as athletic as they get, especially for a big horse. And he has the best disposition one could ask for in a stallion. And he carries enough speed blood to please me and my theories about breeding for the improvement of the breed.
So far, he’s been bred to a variety of types of mares (QH and Paint), yet has dominated all with foals very much like himself. We’ll see when they grow up some more. His greatest strength is the fact that he’s a very dominant sire, and all of his foals have been super correct, very balanced, and easy to be around. They’re all little carbon copies of him. LOL.
GRAYWOLF said, “As a photographer and horseperson, I wrote an article for our regional newsletter a few years ago on how to take the best pictures possible of your horse. It’s almost impossible to do it all alone, and even with someone holding the horse, they don’t always cooperate.”
Isn’t that the truth! The pictures I posted were taken by me with no help. Someday, I will be able to afford professional ones, which I really feel is a necessity, especially for a stallion. We do the best we can for what we have to work with.
GRAYWOLF – Here are 2 photos of me trying to take photos of my mares while lunging them at the same time. LOL. Bad deal.
Mares
Now that I’m done reading it all the way thru, I apologize for the dig. It looked like you were asking for it.
But now I see that you actually thought out most everything. Including the training, I hope, with you being a green rider.
As far as the TBs go, I got my first ex-racer (Appendix) at 12 and first OTTB at 14. The appendix mare had been well schooled and was 16 when I started riding her. The OTTB was 6 with 30 days undersaddle that wasn’t race training. They’re difficult, they’re a handful, and they ain’t cheap to feed, but 13 years later, I still have my old man, and he still manages to surprise me.
No, they aren’t for everyone. Yes, I have run into clinicians that called my mother crazy for buying him for me. But when all was said and done, people who actually knew us were bragging that I had a talent for finding the “diamond in the rough”. I love my DITRs. It brings me a lot of satisfaction to go out and hunt for them, then work with them, polish them, and enjoy everyone else’s envy.
My worst accident ever was all alone – at least a mile from the barn, horse took a header and so did I. I had fractured my hip and couldn’t stand to walk so I got back on, which hurt like hell but only for a second. Then I was pretty much just numb and rode back. Next morning was AWFUL. Good thing it was my hip and not my neck! These days, I do NOT ride alone…not ever.
FHOTD – Isn’t that awful! I know I couldn’t breathe, let along do much else, but I couldn’t leave my horse saddled up in the round pen for the rest of the day. I don’t know if I could have gotten back on, though, as I didn’t even try. I knew I was hurt bad, but didn’t know what was wrong at the time. That was the scary part. Glad you’re ok, too!
I used to ride out alone all the time, when I was younger. Without a helmet, too. LOL. I guess we’re all lucky to be alive today.
Oops. That’s supposed to be let “alone”. Sorry about that.
FFOTB,
In all actuality, your two photos are better than many I’ve seen. I actually videotaped my sister riding a horse for me on a trail ride, all the while riding my own horse! At one point, I had to duck below a branch, but I kept my little camera level!
Most people think that they need to take photos when it is bright and sunny outside. Photos taken during slightly overcast days will actually prove to be better for even lighting on the horse (especially ones with lots of white…hint, hint) Otherwise, it’s best to take the photos early in the morning (9-10am-ish) or later in the evening (3-530pm-ish) Of course the latter would depend on the time of year!
Thank you, GRAYWOLF. I can’t imagine it being very easy taking pictures from horseback.
I was aware of the overcast days being good, but we don’t have a lot of those here where I live, and not during the summer months. The top photo was taken about 7:30am, so the colors were sure vivid. The other was later in the day, I believe. Thank you.
I wish that we could impose that list of rules on all people wanting to “rescue”…what’s sad is.. around here I have come across a couple of cases of horses that desperately needed rescue, and I couldn’t help them because I didn’t think calling up our local “rescue” would really help the situation at all! They probably wouldn’t have been any better off, and since I wasn’t in the position to take them myself and the local humane society couldn’t step in.. nothing was done. As many say…who is going to rescue the rescues?
ffotb,
The other thing I did want to mention, is that if you use a photo editing program (Photoshop, etc.) I would definitely recommend utilizing the grid feature and then do a custom rotation of your photos. This will get rid of the uphill (or downhill) appearance of photos that were taken without a tripod. Of course you’ll wind up having to crop the edges of the photo once you’ve done this… :-}
CHROMECOWGIRL—— The person who has the paint stud that isn’t broke because of needing to find a trainer is— ACME of http://www.azpainthorses.com
Speaking of rescues, does anyone here know anything about off-track Standardbreds? That’s one thing I have in mind to look into when/if I’m in a position to own a horse.
(Almost said “buy” a horse, but I could buy a horse today if I wanted–there’s some in the paper for a hundred bucks, and last week there was one for free. But since I’m the proud posessor of basic reasoning skills, I noticed that there aren’t any ads in the paper from people looking to get rid of feed, training, and veterinary care at bargain prices, so while I have the money to *buy* a horse, I do not have the money to *own* a horse.)
Crazy,
Can’t figure out what you think I should get from those videos.
First, it’s Europe. They show a bunch of starved horses, but all the horses at the plant are good weight. Not cost efficient to slaughter starved horses for meat. Europe uses kill guns, fast, quick, illegal in the US (if someone could tell me why, I’d appreciate it).
Second, Mexico (but if we close plants in US, sending them where there are no laws is better?). They’ll take the starved ones because they can use the hides to make cheap saddles (How’d you think you can buy a new $200 saddle to put on a horse to start the slaughter cycle again?).
So, what was your point? Open more slaughter houses in the US (no long shipping, inspectors, etc)? Good for you, now can you get the “I love horsies but don’t have a clue” bunch to go along?
Thanks, GRAYWOLF. I do have PhotoShop, although I’m not very proficient with it yet. I don’t care for retouched photos, although I’m not against doing what you suggest. I’ll have to play with it. Thanks again.
last year I was terribly sick with cancer, and was not able to care for my 2 horses. So, I found a great care lease home for my fugly kiger x mare, and we put our 30+ year old paint mare to sleep. Harsh? Maybe, but it was the right thing to do. She wouldn’t have survived the winter and was in bad shape. Couldn’t afford even the vet, so it was a bullet to the brain. She never felt a thing. My kiger mare came back to me this spring, fat and sassy and almost foundered. I now have enough income and hay to keep 2 horses indefinitely. We replaced the paint mare with a POA for my daughter. And guess what…we only paid $200 for him. I have had more people then I can count try and give me mustangs, just because of my email address! You can get a free, nice horse any day of the week.
My point is that if you can’t care for your horses, do the right thing and don’t make them suffer for it. I had a rescue lined up for my mare in case I could not find a suitable
leaser for her. I was prepared to never see her again, even though it would have broke my heart.
I have no sympathy for folks that don’t do the right thing by their horses (or any other pet they are responsible for).
michelle here is a site I found since you had mentioned breeding to a paint sport stallion
http://www.cocolallacreeksporthorses.com
Whew! Went and played on the rented backhoe (My honey is making new corrals, a riding arena and round pen for me… YAY!!!) took a shower and sent my son and roommate off to get dinner… Now I am catching up! lol Please bear with me.
FFoTB… Thank you so much for answering my questions. Its great that your stud is so dominant since he is such a nice specimen.
I also think your lunging pictures are pretty good. I recently attempted to take pics of my cremello filly (for registration) after I gave her a nice soothing bath. Well, we all KNOW how long the attention span of a baby is… By the time her bath was half over, she was sick and tired of standing still… lmao. The other difficult thing is that I had to have my hubby take the pics… legs cropped off in EVERY pic… figures right? Now, I will have to bathe and do the pics all over again if I am to use them for registration. lol
Here are the pics… feel free to laugh your head off (I edited my self out of them btw).
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/ChromeCowgirl/Peachesreg3a.jpg
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/ChromeCowgirl/Peachesreg5.jpg
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a297/ChromeCowgirl/Peachesreg4.jpg
I would LOVE to take a course on equine photography. UGH Even the NICEST horse can look like complete crap due to a messed up photo.
FHoD… How in the heck did you get back up on your horse!? OUCH! I am glad you made it home okay though. Wow. That is SCARY!
Thankfully I have never had an accident alone (I guess I am too chicken! hehehe). My worst was when I went to move from one stall to another, this absolutely messed up in the head wild little yearling and she ran right over me. My ankle folded to the inside and my foot touched my calf. I figured I had broken it due to the sound. I had my bf at the time call the medics because I didn’t want my kids knowing what was going on. It wasn’t broken, but I had completely torn the ligaments and tendons off of the outside of my ankle joint. I had the most beautiful bruises ever! hahaha
Graywolf… Thanks for the tips on photography! Have you ever considered writing that article for WH or the like? That is one issue I would DEFINITELY buy!
Rideshorses… Thanks for the correction about the Acmehorses being the one that said she couldn’t find a trainer. She is located in the same state I am, and if she is having problems finding someone, I hope I never have a horse that needs to go to a trainer. Geesh.. where have all the good ones gone!?
Professordog… Kudos to you on your intelligence and reasoning… Do you think you could bottle that up so we could sell it to all the stupid people out there? Its such a simple concept that you have created… I wish it were infectious.
I have known a few ppl who have rescued the STBs and have had excellent results with them (if you can find head gear large enough for them, you are already WAY ahead of the game! LMAO). From what I hear, the majority of them are very well tempered, intelligent and athletic. Also, I believe (but don’t quote me on it) that the breed has not been so bred down like the OTTBs so they do not have as many health issues.
The most common one I have read about with the STBs is backs being out of place due to being forced to pace instead of trot. A few visits with a good Equine Chiropractor will fix that right up.
Good luck to you once you do start you search. I know there are at least a couple VERY reputable STB rescues out there that evaluate and assess the animals. Google them.
ChromeCowgirl, you can lose the distortion as shown in the first picture, the butt shot, by using a longer lens. At least a 105mm or longer. The telephoto will make the horse appear in better proportion.
CHROMECOWGIRL said, “also think your lunging pictures are pretty good. I recently attempted to take pics of my cremello filly (for registration) after I gave her a nice soothing bath. Well, we all KNOW how long the attention span of a baby is… By the time her bath was half over, she was sick and tired of standing still… lmao. The other difficult thing is that I had to have my hubby take the pics… legs cropped off in EVERY pic… figures right?”
LOL. That’s the hard part. You need two horse people to do a decent job of that, and one needs to be a decent photographer. LOL. I haven’t figured out how to hold the horse and take the picture at the same time. I know what I want, but can’t be two places at once! If you do have help, the helper doesn’t know how to set up a horse.
I have met a couple of retrained Standardbreds and so far my experience has been that they’re excellent horses. I’d recommend giving them a look for sure when you are ready to adopt.
Okay, I went ahead and posted these pics (temporarily! lol) on my website on a somewhat hidden page… lol Here is the link:
http://www.freewebs.com/brushfirefarms/omgpics.htm
Kay, thanks for the tips!! If I could afford a really nice camera, I sure would LOVE to have one even if I did NOTHING more with it than take pics of my horses… LoL Alas, its Kodak EashShare for the time being! hahaha
Now, what are your suggestions for making me look like a supermodel (read as removing my gut, butt, thighs and wings)? LMAO
And while everyone is here… Does anyone know (or even have an opinion) as to why SOME horses have ergots and some don’t? I have always been curious about this, but have been unable to find anything about it online.
I assume that its akin to some dogs having dewclaws and some not. What do you think?
This place is the reason I shy away from “horse rescues” when this “rescue” was located in Spokane, I went out to have a look at their “horses” not only did they have them in horrible conditions, they BRED the mares and didn’t geld anything, they bred them all willy nilly. If you adopted from them you were required to sign a NO BREEDING CLAUSE. please have a look for yourself the rescue has moved several times and reopened under different names.
http://www.edragoon.com/closesleepyhollow/
Professordog, this is a Standardbred adoption society in BC Canada, and I know that they have adopted horses out to owners in the Pacific NW.
http://www.greenerpastures.ca/
I work for a standardbred breeder a couple of times a week, feeding, cleaning, doing general maintenence and handling all the babies every day. Right now there are 25, including 7 weanlings, one colt still with his dam, 5 yearlings, 1 stud, a 2 year old with a hock injured when he cast himself, and 2 three year olds who are just off the track for a month or so (one has a cut on his fetlock that is healing up). One mare is hard to catch. I am careful around the stud, but he is a sane horse to handle. The three year olds are sweethearts. All of them are mellow, well mannered horses (well, not the young’uns, but they are on their way, and improve weekly!)
A lot of standardbreds race a lot longer than thoroughbreds, and some even race into their early teens.
The adoption society does not call itself a rescue, and it is overseen by the standardbred society in BC, run by an elected board. All horses are donated by their previous owners, and are usually green broke to saddle. They insist on you having a trainer if you aren’t experienced in working with a green horse. Their application form also asks about shelter, fencing, riding experience, what vet you plan on using etc. They also ask what color you would prefer, bay, black, brown, chestnut or grey! If you want bay, you have a great selection! (At the farm I work at, we have 6 blacks and 19 bays, with minimal markings! Try getting to tell all of them apart!)
If I was looking for a horse for myself, I would certainly consider one of these. Right now, I can’t afford even a part lease on a horse, so this job is my way of having my ‘own’ horses! 25 of them, and I get paid! Life is good!
Chrome Cowgirl, an inexpensive EZShare usually has some kind of a zoom lens on it. Extend it as far as it will go and you pictures will improve. You can take off a few pounds, at least the ten the camera puts on, with a clone brush and an editing program. LOL I’m not sure about being a supermodel though.
Has anyone had any dealings with Columbia Basin Equine? I follow their site and check out the horses maybe once a month or so. They seem to do a pretty good job, and also seem honest with their opinions of each horse (I am referring to the feed lot horses). But, I was just wondering if anyone knew anything more about them.
Jay, thanks for the tip!! I don’t have Paint Shop Pro anymore and have NO CLUE how to use the prefab Paint program on windows… lol I just recently learned how to crop photos with it and resize. lol
I will try the zoom trick next time I take pictures!!! I will let you know how it turns out. Thanks!
And another detail about the Greener Pastures Standardbred adoption organization: they started in 2003, and have placed well over 100 horses into new homes since then. And not one male left the premises a stallion!
I have a friend who just got a horse from Greener Pastures and couldn’t be happier with her. I love standardbreds, great horses and a wide variety of “type” too. Some are pretty fugly, others are gorgeous and there are alot that are inbetween and make great mounts.
Thanks, Just_kreeping_up. I had it in my head that Standardbreds were calmer and less prone to leg injuries than TBs, and I couldn’t remember if that was based on some kind of objective reality or just something I pulled out of my ass. (Obviously, when the time comes, I’ll do actual research.)
[incoming pro-standardbred lurve attack rant]
im a HUGE fan of the standardbred, not least because (in my country) for every one OTTB that goes to the doggers, at least 10 STBs go too. TBs have some reputation of ‘possible second career’, STBs are misconceived as ugly, stupid, useless and lowbred. not true!! if only that breed prejudice could be reversed, literal lives would be saved. where do all the hot, dangerous, cheap-because-theyre-crazy TBs go? young, inexperienced pony club girls with non-horsey parents – and they pay with their limbs and lives. by comparison a big, dopey STB who takes life at his own cruisey pace is the ideal first/second mount to tolerate an amateur, try a little of all disciplines and keep his head in all the crazy situations a kid will get her horse into!
my personal choice is for one raced as little as possible to lessen wear and tear (proven too slow at the training stage would be fabulous) and get a trotter, not a pacer. with a pacer you have habit and damage (physical and mental) to undo before you can get started training, a trotter just needs to be started again from the start. contrary to misconception again, they do NOT lack canter or necessarily find it difficult, theyre just conditioned never to do it – try to find one that hasnt been so heavily drilled ‘canter is BAD’ that he is unwilling or afraid. once he rediscovers the fun of a good gallop with an encouraging rider, getting him forward wont be as much of a problem as some people think!
they are pushed in harness to be heavy on the forehand and lean into the bridle, so lots of work on rebalancing and flexion/suppling is needed. dont give him anything to lean against, teach him about looooving contact and stretching down into it. drive from behind and you can access a fabulous motor, use lots of lateral movements and CONSTANT transitions! bonus is you can ‘push’ for more with less risk of an attitude explosion (of course, always being fair and rewarding). even the laziest STB can be ‘sharpened up’ into a responsive horse that carries on his
hindquarters if you challenge his brain enough that hes really listening – i had one flipping joyous 3-tempi changes into the air so i promise its possible.
same horse saved my life when i fell off stupidly and found myself lying on my back UNDER his body with his size six feet either side of my neck O_O blessed horse stood like a rock (staring at an idiot human without even laughing at me!) while i slowly extricated myself without injury. i cant see many OTTBs doing the same
good luck and bless you for considering this most underrated, worthy breed!
and for anyone who thinks theyre ugly or cant move… eat standie DUST!!
http://www.wilde-r-farm.com/horses/
images/Speedboat040627-034-800.jpg
http://www.horsedeals.com.au/
photos/36722.JPG
http://www.jwep.net/Summer_07_wed/
tn_Summer_07_1450_JPG.jpg
I love standardbreds. Never owned one but have met quite a few. Really level headed horses w/solid builds that are really nice family or beginner horses. Of course my flavor is Arabian endurance but if I ever had to switch…….
>>>fuglyhorseoftheday said…
Oh yeah, I’ve read the site. I was hoping for an eyewitness account with more details. They don’t post a lot of updates or very detailed ones about the horses. I’ve sent money, and I’d love to learn more.
August 23, 2007 2:54 PM < <<<
We had an appointment set up last fall to go down to the ranch and adopt one of the wreck rescues, but then we stumbled upon our Appendix and her filly that we had to immediately buy (rescue) so we just couldn’t do it. I gave money too at the beginning and then I gave money for Twister’s care. That wreck happened about an hour from where I live. Just made me sick the morning it was on the news. I cried as I was trying to get ready for work and cried many more times as I kept checking the website for updates. There were pregnant mares and youngsters on that damn truck. Fucking scumbag money grubbing SOB’s.
Smithereens – I have had the same experience with Art Deco babies. Many years ago, I had also wanted to breed to Art Deco. I was lucky enough to run into 3 of his babies at local Dressage shows. They were all NUTS, NUTS, NUTS. You could tell it was the personality, not the trainers. After seeing this, I elected NOT to breed ANYTHING to Art Deco. Later, I saw several more Art Deco babies come up for sale around here, but I wouldn’t touch them with a 10 foot pole. I’m sure that not ALL of them are like this, but I think it is too risky for me to want to buy one. Michelle, I think you will have a pretty baby, I just hope it gets your mare’s personality.
Did anyone ever find the website to this rescue?
Whoever wanted a STB, there’s a website in BC that advertises the “longtimers” from one of the BC adoption orgs. http://www.rideagainequine.com they just consign, and are in no way a rescue. You can often get a nice STB for a nominal fee…and they’ll put you in contact with the rescue/adoption places they deal with.
Buying an STB, like buying an OTTB is a risky venture. Vet checks with x-rays and bloodwork is mandatory. The legal drugs and supplements in the harness racing industry can take a half-wild freak and turn it into the big dopey STB that someone else described…and some of the less-ethical trainers leave pretty deep scars that you can’t see. I’m sure you know about most of the tricks employed in the racing industry…I guess all’s I’m saying is, don’t be lulled into a false sense of security because it’s not a TB…if anything, there is more underhandedness in the harness industry. Dealing with a legitimate rescue ought to help with that though.
As a general rule, I agree that most STBs are better suited to second careers. They race longer, so if they come off the track sound, they’ll probably stay sound in the long run.
I’d agree though, buy a trotter…unless you like a “creative” ride…your own “gaited” horse
That pacing is bizarre.
And as for teaching them to canter…some people just get sick of trying and decide to enjoy the fact that their STB can trot as fast as anyone else can canter…but STBs aren’t the only breed with “canter blocks” my Clydesdale spent 10 years in a farm-harness…getting her mouth and chest hauled on by the weight of a hay wagon if she broke into one…so while she canters fine in the pasture, convincing her to do it in tack is tricky.
ChromeCowgirl said…
Has anyone had any dealings with Columbia Basin Equine? I follow their site and check out the horses maybe once a month or so. They seem to do a pretty good job, and also seem honest with their opinions of each horse (I am referring to the feed lot horses). But, I was just wondering if anyone knew anything more about them.
——————————
There’s a loaded question. While no doubt some horses are better off getting out of there I do not find their methods acceptable and many horses are not better off having met them. Google CBER and search some forums (like COTH) for pros and cons. In my mind a rescue does NOT send horses to slaughter and that is what CBER has done to at least 2 horses (by their own admission) that were safe and off the lot. To me they are all about the money, the horses are secondary, the donors come in a distant third.
This article is exactly the type of thing I was referring to the other day. What starts out as a rescue becomes a case of animal hording. I personally don’t think rescuers should be in the business of breeding. Why would they create more horses? Wont the ones they breed compete with the ones they rescued for new homes? Because of the Fugly Horse of the Day blog I am reconsidering breeding my AQHA mare. This is a quality mare that I show. I think if added up all the money it would take for me to breed her to a quality stallion and support a foal until it was old enough to ride,I could take that same amount of money and purchase a quality AQHA broke and ready to ride. For each time I don’t breed her there is one less horse to compete with the ones on thier way to the slaughter house.
This is actually how I lost my Percheron colt in 2004. I had him and his dam boarded with a lady that claimed to be a vet tech, had a really nice facility when I was there, and had just started “rescuing” PMU horses. Granted, she had a couple of Paint studs and was breeding them all, but she was only adopting the registered ones for breeding. She was actually successful at first at training and rehoming quite a few of the grades and fuglies.
Then she decided she would offer hauling for the rescued PMU mares and babies at really cheap prices. This worked fine until she realized she had severely undercut herself and couldn’t afford to haul the horses for the prices she had already contracted and been paid. She would bring EVERYTHING she hauled to her house and then sort and send them back out in varying directions to their homes.
Well, she got so far in over her head that she had NO hay, and ended up with about 60 horses (about half belonging to paying customers) on her 80 acre property and had no way to feed or care for them. Instead of just speaking up and informing everyone that her good intentions got her into trouble and could everyone please send a couple hundred bucks to offset her mistake and help support their horses, she just let them all starve (including my colt). She ended up losing about a dozen babies (the majority of them belonged to her, with the exception of about 3 of them), and a few others. One yearling was found in a sling in the barn and had been hanging their dead for several days. It had a body score of 1.
Suffice it to say, she was also a breeder of fugly, poor quality Pugs and Pug mixes (mixed intentionally with Saint Bernard if anyone can imagine that!)
It was a horrible case of good intentions gone bad. It was a VERY sad situation all the way around, and the people whose horses were seized from this woman’s property ended up having to pay tons of money on vet bills, seizure fees, and then more hauling to get them home.
My question is WHY is this so prevalent? WHY can’t these people see that their horses are starving, they have too little room to support so many animals, and yet they just keep adding to the problem. I just don’t understand it at all, and wish there were a way to get in these people’s heads and find out what they were thinking.
Personally, I think a lot of these “rescues gone bad” continue on because they truly believe that they are rescuing these animals from a worse fate. They really just need a wake up call.
It pains me to see things like this. I have two dear friends who run an equine sanctuary, just down the road from here. It’s a “for-life” sanctuary, for all types of equines with problems. Once the animals are sent there, they don’t leave, since most have such severe problems, mental and/or physical, or need such intensive care, they’re not eligible for adoption. These women are excellent horsewomen, and have worked wonders with their horses. Most were abused or neglected, and many are infirmed horses. I have never seen such loving care given to horses, as I’ve seen with these lovely women. My husband and I have donated our time and money to help them. They put the horses first and foremost. I wish all rescues were run with such loving care.
How is breeding a Pug and a St. Benard a good intention? Uggh!
There was an article a few years ago in one of the small animal vet tech magazines about animal hording. The article compared it to mental illness. It stated that the people really didn’t know how bad it was. Still no excuse for their actions.
>>I think if added up all the money it would take for me to breed her to a quality stallion and support a foal until it was old enough to ride,I could take that same amount of money and purchase a quality AQHA broke and ready to ride.< <
Yes, you could. Breeding rarely turns a profit…you need to be in it for the love of the breed, and you need to have other sources of income (i.e. training, lessons, horse hauling, a day job).
FHOTD said, “Breeding rarely turns a profit…you need to be in it for the love of the breed, and you need to have other sources of income (i.e. training, lessons, horse hauling, a day job).”
You got that right! I didn’t buy a stallion (as a weanling) so I could make money. Never expected to, either. I have a particular goal to reach for, and my love of the breed is what drives my breeding program.
I believe that animal hoarding is now in the process of being recognized as a form of mental illness. They really don’t see how bad it is and believe that the animals are better off for being with them. Very sad all around.
http://www.tufts.edu/vet/cfa/hoarding/
Animageofgrace– I was able to find the website for the “breed” and here is what it says about the beginning:
“The Mini-Mastiff’s origination is traced to when a registered St. Bernard, sire, and a Chinese Pug, registered dam, produced a litter of brindle, cuddly, affectionate and unforgettable bundles of joy. The unexpected color and heart-winning look became an immediate “smash hitâ€! The new owners of the Mini-Mastiffs found that they were “the talk of the town†and wherever the Mini-Mastiff went, heads turned! Since then 2 additional St. Bernard and Pug litters have been carefully selected and approved”
UGH! It just makes me sick. I happen to know for a fact (from unfortunately having to deal directly with this person when all of the crap happened with the horses) that the first mating of a male St. Bernard and female Pug, happened in the backyard “by accident” (read as… “Well how was I to know that my St. Bernard would be able to impregnate my Pug? I mean, they are so different in size! But I sure am glad that they did because NOW I am inbreeding the three original litters and selling the pups for a lot of money!”
Grrr the lady is about as clueless and money hungry as you will ever find.
Chomecowgirl-
OK i know this is totally OT but i know your mares sire my friend owns “Boston D Bars Shadow” im always happy to see his foals doing well
anyways…..where is a web page to this person???
Before I share I want to apologize for this post… I am new to blogging and really haven’t figured it out yet! In any case, I have been an avid reader of this blog for a month or so now and have really enjoyed it. For some bizarre reason I have always enjoyed reading the sale ads in our local papers (like I need another horse!) and while most of the time I can laugh at them, sometimes I can’t… so sad. This is the most recent one from this week (spelling direct from ad):
“Strickly breeding horses, 3 year quarter horse stallion, sired 3 foals, 1 left to look at, awesome papers, very typee head, $695. 4 year paint brood stock mare, registered, $695. 12 week foal at side, Sorrell, wide blaze, 4 white socks $395″
Whaa? And to boot this ad is from my area of northern California! How do you suppose they can justify breeding horses that aren’t even worth the cost of the hay for a year?
Anyway, way to go! The education of humans is always a touchy subject and where our animals are concerned we can be downright stupid (apparently!). I have always wondered how a person can be required to have a driver’s license to drive, a marriage license to get married, a dog license to take a dog near town, but nothing is required to own a thousand or more pound horse that requires um… feeding!! Responsibility is such a tough pill to swallow.
WpRanch– Thanks!!! The filly you are referring to is actually OUT of a Boston D Bars Shadow daughter. She is an adorable little mare and belongs to a very good friend of mine.
I am really excited to get that baby home and love on her!
Here is the link to the Mini-Mastiff website.
http://www.uniquetivity.com/innovation/minimastiff.htm
Enjoy! lmao
In Australia registered rescues are audited. But I’ve met a few “rescuers” (read dealers) in my time that need to be euthanased themselves. Honestly, if I hear 1 more person tell me their dog/cat/horse/bird is emaciated due to the drought, I’m gonna hurt someone. They are starving cos you are too cheap to feed them asshole!! I’ve lived on toasted sandwiches for weeks so I could feed my pets & horse in the past… responsible owners do what they have to do to keep their animals healthy. notice how scumbags never sacrifice their own ‘needs’ due to the drought?
geeze, this cant afford hay thing is giving me the pip.I cant afford hay right now either as it’s $21 for lucerne(alfa) $20 for oaten hay on average in australia currently BUT there are other feeds that used right are value for money and keep animals healthy and their stomachs working properly.
Is there NO grains or such feeds in the USA?
please please tell me because all l ever see is ‘l cant afford hay’ in these adds
Shells; where are you buying your feed? I’m up to $24/bale of lucerne and $21 for grass!! And I’ve had some good horses, but never anything over 12hh that could be kept all winter on nothing but hay. Even my pony gets hard feed after her work. Truth is, if they can’t afford hay, and think that will solve the horses problems, then they aren’t going to invest time and money into a decent feeding program including hay, grain, and a correct vitamin/mineral intake are they??
what i dont get about the ‘hay is expensive’ people OUTSIDE of australia is dont they turnout AT ALL?? grass is free!
i know its a rare horse that can bloom on grass only, but limited turnout means limited foodstuffs. whats cheaper, locking your horse up and having to buy 100% of his feed, or giving him SOME chance to feed himself wherever possible, which can only drop your bills? or are people actually keeping their horses in bare dirt yards? *barfs*
no, i havent done a global geographical study of this subject, but perhaps people could list for me the places in the world where a horse cannot receive a single mouthful of nutrition from natural turnout.
lets start with:
1. many barren places in australia (currently).
add to list as appropriate (no really, im interested in being educated as i honestly dont know).
It’s so basic, really. Don’t get more horses than you can afford. Why is this such a hard concept? Don’t breed more horses than you can afford to keep forever in case you get stuck with them because the market is flooded. This seems to be even more difficult for the average BYB to comprehend. I’d love to create a “survey” that is actually a blind IQ test and give it to every BYB and see where they are REALLY at. I bet we’d find some executive functioning impairments, you know the place in the brain where logic, reasoning, and planning happen, lol.
Having horses necessarily means sacrificing time, energy, AND money to sustain that hobby. And yes unless you are Amish, live on a working ranch, or are a backwards ass country hick living in the boonies somewhere, horse ownership is a fucking HOBBY! 99.9% of the horses owned in this country are kept for funsies (and this includes the high end show breeders, race horse breeders, WB’s and so forth). NOBODY HAS TO OWN A HORSE – THEY ARE A LUXURY. Therefore, if you have to “beg, borrow, or steal” to keep your horse addiction going (and in my opinion that’s what it is, a self-gratifying, selfish addiction), you are a selfish dickwad with shitty priorities and your horses will eventually suffer for it.
There are tons of ok rescues, many that suck. Really good ones are rare. I’ve seen horses at local “rescues” warehoused on dry lots with poor coats, bad hooves, and big chunks missing from being overcrowded in incompatible herd groups. I can’t say that some of these folks are the sharpest knives in the drawer either. The horses are probably still grateful that they are not being abused but what I see sometimes at some of these places is no better than being on a feedlot awaiting slaughter either, only this kind of warehousing has no logical conclusion, they just linger until they drop dead or start losing weight and get put down. I guess then comes the question of values… do we value the horse’s life alone, or does QUALITY of life matter too?
As far as good rescues go, one of the rescues that I do like is owned by a neat lady in Maine. She and her husband do it right. They are private, small, take great care of their animals, are licensed by the state as a shelter and take in seized or surrendered animals, invest in appropriate medical care (but are realistic about limits too). They get the untrained ones trained, the unsocialized ones socialized, the intact stallions/colts cut, and have a pretty rigorous adoption process. No BS either. They won’t adopt a horse out to someone that is ignorant or who will not provide excellent vet, farrier, and personal references OR who do not have the ability level required to handle a particular horse. They also do site visits, and pop in from time to time to check on the horse’s condition after adoption. Unlike most rescues, though, they don’t keep the string attached forever. They will actually grant permanent ownership of the horse to the adopter after a time (and I think it depends on the situation). Their adoption contract also prohibits breeding the mares. They do great work, their horses all look great, and their farm is awesome! I’d love to be rescued by them, lmbo! Best of all though, they don’t spend more time and engery begging for money from people than they do taking care of their horses… so refreshing, lmbo! Their website is htt://spiritofhopefarm.tripod.com so you can check them out.
OK guys, I inquired about the 2 starving Thoroughbreds so that I could send some help over there and got this response “He decided to not let me advertise them until they put weight back on. People outside this area would not understand drought and lack of hay and the affect on farmers/people/animals”
What, you mean the EFfect that not feeding your horses because you are cheap has on them? OK great. So we now pretty much know these mares are in the kind of condition where animal control will nail this guy, but we can’t find him. This is the original breeder’s “friend.”
I dealt with a rescue in WA years ago. I drove up and it was in this gorgeous wooded area, then I saw the fences, they looked good – all “elephant type” electric fencing, as the rescue owner put it. Then I saw the horses. Every single one of them had rain rot. *sigh* Some rescue.
It is perfect that people can take the loan moreover, this opens up completely new possibilities.