Because training them takes time.

So we just put them in a contraption to “fix” all the problems.


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Doesn’t he look happy?  Let’s see if we can decipher all that is on this poor horse’s head.  It appears they have take a combination gag bit (like this)87780-1


and instead of putting the mouthpiece in the mouth for whatever reason they have used it as a pseudo curb chain along with the curb chain that is  already there.  Then they have a fancy wire tie down just because.  Then to top it all off they have tied it all together.

Why?  How bad is this horse?  Couldn’t more training be of use here.  Although looking at his eye it appears he is already in a state of learned helplessness. Basically the poor guy has given up.  No matter how hard he tried to tell his rider he doesn’t understand,  or he hurts, or whatever is causing his disobedience they just throw on more contraptions so he can’t act out.  It is a poor training method but unfortunately one that is used often.  Remember this poor horse. 422526_349657281735172_178115402222695_1104455_1078256524_n

 

Instead of training them they just force them where they want them.  I saw comments on the first horse that he was in a parade and maybe a stallion and needed more control.  Maybe they just need to go back to the round pen and start over.

Another horse in a parade, in a snaffle and the rider is bareback.

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How about Rugged Lark? He was a stallion and he put on all sorts of shows bridleless. OMG how did he ever do it? Training.  Without quick fixes without contraptions and gadgets.  Just time and good training. Head to 3:24 for the bridleless part.  He is amazing.  That didn’t happen overnight that took time.

 

 

 

Another delusional horse owner -Updated 12/6/2014

 

What is with these people who have all these dead horses and yet think they did nothing wrong.  The “not my problem mentality”.  This guy even goes so far and says it was God’s Plan for all the horses to die. All these horses that he left to rot. This one is in Mississippi and the “I didn’t do anything wrong” man this time is Jerry Earls.

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Of course now that the pictures have hit the news and social media they are suddenly gone.  Buried, he claims.  No one could come out earlier he claims.  No, we all know you weren’t going to do anything until someone else found you out.  He claims he that the “boy with the tract hoe” wouldn’t come out a month ago.  Sorry again, those horses, well at least some of them have been laying there for more than a month.  More delusions. I hope he buried them according to law because it is a $1000 fine per incident if he didn’t.  Better yet I hope he didn’t since maybe that will hurt a little and make him think about his actions.

“No, I ride a horse 7 days a week for a living,” added Earls.

He made this comment to the news.  I wonder what that horse or horses look like.  Or even what he says is true.  Maybe he is lost in his own delusional world and now thinks his truck is a horse.  I guess they do say there are 350 horses under the hood.

Finding another news story it appears this guy not only doesn’t take care of his horses but he steals livestock too.  He pleaded guilty to charges of stealing a bull, 20 cows and 21 calves.  He is still on probation for that crime.  But he doesn’t do anything wrong.

The pictures from the woman who found them are shocking and disturbing.   Jerry, this horse has been dead more than a month.

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The law is looking into whether any of these horses were stolen as well.  This one just had a set of new shiny shoes put on. Then you let her die? Where did she come from?

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What is wrong with you Jerry?  You are saying the same things as Larry said that the horses were just dropped off and came to you in bad condition.  Bullshit a horse with a fresh set of shoes did not come to you in bad condition. Speculation on the one above is it was a mare who died during foaling.  Because you know checking on your horses takes time and energy and apparently those aren’t important things for Jerry.

The couple that found the horses had this to say about the scene:

“There were horses with missing eyes. Some were walking on three legs, and some were messed up so badly that they couldn’t walk. A lot of them had cuts, and there was pus coming out,” he said. “There were a lot of baby horses out there, and we could smell something dead, but we couldn’t find it at first.”

But it was God’s Plan they died, right Jerry, I mean not because you didn’t get care for them.  Or that you let them rot with infection or die while foaling.  You did the best you could right?

I am so sick of these people amassing  these large quantities of horses and then just letting them die.  They are conducting their own hunger games, survival of the fittest and it is not right.  Who needs over a hundred horses?  Really probably nobody. The care and effort of that many horses requires a large staff and a lot of money to do it right.  Clearly this was not done right.

Jerry says he isn’t hiding anything and you can see hay out for the horse.  Let me ask you this though Jerry, when was the last time they had their teeth floated?  Just because they have hay in front of them doesn’t mean they A were able to masticate it properly or B that is was of sufficient quality for them to get nutrition out of it.  Plus you did this to the water source.

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That horse has been waiting way longer than a month for burying.  Get it together Jerry, you are not a horseman you are scum.  Scum who can’t see what is in front of your eyes.  If you don’t think you did anything wrong then you need a very rude awakening.

Jerry hasn’t been charged with anything as of yet, although the local chapter of the Humane Society of the US is investigating.  While I have never been thrilled with the HSUS’s fundraising skills they do step in and help with the legal stuff well.

This story is brand new and developing so we will keep you informed.

 

Update – this Facebook post from the Mississippi Board of Animal Health:

The Copiah County Sherrif’s Office has charged Jerry Earls with animal cruelty. They have confiscated four horses and have them under veterinary care.

Horses that had been hauled away have been located and brought back to Mr. Earls’ property and are under quarantine by the MBAH.

The MBAH continues to investigate the source and health status of the horses and has determined that they belong to an individual in another state.

All horses do have access to food and water.

If you wish to contact MBAH or offer assistance, you may contact them at (601) 359-1170 or via their FB page.https://www.facebook.com/msboardofanimalhealth?fref=ts

Finally he is being held responsible. Maybe now he will start to think he may have done something wrong.  Maybe it wasn’t all “God’s Plan”.  I would imagine some of the reason he was charged was the public pressure, so let’s keep the pressure on.

Someone has started a Change.org campaign to have this case investigated by independent parties.  Earls brother is a deputy and so it makes sense to have another agency either do the investigation or at least oversee it. Don’t need any conflict of interest to muddy the waters.

https://www.change.org/p/jim-hood-we-the-people-and-constituents-of-the-state-of-mississippi-request-that-another-agency-with-no-ties-to-the-accused-complete-a-full-and-true-investigation-of-the-100-abused-neglected-and-dead-horses-on-a-property-located-in-copiah-county-miss

The mugshot that you should pass around.  This man should never own another horse, or animal, again and we should all know his face.

Copiah County Sheriff's Office

Copiah County Sheriff’s Office

 

 

 

If they don’t sell, we’ll breed more and other Craiglist fun!

These were all based on reader submissions.  Keep them coming!  Email me at fuglyblog@yahoo.com

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A little tough to read unless you blow it up. From the Ad:

I have a few “paint horses” for sale 30 to choose from $500 to $5000, many are broke to ride, mostly big horses. other breeds available also, call
show contact info
for more info. shown by appointment only, thanks!

A few isn’t really 30.  A few would be like two.  You have many, or just the number would work too.  Being that you put “paint horses”  I am going to venture a guess that these are not registered paint horses.  You know they have a color for that.  It is called pinto.  When a horse has those markings and it not a registered paint, which is a breed and a color, it is just called pinto.  I know there are other breeds because omg look a solid one!!!

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None of the pictures are great so it is hard to judge them at all.  I do know if you are going to try to get $5000 out of a horse you need to have better pictures than a bunch hanging around in the herd. At least they are clean and have their hooves trimmed. If you are in northern California and think you might want to upgrade one of these guys here is the ad. 

Our next horse is all about the adage a (good) stallion makes a great gelding.  Well I wouldn’t have called him a good stallion but he does look like he will make a good gelding.

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Here is his ad.

If you want lots of color and a great mind, this is the boy for you. He is an APHA registered homozygous paint gelding that absolutely loves people. He is 9 years old. Was previously used to breed. But was gelded a few months ago. So now is ready for a home where he can be someone’s riding partner. He has been started under saddle and has shown no signs of bucking or any other naughty habits. On his 3rd ride, we rode him around the property. Such a sweet boy with an awesome and calm mind. He was already such a calm stallion. So as a gelding, he is that perfect sought after laid back kinda horse, that was born broke. It won’t take much to get this guy going out on the trails. He will literally load into anything. Including a tiny two horse straight load trailer. Come meet him and see if he is what you’re looking for. This is the kind of horse that would be perfect for that 4-H kid that wants to train their own horse. You are welcome to come see him and ride him around. We are not in a hurry to sell him. So please be serious when inquiring about him. APHA papers are in hand. Has had his teeth floated a couple months ago. In great health and good weight. No soundness issues. Nice solid feet that don’t require shoes. This guy will make someone an awesome riding partner. Pics taken 11-12-14 Asking $3500

Would possibly trade him for a good running vehicle or a horse trailer.

Of course he didn’t do anything before except breed.  Wouldn’t want to make more quality horses would we.  He had the right parts and now he has a few foals.  Perfect. I am glad someone finally came to their senses and gelded him since there really isn’t anything there that is gold that needs to be passed on.  I am glad he was easy to break and he probably will make someone a great horse if he really is as laid back as they say.  But why?  Why not break him before breeding him.   Seriously people why wait 9 years to do the right thing?

Onto the next, Sneaky, sneaky but I see what you did there.

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16 year old sorrel morgan mare rides decent no buck bite or kick hasn’t been ridden in awhile I saddled her up she rode off fine good trail horse ill.even throw the paint in the picture in shes 14 n broke

Two for one special.  But we won’t mention it until the end.  Kind of like you take that one you get that one too.  Hopefully they both get upgraded.  People take better pictures.  I know it takes work but every horse is capable of standing and eating from a hay pile.  Clean them up and take some decent pictures!!

 

 

 

 

 

I was going to take care of them, I swear

Well at least that is what Larry Browning said after authorities found 49 dead horses on his property.   He claims people would just drop them off but sorry Larry once you started feeding them and didn’t report them as abandoned you became responsible for them.  You couldn’t even bother with taking the halters off of them.   I know this happened back in April but I think it is important to get his name out there are someone who is incapable of caring for horses.

Did you really have intentions of selling them?  Or is this just your MO since you appear to have had problems feeding your horses back in 2011 and 2013.

According to the article above Larry had 49 dead horses on his property along with 51 live ones. 15 of them so emaciated they seized them.   Vets put their Henneke scores at 1.5-3. Some were even dead entangled in the barbed wire trying to escape the madness.  It was so bad that the only food and water they had was tainted by decaying carcasses.  Nice work Larry.  The county’s equine investigator is calling it the worst case he has ever seen.

Larry is full of good quotes about the horses and the horse market.

“I have not done one thing wrong,” he said, noting he wasn’t on the farm when animal control officers were there.

If I wasn’t there I didn’t do anything wrong.  That is the problem Larry you didn’t do anything.  You didn’t feed them, you didn’t water them, hell you didn’t ship them off to slaughter like you said you were going to.  Nope it was better to just let them starve, die and rot on your property.

Browning said he doesn’t mistreat horses and in some cases slaughtering them is the right thing to do.

“I don’t believe in slaughtering good horses,” he said. “But when they get mean or crazy or a certain age, or they’re crippled or they’re really, really old, I think it’s more humane to slaughter them than to let them starve to death, a slow miserable death. I really do.”

Oh so you don’t mistreat the horses you just don’t feed them.  Is that different?  In your eyes it must be.  Larry, just about anything is more humane than allowing a horse to starve to death, how about those 49 on your property?  Larry you realize there are other options between slaughter and starving to death right?  Like humane euthanasia performed by a veterinarian. If you were going to take them to slaughter, why didn’t you?  Too much time, money, effort.  Hell grab a gun and euthanize them and it would be more humane than what you did.  The truth of the matter is you are a sucky person who didn’t care about the horses.  You put minimal effort to maybe make some money and when that didn’t work you just turned a blind eye.   Eve you admitted you weren’t there when Animal Control seized the horses.  It is because you couldn’t care two shits.  I hope the charges open your eyes a little bit.  You claim you didn’t do one thing wrong.  I am glad your conscience is clear but you did several things wrong.  You could have reported the abandoned horses (they weren’t really abandoned were they Larry?) you could have fed them (maybe).  You could have not allowed 49 horses to die and then not properly take care of the bodies.  You did a lot wrong but I know you will never admit it.

I can’t find any disposition on this case.  There is a trial pending for Larry Browning in January so hopefully that is him and when he is going to get his rude awakening.  You might not think you did anything wrong, Larry, but the law thinks you did.  Please don’t get anymore horses.

 

 

 

If you stand up to a bully they usually back down

Remember what’s her name, Scamming Sophia?  Or was it Jamie?  Who knows, does she even know? We discussed her as a sneaky trainer and she made us all laugh with her contradictory rebuttal. Well she just settled out of court since she knew she was up shit creek without a paddle.

Good news for all as the misrepresented horse Spirit is back with his original owner and hopefully Scamming Sophia has learned a lesson about taking advantage of people.

As I said before the horse community is a tight one.  People won’t get away with pulling shit for long.

What breed standard?

One would think that before a person got into breeding a certain breed they would read the breed standard.  We talked about it will the overly dished Arabians and with the Quarter Horses and their big bodies and little legs.

Breeding is supposed to better the breed.  To make the best example of the breed as a whole.  The good breeders weigh every fault and decided the risk benefit of any pairing.  These are the highly successful breeders whose culls even go onto success in the lower level arenas.

Then we have the people we talk about often who just breed whatever has the right parts. These are the people to avoid.  If they can’t easily explain to you why the cross happened walk away, no maybe run.  Any good breeder will readily share with you their thoughts about why the pairing happened.  About the pros and cons.  The faults and perfections of each the mare and the stallion.  Their goal of why they produced the foal.  Most good breeders could talk to you about this for hours.  These are the breeders you want to be supporting.

Moving on to today’s selection.  This stallion was sent to me with the caption “Is he standing at stud for the fugly blog?” With this picture.

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Holy Roman nose Batman.  He really has monocular vision, his nose is in the way of anything else.  I know the Baroque breeds don’t mind a little roman nose but let’s look at the breed standard and evaluate how closely this stallions meets it.

Lusitano Horse – Official Breed Standard

TYPE – Middleweight (weight around 500 kgs.) “Medium lined”; sub-convex profile (with rounded outlines); a silhouette that can be fitted into a square).

HEIGHT – Medium; at the age of six years, the average height, measured at the withers is 1.55m (nearest conversion 15.1hh) for females and 1.60m (15.3hh) for males.

COAT – The most appreciated and esteemed are all shades of grey and bay.

TEMPERAMENT – Noble, generous and ardent, but always gentle and able to support duress.

MOVEMENTS – Agile, elevated forward, smooth and having a great facility to carry the rider in comfort.

APTITUDE – A natural ability for concentration, with a great disposition for High School work; courage and enthusiasm for the gineta exercises (combat, hunting, bullfighting, work with cattle etc.).

HEAD – Well proportioned, of medium length, narrow and dry, with the lower jaw not too pronounced and the cheek inclined to be long. Slightly sub-convex profile with slightly curved forehead (in advance of the eyebrows’ bones); the eyes, tending to an elliptical form, are big, alive, expressive and confident. Fine, narrow and expressive ears of medium length.

NECK – Of medium length, with fine hair line, deep in the base, well inserted between the shoulders, rising up arched from the withers without convexity, ending at a narrow and fine junction with the head.

WITHERS – Long and well defined, with a smooth transition from the back to the neck, always higher than the croup. On adult stallions is sometimes covered with fat but always prominent from the shoulders.

CHEST – Of medium size, deep and muscular.

RIBCAGE – Well developed, long and deep, slightly arched ribs obliquely inserted into the spinal column giving rise to short and full flank.

SHOULDERS – Long, slanting and well muscled.

BACK – Well placed, tending towards the horizontal and making a smooth connection between the withers and the loins.

LOINS – Short, wide, slightly convex, well connected with the back and croup with which they form a continuous line.

CROUP – Strong and rounded, well-balanced, slightly slanting. The length and width of identical dimensions; harmonious convex profile with the point of the hip unobtrusive, giving the croup a cross section of elliptical shape. Tail with long, silky and abundant hair gently emerging from the convex line of the croup’s profile.

LEGS – The forelegs are well muscled and harmoniously inclined. Upper arm straight and muscular. Knees are thick and dry. The cannons tend to be long, dry and with well-pronounced tendons. The fetlocks are dry, relatively big and with very little hair. The pasterns are relatively long and sloping. The hooves are of good constitution, well formed and proportioned without being too open; the line of the coronet is not very evident. The buttock is short and convex. The thigh is muscular, normally short and oriented in such a way that the patella gaskin is in the same vertical line as the hip-bone, or point of the hip. The legs are normally long, placing the point of the hock in a vertical line with the point of the buttock. The hocks are large, strong and dry. The hind legs form relatively closed angles.

Let’s see how close this stallion gets.

Type – He hits on the sub-convex profile but he is longer than he is high so he misses on the square profile. This image is cropped in a square outline so you can see that his length is longer than the height.b83e65ed-931f-4952-87e3-92661c932725_zpsf411d6c1

I can’t find a height for him so we will skip that one.

He is not a Grey or Bay so he misses this one.  Plus Cremello is a dilute Chestnut so even his base color isn’t correct.  Not sure why they started breeding for this color when it is not a preferred color is beyond me. Cremellos are often used to produce Palominos but again that is not a preferred color so what is the point.

Based on his pictures and the write up on him I would say he meets the temperament standard.

Same with Movements and Aptitude.  He really looks like a handy horse that has a lot of skills.

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Head, oh the head.  Breed standard here is SLIGHTLY curved forehead.  He has the opposite problem those Arabians had.   I don’t find his eye to be large or expressive. Overall his head is a detracting quality.  Some people may like it and they call it a  “Veigas” head but it doesn’t meet the standard at all.  The Veigas head simply means convex but if you look at this other example a nice convex head that isn’t so abrupt looking.  This is the head they are looking for. Big expressive eyes.  This is a beautiful example. Salty-head-DSH-3537I am going to give him the neck.  I think it could be a little cleaner through the throatlatch but overall it is a nice neck.

He hits the withers one perfectly.

Chest is ok as well.  I would prefer it to be  a little deeper but it is fine.

The ribcage could be deeper but the shoulder is very nice.

As we have already discussed he is a bit long in the back for his height.  The problem is in his loin as it is a touch long throwing off his square balanced profile.

The croup and the legs are pretty spot on.

Conclusions, I think this is a nice stallion that is worked well and is an ok representation of the breed.  He is a showman and it looks like he does his job well.  I don’t like that he isn’t a preferred color and his head is awful.  The good thing about the head is it doesn’t seem that he is passing it along.  Here is a filly of his.  She is Palomino so not a standard color but her head is a much better representation.

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Finding a good stallion is all about knowing your mare and being honest about her faults.  It is good this stallion seems to be passing on his good qualities but it would be a long 11 months for me waiting to see if my foal’s head was going to look like this.

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My advice is research, research, research.  Find a stallion that has the potential to fix your horse’s flaws.  Check that his offspring is showing strengths in those areas.  I am not an antibreeding person but as I have stated many times breeding needs to be done with a lot of thought behind it.  Comparing any future sire or dam to the breed standard is the best place to start,

 

Permanent methods of identification- updated since post was cut off

What if your horse was stolen, or you were separated in a natural disaster, or you simply needed to prove ownership.  Could you do that easily and legally?

Let’s talk about that today.  The benefits to having easy, legal proof of ownership has many benefits.  From identifying your horse in a natural disaster situation to potentially saving him from slaughter.  Different states have different rules for permanent identification and some states have no rules.  We will touch on some states here but make sure you check with your states Department of Agriculture if you need any clarification.

I am going to start with the brand states. Colorado, Idaho, Kansas, Montana, Nebraska, New Mexico, Nevada, North Dakota, South Dakota, Utah, Washington and Wyoming.  While the regulations vary in all these states this usually means a horse has to be inspected when travelling or when sold.  I know Colorado has permanent cards and they make it like a title for your horse and you don’t have to have them inspected every time you travel.  If you live in a brand state and can get a permanent card make copies of it and stash them in your vehicle and with a friend or relative so you have access to them even if you don’t have access to your house.

Sample of a Brand Card

Sample of a Brand Card

A horse doesn’t have to be branded for the inspection.  The inspector will note the colors, markings, scar and any other distinguishing marks on the horse.  Some are using pictures these days as well.  Make sure if you horse has anything unusual it is noted in case you need to identify them someday.

Speaking of pictures these are an excellent way to show distinguishing marks.  Take pictures in both the summer coat and winter coat from all four sides with close ups of markings and the head.  If you clip the horse in the winter it might be a good idea to include those too.

Going back to brands they can be used as identification as well. They should be noted in the pictures or inspection card but you can note them as well in your own paperwork if you are not in a brand state. If the brand is your own it makes it even easier for identification because that is registered with the state.  If you purchase a horse already branding make sure you have noted that.  Brands can include hot brands and freeze brands and some are done by the breed organizations and that would be noted on the horse’s papers.  Keep in mind some states don’t view papers as any sort of identifying paperwork.  Check with your state though.

Lip Tattoos are commonly done in racehorses and this is also an identifying mark.  If your horse has one take a picture of it and note the number in your paper work.

Microchipping is a newer method if identification and it got a lot of press after Hurricanes Katrina and RIta.  Louisiana requires permanent identification of all horses so approximately 80% of the horses were microchipped.  That led to the easy identification and return of over 90% of the misplaced horses.  Which is a great feat.  It was due to that fact that I decided to microchip my horses.   The microchip is implanted in the nuchal ligament in the neck.

This is why we have a horse overpopulation problem

Apparently these people didn’t get the memo that just because it has the right parts then it gets to make foals.  Breedings should be planned.  Ideally one takes a look objectively at the mare and finds a stallion that has strengths where she has weaknesses and vice versa.  Ideally they are from similar equestrian sports that they both excel in.  I am not a huge fan of breeding them after they have a break down because I think ultimately we are breeding weaker horses if every time a horse goes lame they get regulated to the breeding shed.

This pairing though takes the why prize.  The Craigslist ad

Gorgeous foal born May 14th of this year. She is weaning and ready for a new home!! She is GRULLA out of a Grulla Quarter horse mare who has some amazing reining and cutting horses in her lines and a black friesian/thoroughbred stallion who has some amazing dressage and other sport horse lines. I am not a sporthorse person, so I am not familiar with them, however I have had several people help me do research on her sire’s side and found really nice horses! Athleticism at it’s best on BOTH sides of her family tree!
I call her Spitfire right now. She already exhibits nice athletic ability from running, jumping over fallen trees, to sitting on her hind end to spin around and go back in the other direction! She is currently being handled and exposed to lots of different things such as goats, chickens, dogs, cats, other horses, saddles on momma, kids, kids being loud, tractors, and anything else that we deal with on a daily basis. She halters, ties, and picks up all 4 feet. She will tie without momma next to her as well! Eating grain and hay well and we have started working on confidence away from momma. Leads very well, will jump over logs freely and when asked. Use to being pastured and drinks from our pond.

Contact me today!

All breed pedigree : http://www.allbreedpedigree.com/spitfire44

Feel free to contact me for more information, pictures, videos, etc.

I have been told to price her around 3000…but I am accepting reasonable offers! Feel free to come check her out and make an offer on her. Can’t hurt!

Let’s start with the mare.  Well she has some “amazing” reiners and cutters in her lineage but so far she hasn’t done anything but successfully gotten bred.  I checked her lineage there is nothing that amazing about it. Annas Silver Stage, this foals grand sire did some Barrel Racing and that horse’s sire JJaz Poco Golden Blue was successful in the reining but that was several generations back. I am related to John Smith, doesn’t mean I have done anything spectacular. There are some other minor players in there but again nothing amazing.  The mare physically doesn’t scream athlete to me either. Pictured below she needs some groceries but that isn’t going to change her weak hind end complete with a goose rump.  I can’t really comment on anything else as the picture is horrible.    So what about the sire.

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Sire is a Friesian/Thoroughbred cross that again does not appear to have done anything other than make babies.  I cannot find a performance record at all and it doesn’t appear they are marketing him as a stallion at all. But he does have “amazing” dressage bloodlines.  I can see why he hasn’t done anything.  He also is weak hipped, at least he doesn’t need groceries. I am thinking his short neck has more to do with his posture in this picture than how he is actually built but it could be that short.  He just isn’t screaming dressage prospect to me.  I wonder why he was bred?00s0s_5NM98PGnKiC_600x450

So my question is why?  Who in their right mind would blend these two horses together.  Reining/cutting horses share a lot of qualities with the dressage horses right?  Umm no.  Physically these horses are built for different things.  Their gaits tend to be very different.  So why are we mixing them.  Just throwing things in the pot and seeing what comes out?

The foal isn’t horrible, although it seems all of them cannot take a good photo to save their lives.  I just don’t get what the point was.  Most reining horses I know couldn’t jump their way out of a paper bag.  I do remember with fondness the first reining bred horse I was exposed to standing on the edge of a puddle contemplating jumping over it. Well he tried and he went straight up and then straight down right into the puddle.  Really funny but not jumping material at all, but boy could he slide to a stop.

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It would help if they would take a decent picture of her.  But of course they had to highlight her markings but no good conformation pictures.

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My main point is that indiscriminate breeding is running rampant in this country.  I am not against cross breeding but it needs to be done with a purpose.  Putting together two very different breed types doesn’t guarantee athleticism on both sides but it could lead very easily to a frankenhorse where none of the pieces fit together.

So who thought this was a good idea? What were their goals?  They obviously didn’t plan on keeping the result as she is for sale so why?   Was it proximity? Maybe the stallion lived at the same location as the mare.  Was it cost? Maybe the stallion had a minimal or free stud fee.  One thing is sure not a lot of thought went into it.  The availability of shipped semen should be increasing the quality of our horses not making random cross breeds.

Drama, Drama, Drama

Do you feel some people get off on drama?  I do, I think some people need it more than oxygen.  It is looking like Scamming Sophia found the COTH thread and posted a very interesting response.

From the thread (Fugly responses in red):

I have people on the Facebook pages, screen shooting EVERYTHING being said. I am only going to reply to the main things in this forum, and we will all be done with it. I have HARD evidence on my part, and I will be showing it in court.

Let’s start with “Voices for Horses.” A friend of mine and I were selling coffee, for a well known organic gold company. We were called by an agency, and explained what we were doing. They said we did NOT need a 501c, or whatever form it was, because we were not posing as a rescue. When anything sold, we only got the difference between the warehouse price and the price it was being sold as. Each box would have approximately a $5 difference. The seller of the coffee and I were working together to try to raise money for a local rescue. I NEVER posed as diamonds in the rough. I said that any proceeds we got, would go to a local rescue LIKE diamonds in the rough, as an EXAMPLE! We admit to misrepresenting where money was going to decieve people. We had a deadline on when we could sell the coffee through the company. We hit the deadline with absolutely no sales. I am as good at selling coffee as I am at training horses.  If we made any sales, we would have written a check to a rescue. Which one? We aren’t telling! I thought I was doing a good thing trying to raise money for a rescue, instead of keeping the money to ourselves. What money I thought you didn’t sell anything?! I deleted the page, because I was not going to deal with the drama.

I posted on a forum about how to help a “hot” horse. I was only asking the question, to see what people did. Shadow was never “hot.” He is one of the calmest Thoroughbreds I have ever known. I thought you were a trainer, surely you have dealt with this before. 

I decided to sell both my horses, due to my pregnancy. I knew I wouldn’t have the time to be with them. I also knew I wouldn’t physically be able to care for them. I had them appraised, and I asked for what the appraisal was. My board was coming to a close soon and winter was coming, so I dramatically lowered their prices hoping to find a good home for both of them, before I got to far in my pregnancy.

I never asked people to give me feed/hay. I asked where I could buy some, and the cheapest place to buy it.

Now let’s talk about Shadow, the Thoroughbred I bought in Chesapeake. He was a former Polo Pony, but was released due to height requirements. I was informed he did buck the original’s owner off. After bringing him to the barn I was at, I rode him. He did completely fine. I rode him almost everyday, my friend rode him, and my boyfriend at the time rode him. We never had him do anything wrong. I decided to lease him out, so I posted him on Craigslist. The leaser NEVER once complained about anything, but the leaser was caught (by multiple people) abusing Shadow. One day, the leaser brought her boyfriend out to ride Shadow. Her boyfriend made the decision to wear spurs, and he FELL off after Shadow made a sharp turn. Her boyfriend was NOT an experienced rider (Which he told us he was) and he wanted to canter. We all saw how that went, and he did not get hurt. It was RIDER ERROR! I was NOT the one who called the Police. My leaser called the police because she was “hit in the face” by a woman. I did not believe my leaser, and I was not going to get into the middle of it. I terminated her lease shortly after that day. If anyone else got bucked off riding, they were probably not suppose to be on Shadow. Another leaser I had would just run him, then put him away sweaty…so I terminated her lease as well. I had another leaser named A who told me she was a trainer. Pot, Kettle? I allowed her to ride Shadow, and she was caught by multiple witnesses doing things she wasn’t suppose to be doing. I asked her to stop, and she threatened me. Her lease was then terminated and I did get a protection order, because she threatened to harm me. Evidence proved so in court, and I won. No one ever mentioned ANYTHING about him bucking. Shadow was ridden by kids and beginners with no problems until I sold Shadow to a lady. She is learning how to ride on Shadow with a trainer by her side. She LOVES him and has her kids riding him too.

Now let’s move on to our current problem. I bought an Arabian in Suffolk in the beginning of July from a lady. The lady with no name! She told us her house caught on fire earlier, and she could not afford to keep Spirit. We PAID this lady, and Spirit was rightfully ours. He was in a SMALL pen, knee high in mud. He was severely underweight (we have photo evidence of the day we bought him). The person we bought him from was very emotional, and did not give us much background on him (besides he was beginner safe). After getting him off the trailer, we gave him a bath. He was completely covered in mud. That is when we found out he had an abscess blow out, and we called a farrier to work on it ASAP. We started riding him, and he was very good. I let my friend use him for trails, and she had no problems. We moved him to a barn in Suffolk. By this time, he had already gained over 100lbs and the abscess was already half way out. So you were riding him with the abscess half in? This barn was not a 24/7, so we had to stall him overnight. He was a little pushy when leading him into his stall, but other than that, he had no problems. He was still being ridden 3 times a week, to build his muscle. I decided to sell him in August, as I am pregnant, and being around horses is not the best idea. Where were the other two horses or is this a different pregnancy? I have screen shots of my original post, and it clearly says he is for an experienced individual because he is pushy around food and high strung/energetic. He never threw kicks, bucks, and he never bit anyone. I had a K.B message me about him, and I even told her he was pushy and high strung. She agreed to come out and test him. She rode, and the only thing he did was walk away from the mounting block. KB told my friend and I, that she was experienced and she grew up riding/being around horses. I made a payment plan with KB, which was reasonable. She signed a payment contract, and always talked so well about Spirit. I was contacted by a lady named J, claiming to be the original owner of Spirit. She told me she SOLD him to the person we bought him from with a no re-sale contract. I asked J to provide me this contract, and gave J several weeks (almost two months) to do so. She would always tell me she was out of town, busy, etc. J only came out to the barn twice, and still never brought any paperwork with her both time. I asked J to fax it or email it, and she still would not do so. I told J (more than 30 days in advance) that I was selling spirit, and I cannot do anything for her without her original contract. KB asked me to get J’s permission to sell Spirit. J gave me permission, and I even had a section in the contract for J to sign if she wished to. It was never signed by J, because she was ”out of town” again. I even noted in the contract that J had not given us any kind of proof that J was the original owner. K signed the contract knowing this. Between August and the End of September, KB only came out 3 times. We let her make a final payment, that was lower than the price we agreed on. Spirit was listed for $1000, but we allowed KB to pay $785, and we even trailered Spirit FREE of cost to the new location. KB saw us load Spirit with no problems, along with her husband and my husband. I agreed to give K a saddle set from the beginning, but I was not going to give up my nice saddle for free. So I bought K a consignment saddle. I had already given her a large discount on Spirit. Every time I asked K how Spirit was doing, I always got good feedback. On November 1, Spirit was moved without my knowledge. I found out he had moved by dropping off blankets to this new barn, and being told that was Spirit. I have a signed paper from the barn owner saying it was Spirit. My contract states K may not move Spirit without my knowledge. All she had to do is send me something saying that Spirit was moving. K gave me an excuse DAYS later, saying she sent me a text from a hotel phone in Puerto Rico. I have been VERY flexible with K at this point. I wasn’t going to reposes Spirit, or take K to court. Spirit had only gained about 50lbs since she has owned him. I thought you had already put all his weight back on.  You were riding him right? You wouldn’t ride a horse that needed weight or encourage that behavior would you? We went and visited Spirit in his field, and he did fine. On November 11, K texted me saying she was SELLING Spirit. I asked her why, and she told me that Spirit was dangerous (after knowing Spirit since August, and Owning Spirit since September). K NEVER once mentioned that Spirit was dangerous, and K even sent me photos of her daughter riding Spirit. I told K I would take Spirit back, but I was not providing her a refund (that is what the refund policy was in the contract). I told Karen she could sell Spirit (since she seems to only be out to get the money she paid, from what she told me), as long as it was to a good home and I knew who he was going to. I even told her I would find a buyer, and she told me I had two weeks to do so. On Wednesday the 12, K then told me she was going to sue me for selling Spirit under false pretenses and that I need to pay her, for her to drop the charges she made against me. She then demanded she was going to my husband’s command to tell them to take money out of his paycheck. I told K once more, to sell Spirit and I was done with her. He wasn’t my problem anymore. K has owned him for two months and now all of the sudden, he is dangerous. K constantly demands that I pay her, and then she will drop the charges. I told K to stop contacting me, but she continues to do so (asking for money). She is trying to charge me for slandering her name, but she is doing the exact same thing to me along with a bunch of other people.

I am just warning you that anything badly said about me with my name in it, is called Defamation of Character. Best defense to libel litigation is the truth. If this does not stop immediately, I WILL go to the magistrate. You guys have RUINED my name, company, and my husband’s name under false statements. Please get a freakin’ life, and leave me and my husband alone now. All you guys have is opinions that are not backed by any kind of evidence. Luckily, I have all the evidence I need. So stop this childish game, and go do something better.

This is the last of my words. No one will hear from me after this. I do not care what else people have to say. Only evidence knows the real truth. Good bye.  I am taking my toys and leaving!  

Another Sneaky “Trainer”

I think the horse world attracts con artists like manure attracts flies.  We seem to get our fair share in the horse world but maybe it is because we are all kind of living a fantasy and some people take it too far.  I mean if you really think about it a lot of people will never even get to pet a horse in their lifetime and we get to ride off into the sunset whenever we want.  Owning horses to most people is a fantasy and maybe that is why people lie, cheat and steal to get into our world.  I am  not saying there are not a lot of good, hard working people out there but we do have to watch whom we trust.

On to the con artist du jour.   Her name is Sophia Thomas, or Sophie Meese, or Jamie Meese depending on her mood I guess. And she has pissed a lot of people off in Virginia,  Apparently she has a knack for leasing horses and then selling them without permission.  She also takes this multiple names (personalities?) a little far as she has Facebook accounts for all three.

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Thanks to an email with screen shots as all three profiles have been taken down now. Or maybe she has made them unsearchable.

One thing is for sure she has reached the end of her scamming ways.  At least for now we all know they will pop up again like a bad pimple.  So lets squeeze this one all the way out so she will never work in the horse world again.

Some of her other highlights include pretending to be a rescue or working for a rescue and collecting funds that are supposed to go to that rescue.  Well they never make it to the rescue.  Are you surprised, me neither.  It appears she is trying to be the master of fraud.

Here is a warning from craigslist:

If you are selling are leasing horses on here use caution when dealing with a young woman using the following names.
Sophia Thomas
Sophie Meese
Jamie Meese
She misrepresents herself as a trainer.
She has been caught selling/ leasing other peoples horses without permission and grossly misrepresenting horses she has advertised. Details of her actions can be found on the Hampton Roads Horse Community Pages On Facebook. Copies of emails and messages have been turned over to a lawyer. This post is only to warn area owners and to protect the horses involved.

The Hampton Roads Horse Community does not want this on their page anymore so don’t muddy their waters with this smut.

While it seems there are many stories out there about this woman we are going to concentrate on the one involving the horse Spirit.

Spirit was giving to Sophia (I guess I will use her real name) by a woman named Angela. Angela had received the horse from the original owners whose name is Jean. It was a free or care lease. But this started out bad as you can’t sublease without permission from the owner.  Apparently Angela has flown the coop but personally she should be held liable as well.  Then Sophia put Spirit up for sale on craiglist.  There was a buyer who came to see Spirit,  liked him enough and put down a $360 deposit along with a signed contract.  In this contract it gave permission from Jean for Sophia to sell Spirit.  Problem is Jean never gave that permission.  Due to being injured the buyer wasn’t able to see Spirit as often as she intended this caused Sophia to want to void the contract.  The buyer promised to come up with the remaining money and the contract was fulfilled with the full purchase priced paid, $1000. At this time the new owner moved the horse to a new barn.  During his time with Sophia Spirit became very naughty though.  He probably wasn’t being fed enough and became very food aggressive causing the new owner to be kicked out of two barns. At this point the buyer tried to get her money back since the horse was misrepresented and get her money back.  Sophia refused to return her money.

While all this is going on the real owner of the horse, Jean, contacted the buyer.  Jean had no idea the horse had been sold and been told several times by Scamming Sophia that the horse was being leased.  The buyer is going to return Spirit to his owner and is suing SS for the money she paid for the horse.

From internet postings this is not the first time Sophia has attempted to pull this stunt. Hopefully this time she pulled it on the wrong person and will have criminal charges filed against her along with the civil ones.

People like this have no business being in our horse world.  But they better watch out.  We are a small world and we take care of each other.  Hopefully you all are remembering to google.  I couldn’t find any bad news on this person prior to this week but you hope she won’t be able to get the next victim as easily. Hopefully with as much backing and information that is out there about this person they will suffer some real consequences.  We will keep you updated.